Question:

[bwsmith]

On another discussion board, a poster stated, in debating RC-ism: “. . . we Evangelicals can paint a distortion of our own, namely that once one is saved, then obedience and thus, holiness is now optional, since we cannot lose our salvation.”

Am I missing something? Please tell me, do you know any prominent teachers or preachers who have said that holiness is “optional?”

 

[Ivan]

Please tell me, do you know any prominent teachers or preachers who have said that holiness is “optional?”

There may have been some among us, but they weren't of us, and they have departed from us. Once someone makes this claim they are no longer orthodox. The person stating this about us does not know what they are talking about. Just extremely poor logic....and heresy!

 

[bwsmith]

Thank you, I had no idea that the proposition was anything more than a smoke screen!

 

[VirginiaHuguenot]

There is a teaching popularized by Campus Crusade for Christ and others that says that one can be a Christian without necessarily having Christ as Lord, or without him sitting on the "throne of your life," hence one can be a "carnal Christian."

There is an article on the subject here.

 

[bwsmith]

Ah -- I am sorry to hear that expression -- carnal Christian.

What do you think about this pov?

. . . The carnal Christian is a fleshly Christian. Even though he became a new creature when he was saved (II Corinthians 5:17), he is still acting out fleshly patterns of behavior. He is like a car with God at the wheel, the power of Jesus Christ under the hood, the energy of the Holy Spirit in the tank, and the road map of the Bible on the dashboard. Still, he goes nowhere-or slips backward-because he is still stuck in the mud of sin.

A fleshly or carnal Christian is caught between two worlds. He believes Christ is real and genuinely believes in His sacrifice on the cross. Even so, he clings intentionally to his worldly ways. Though he is saved, he is still swayed by the drives and desires of his old nature.

For such believers, Paul prescribes a diet of milk. Spiritual milk provides the basic nourishment in the fundamentals of the faith. It does not equip an individual to view the world from a divine perspective. That's more like steak-hardly a suitable diet for an infant.

Keep in mind that Paul first visited Corinth in about 50 A.D. He preached to the Corinthians, witnessed their salvation, and fed them spiritual milk. About six years had passed and their diet of milk had not changed. Consider the human equivalent: if you were still pumping pablum down the throat of a five-year-old, you'd be long overdue for a visit to the doctor.

Just like an overgrown infant, a carnal Christian who fails to move toward maturity is a sick Christian, attempting to keep one foot planted in two mutually-exclusive worlds. This is more than just uncomfortable. It is impossible. . . ​

http://www.tonyevans.org/site/c.feIKLOOpGlF/b.2065685/k.593C/The_Carnal_Christian.htm

 

[Chris]

On another discussion board, a poster stated, in debating RC-ism: “. . . we Evangelicals can paint a distortion of our own, namely that once one is saved, then obedience and thus, holiness is now optional, since we cannot lose our salvation.”

Am I missing something? Please tell me, do you know any prominent teachers or preachers who have said that holiness is “optional?”

It *appears* that the speaker was admnitting that it was a distortion.

 

[bwsmith]

It *appears* that the speaker was admnitting that it was a distortion.

Yes -- but I just wonder where even the distortion comes from -- I have never heard holiness as "an option" -- though a few here have kindly pointed out some possible problems.

 

[Ivan]

Yes -- but I just wonder where even the distortion comes from -- I have never heard holiness as "an option" -- though a few here have kindly pointed out some possible problems.

From Spurgeon:

I believe the man who is not willing to submit to the electing love and sovereign grace of God, has great reason to question whether he is a Christian at all, for the spirit that kicks against that is the spirit of the devil, and the spirit of the unhumbled, unrenewed heart.

 

[bwsmith]

Thanks for the quote from CHS -- John had a good take:
"For everyone who does evil hates the light, and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed. But he who practices the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God." John 3:20-21

I don’t think Christians do evil, even though we stumble in sins – we don't want to stay stuck in them.