The United States of America

[Glenn Ferrell]

...I would argue though that we did acknowledge Christ, albeit imperfectly and unfortunately not explicitly enough in the writing of our founding documents. What we have now is merely the shell of what was started and is as you say very pluralistic.

The closest thing we have to an acknowledgment of Christ in our federal founding documents is the words “in the year of our Lord.”

The British government from which we severed our connections was and remained more explicitly Christian, though Erastian and in rebellion because they did not adhere to their promises of the Solemn League and Covenant of 1643, than what we became.

The federal union did not reaffirm the Christian covenants of many of the original colonies.

I will concede neither the founders nor the American Presbyterian amenders of the WCF XXIII:iii might have envisioned the polyglot pluralism of their future. After all, some of the states had established churches, explicit Christian oaths and constitutions, and there existed an evangelical, mostly Reformed, Protestant consensus in the new nation. But, their intention was clearly a secular civil order.

However, without explicit constitutional and covenantal acknowledgment of Christ, we entered into a lesser (what Gary North called an apostate) “covenant” with a generic and non-descript higher power, but not the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. Now we reap the fruit of our connection.

Without an explicit covenant, we cannot claim to be a Christian nation, except in some general, historical, traditional, or cultural sense, nor hope to forgo the warning and judgment of Psalm 2:12a, “Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little.”

 

[Rich Koster]

I don't think there is such a thing as a "Christian" nation.

People are Christians. Nations aren't. That was one of the changes of the New Covenant.

That's right. I'm waiting for Jesus to return and set it up.

 

[Jen]

I think the idea that the founders were all deist is misplaced. Have you read Peter Marshall's "The Light and the Glory"? There is an excerpt in it from George Washington's prayer diary. He certainly was no deist! I thought I had that quote on my computer so I could insert it here, but it's gone. Paraphrased it went something like...' Oh Lord forgive me for the weak and imperfect performance of my duties of this week. I have prayed and read thy word, but with such deadness of spirit that my prayers stand in need of repentance . Forgive me and cover my sins under the blood of thy dear Son..." etc. ,etc.
Some founders may have been deist (Franklin?), but not George ,by george! From this book's perspective America was founded as a Christian nation. additionally I remember a quote from American history where patriots were sloganing "No King , but Jesus!". While the intent was not to set up a theorcy, the spirit was there

George Washington's own pastor never recognised the fruit in Washington that would mark him a Christian. He refused to partake of Communion, and, when called out on it, stopped attending church on the Sundays that they would take Communion. In 1787 he wrote to LaFayette that he indulges the professors of Christianity. And he was definitely a Freemason (a proud one at that -- his favourite portrait of himself was the one in which he wore his Masonic regalia), and Masonry espouses doctrines totally at odds with Christianity.

While I am sure that there are Christians amongst the Founders, the evidence does not suggest that Washington was one.

One of the more interesting chapels we had at Master's was done by one of the history professors about the religious beliefs of some of the Founding Fathers (a subject on which he wrote his Ph.D. dissertation). He argued that while they weren't necessarily strict deists, they were far from Christian, and they tended to use generic God-words rather than actually recognising the true God. He dubbed them theistic rationalists. They also believed that religion in general was a good idea because it gave people a moral foundation that without society would fall apart. This is the list he gave us:

John Adams

In his diary in February 1786, he stated that the deity of Christ and the atonement are absurdities.
In 1813, in a letter to Jefferson, he denied the Trinity.
In September of 1813, in a letter to Jefferson, he said that were he on Mt. Sinai with Moses, faced with the Shekinah with God and told by God Himself that the trinity is a true doctrine, he would affirm it only to save his life, but in his heart of hearts he would find it impossible to believe.
In December of 1813, in a letter to Jefferson, he stated that the Bible cannot supersede philosophy.
In 1814, in a letter to Jefferson, he wrote that the Fall is either allegorical or bad tradition.
In 1807, in a letter to Benjamin Rush, he wrote that he reveres the Bible insofar as it is a republican document.
In December of 1813, in a letter to Jefferson, he wrote that all of mankind will find salvation through works.
In 1820, he wrote to Samuel Miller that all good men are Christians.

