Lord's Supper Question

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Has anybody else never been to a church that used wine? Every church I've ever been to has used grape juice.
 
My present church uses grape juice; I think we would like to switch to wine but some things take time. Auburn Avenue uses wine in their service. That is where I attend when I go home.
 
Unfortunately, our church uses only grape-juice and does not offer a juice/wine split. It's one of the very few things that bugs me about my church, but it's certainly not a big enough issue to get bent out of shape about. I'm not sure that fermentation is necessary for the fruit of the vine to "count", but I desire it just because I know that's what the early church did, and also because I love wine anyway.
 
Wine and white grape juice. The wine is along the outside whereas the grape juice is in the center of the plate. Haven't been able to talk the deacons and elders in getting bottles of the good stuff. I think it's out of the box! :lol:
 
I have been to churches that use wine. I can think of an OPC church that used only wine. :banana:

The history of using grape juice is interesting and sad, especially for Reformed churches supposedly committed to the regulative principle. BTW, my church uses the juice.
 
I was listening to a sermon by Sinclair Ferguson and he said of John Murray, that his Christology was so high that he would not partake of communion if alcoholic wine were not used!
 
I've been to churches that use only grape juice and I've heard of churches that use only wine, but I've never heard of churches offering both. I'm curious why. Is it to accommodate those who have a conviction about drinking alcohol or maybe so that ex-alcoholics have an alternative to drinking alcohol or something? Anybody know why both are offered?
 
I'm sure it's to accommodate everybody's conscience on the issue. It's an easy way to avoid controversy, although it seems Christians have only had a problem with this issue for a little more than a century.
 
Speaking from my own experience, in the RPCNA wine in communion is frowned upon; however, provision has been made by the Synod for the practice of a split cup to allow those of different convictions to partake. Some have argued that having a split cup presents a bad testimony of divisiveness to the world, but others would rather be able to partake without violating their conscience. In my previous church, the practice was to have a split cup of non-alcoholic wine and grape juice. I personally don't see much difference between the two. I petitioned our session to allow the use of real wine (as well as grape juice) and the session was on the point of agreeing when it was brought to our attention that because the church meets at a public school, government policy forbade the bringing of alcoholic beverages on school property. So the practice was not changed. In my current denomination, the Presbyterian Reformed Church, the practice is to use wine only, which is a relief to my conscience on the matter.
 
When I go to my beach house we go to an Anglican Church which isnt really too anglican... It is a farming area so everyone is really grissly and down to earth. We have wine there but I cant stand wine so I often rush back to my seat feeling sick and wanting to spit it out or rinse my mouth out... Up here at University I go to a huge church of 2500 people and they have little cups of watered down juice which everyone gets. Imagine having to provide wine for all those people - especially if you had to use the same cup.
 
My church does split cup...I don't know exactly why we do that, but assume it's for those that are under age or think alcohol is evil.
 
Martin Luther, in his usual hyperbole, said that if people were going to change the elements, it would be better to abolish the sacrament altogether --- Jim West, Drinking With Calvin and Luther
 
And interestingly, he said that a baptism that was done with wine instead of water was still valid---as long as it was done "accidentally"
 
What about wine that is not from grapes?

I know of a VERY small (maybe 20 members), kinda older Baptist Church out in the sticks back home.

They don't belong to any association that I know of, but they strictly follow the 1689 confession, the RP, and are rather formal.

They teach spiritual presence and use only wine at communion, but the wine they use is made from blackberries.
I think they make it themselves.

After asking some older people around town I learned that almost all the churches there used blackberry wine "back in the day".

[Edited on 18-1-2005 by puriteen18]
 
Wine and white grape juice. The wine is along the outside whereas the grape juice is in the center of the plate. Haven't been able to talk the deacons and elders in getting bottles of the good stuff. I think it's out of the box!
Click to expand...

Explains my church as well!
 
Wine not made from grapes:

Interesting. The scriptures call "the cup", alternately, "the fruit of the vine". But that could be synechdochal to "wine" more generally. Are there any other wine-able fruits that come from vines?
 
Blackberries grow on vines. So do raspberries (raspberry wine), blueberries, and several other varieties. They are sometimes referred to as a berry bush, but they are actually vines.

From vines to wines.....interesting, huh?

Phillip
 
Man, my lack of horticultural knowledge was just displayed before the entire PB. I'm pretty humbled.

Maybe the next question is this: do we have any idea if these alternate vine-growing fruits were grown and wined in Palestine, then or now?
 
Would potatoes be considered to be part of "underground vines"? If so, vodka all the way for the Lord's Supper.
 
But then we'd have to prove that the "fruit" in "fruit of the vine", itself, doesn't necessarily mean "fruit" according to our westernized classifications of the plant kingdom, but rather something more abstract like "offspring" of vines.

Maybe D. Wilson will start opting for Vodka. Reformed, after all, is not enough. :bigsmile:
 
good try, a potato is root, not a fruit.

Can you imagine the visitor who wonders why you are having water with the Supper and then downs a shot of vodka.....HA - that would be a religious experience, he might even speak in tongues!

:p
 
The potato itself is a root!? That sounds like esprit d'annalyse western botany hegemony rather than common sense!?

If the potato is a root, then what does it nurture?

You've got root and you've got fruit, and that relationship seems like it should be pretty universal.
 
The potato is a tuber. It bears a bunch of useless leaves & stalks - useless, that is, except to the plant itself and to potato-bugs!
 
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