Thomas Jefferson

In 1820, he wrote to Jared Sparks that the trinity is merely polytheism.
In 1821, he wrote to Thomas Pickering that the trinity is incomprehensible.
In 1822, he wrote to James Smith that the trinity is hocus-pocus phantasm.
In 1823, he wrote to John Adams that the virgin birth is like Greek myth.
In 1803, he wrote to Benjamin Rush that he likes Jesus’ doctrines, but denies his deity.
In 1787, he wrote to Peter Carr that the NT authors only pretended to inspiration.
In 1820, he wrote to William Short that Paul corrupted Christianity.
In 1814, he wrote to Miles King that salvation is universal — all paths lead to Heaven.
In 1813, he wrote to William Camby that works gain entrance to Heaven.

B. Franklin

In 1790, he wrote to F. Stiles that he has never studied the deity of Christ, but he doubts it, and soon enough he will find out for certain anyway, so he had no intention of doing so. He also wrote that he has never opposed any doctrines of any of the churches in Philadelphia, giving money to them all, and so that is enough.

George Washington
He never claimed Christianity.
On March 3, 1779, he was confronted by a group to profess Christianity — he refused.
He never took communion, and after being chastised for this from the pulpit, he ceased to attend church on Sacrament Sundays.
In 1787, he wrote to LaFayette that he indulges the professors of Christianity, that their road will get them to Heaven — he only ever wrote of Christianity in the third person.
In 20,000 documents of Washington’s, there is only one mention of Christ, and that not in his handwriting but his clerk’s (who wrote his speeches for him, and he often did mention Christ, but Washington crossed it out and replaced it with a generic God-term).
Isaac Potts, the man who was to have seen Washington on his knees in prayer in Valley Forge was no where near Valley Forge at that time (by his own admission) — this was a story created by Parson Weams, the man who wrote Washington’s hagiography.
Bishop White said there was never any evidence for Washington being a Christian.
The Reverend Samuel Miller asked how a Christian could never mention Christ or the hope within him.
George Washington was a proud Freemason — his favourite portrait of himself was of him in his masonic regalia. He laid the capstone of D.C. with a masonic trowel while wearing masonic regalia. He was the master of the Alexandrian Lodge. Freemasonry is not in any way, shape, or form compatible with Christianity — there is no way to be both.

The Declaration of Independence appeals to nature and reason and speaks in general and vague terms. The Constitution is godless (a complaint of the Anti-Federalists). The Convention never mentioned the Bible. The Federalist Papers used God-words.

John Adams’ and Thomas Jefferson’s primary religious influence was Joseph Priestly — who wrote a book about the corruptions of Christianity (i.e., the atonement, deity of Christ, etc.). When they did write of Jesus, they never called him Jesus Christ, but only ever Jesus of Nazareth — to emphasise his humanity and their lack of belief in his deity.

 

[Casey]

My own denomination teaches that the United States was never a Christian Nation.

Your denomination teaches this?

 

[Glenn Ferrell]

My own denomination teaches that the United States was never a Christian Nation.

Your denomination teaches this?

Look at the RPCNA Testimony, a parallel official commentary on the Westminster Standards, part of their constitution, especially that part parallel to WCF XXIII, on the civil magistrate.

http://reformedpresbyterian.org/assets/pdf/Constitution04.pdf

The RPCNA were Covenanters, successors to those who refused to be included in the restored Church of Scotland based upon something less than the reaffirmation of the National Covenant of 1638 and Solemn League and Covenant of 1643, which they saw as binding upon church and state. Many saw the War for Independence as just, against a covenant breaking king, but were disappointed with the new civil order.

 

[Hawaiian Puritan]

Hawaii was a Christian nation before it became part of the United States. From the first part of the first Constitution proclaimed by King Kamehameha III in 1840:

Kingdom of Hawai`i Constitution of 1840

DECLARATION OF RIGHTS, BOTH OF THE PEOPLE AND CHIEFS.

"God hath made of one blood all nations of men to dwell on the earth," in unity and blessedness. God has also bestowed certain rights alike on all men and all chiefs, and all people of all lands.

These are some of the rights which He has given alike to every man and every chief of correct deportment; life, limb, liberty, freedom from oppression; the earnings of his hands and the productions of his mind, not however to those who act in violation of laws.

God has also established government, and rule for the purpose of peace; but in making laws for the nation it is by no means proper to enact laws for the protection of the rulers only, without also providing protection for their subjects; neither is it proper to enact laws to enrich the chiefs only, without regard to enriching their subjects also, and hereafter there shall by no means be any laws enacted which are at variance with what is above expressed, neither shall any tax be assessed, nor any service or labor required of any man, in a manner which is at variance with the above sentiments.

PROTECTION FOR THE PEOPLE DECLARED.
The above sentiments are hereby published for the purpose of protecting alike, both the people and the chiefs of all these islands, while they maintain a correct deportment; that no chief may be able to oppress any subject, but that chiefs and people may enjoy the same protection, under one and the same law.

Protection is hereby secured to the persons of all the people, together with their lands, their building lots, and all their property, while they conform to the laws of the kingdom, and nothing whatever shall be taken from any individual except by express provision of the laws. Whatever chief shall act perseveringly in violation of this constitution, shall no longer remain a chief of the Hawaiian Islands, and the same shall be true of the Governors, officers,and all land agents.

But if any one who is deposed shall change his course, and regulate his conduct by law, it shall then be in the power of the chiefs to reinstate him in the place he occupied previous to his being deposed.

CONSTITUTION

It is our design to regulate our kingdom according to the above principles and thus seek the greatest prosperity both of all the chiefs and all of the people of these Hawaiian Islands. But we are aware that we cannot ourselves alone accomplish such an object--God must be our aid, for it is His province alone to give perfect protection and prosperity.--Wherefore we first present our supplication to HIM, that he will guide us to right measures and sustain us in our work.

It is therefore our fixed decree,

I. That no law shall be enacted which is at variance with the word of the Lord Jehovah, or at variance with the general spirit of His word. All laws of the Islands shall be in consistency with the general spirit of God's law.

II. All men of every religion shall be protected in worshipping Jehovah, and serving Him, according to their own understanding, but no man shall ever be punished for neglect of God unless he injures his neighbor, of bring evil on the kingdom.

III. The law shall give redress to every man who is injured by another without a fault of his own, and shall protect all men while the conduct properly, and shall punish all men who commit crime against the kingdom or against individuals, and no unequal law shall be passed for the benefit of one to the injury of another.

IV. No man shall be punished unless his crime be first made manifest, neither shall he be punished unless he be first brought to trail in the presence of his accusers, and they have met face to face, and the trail having been conducted according to law, and the crime made manifest in their presence, the punishment may be inflicted.

V. No man or chief shall be permitted to sit as judge of act on a jury to try his particular friend (or enemy), or one who is especially connected with him. Wherefore if any man be condemned or acquitted, and it shall afterwards be made to appear, that some one who tried him acted with partiality for the purpose of favoring his friend (or injuring his enemy), or for the purpose of enriching himself, then there shall be a new trial allowed before those who are impartial.

 

[ww]

Greetings:

Is the United States of America a Christian Nation from its conception? Is it "departing from its Christian roots?" or, Has it never been a Christian nation, and is simply following the Deist/Enlightenment thinking of the Founding Fathers?

Why, or, Why not?

My own denomination teaches that the United States was never a Christian Nation.

Blessings,

Rob

I would agree Rob that America was not and is not a Christian Nation. It was influenced in its founding by Christian and Scriptural principles however it is a pluralistic Nation and Society never intended to establish any one religion.

 

[Herald]

The consensus seems to be that the United States of America was not founded as, nor is this day, a Christian nation. I readily concur with that assessment. Thankfully, God has used this nation for righteousness sake in spite of its many sins. I thank God that He has raised up many faithful servants of the gospel from this nations founding until now. It is easy to point out the vile wickedness in our culture; and it does deserve to be exposed. But how often do we thank God for how He has used this nation?