God Causing An "Early Death" for Disobedience, Etc.

[MauryM]

Good day, folks!

This is my first post, and I've enjoyed many threads here! This forum has been a wealth of information in so many ways. However, I would love to have you all weigh in on a question my wife and I seem to discuss frequently: God causing an "early death" for things like disobedience.

I believe God established our birth, when we will become regenerate, and when we will die. I read this throughout Scripture. But in His sovereignty, may He adjust His timing? Take, for example, the acclaimed apologist who had a ring of massage salons who died from cancer, Ananias and Sapphira, etc.

I have always considered this as God letting Pharaoh be Pharaoh, leveraging his sinfulness to accomplish His purposes, Joseph's brothers and their intentions working for God, etc. But, I've always had the ping in the back of my mind that wondered if sometimes He ends people "early," as it seems we find that in Scripture, as well.

I circle back to believing that the things God established in eternity past do not change for any reason, and any "early death" for whatever reason we see is not God responding to our actions, as that would undermine His sovereignty. Instead, it's just Him fulfilling His purposes, and Ananias and Sapphira were, from the foundations of the world, predetermined to die for their sinfulness when they did.

We would love to read your thoughts!

 

[davejonescue]

I think this might be a question that will forever live in the tension between Gods sovereignty and mans responsibility.

 

[TheInquirer]

Good day, folks!

This is my first post, and I've enjoyed many threads here! This forum has been a wealth of information in so many ways. However, I would love to have you all weigh in on a question my wife and I seem to discuss frequently: God causing an "early death" for things like disobedience.

I believe God established our birth, when we will become regenerate, and when we will die. I read this throughout Scripture. But in His sovereignty, may He adjust His timing? Take, for example, the acclaimed apologist who had a ring of massage salons who died from cancer, Ananias and Sapphira, etc.

I have always considered this as God letting Pharaoh be Pharaoh, leveraging his sinfulness to accomplish His purposes, Joseph's brothers and their intentions working for God, etc. But, I've always had the ping in the back of my mind that wondered if sometimes He ends people "early," as it seems we find that in Scripture, as well.

I circle back to believing that the things God established in eternity past do not change for any reason, and any "early death" for whatever reason we see is not God responding to our actions, as that would undermine His sovereignty. Instead, it's just Him fulfilling His purposes, and Ananias and Sapphira were, from the foundations of the world, predetermined to die for their sinfulness when they did.

We would love to read your thoughts!

Agree with your last paragraph. God’s plan is set from eternity past and He does not change His mind. He knew what Ananias and Saphira would do long before they did it and set the punishment for it long before it happened. God does not “adjust” to the actions of men because He knows their actions long before they do them. For Him, no death is “early,” its rather “right on schedule.”

 

[DanSSwing]

Agree with Jim. Also an "early" death would create ripple effects in the space-time continuum.

 

[MauryM]

Thanks for the input. We all seem to be in agreement.

Any other thoughts?

 

[Ed Walsh]

I think this might be a question that will forever live in the tension between Gods sovereignty and mans responsibility.

Here's a general rule to keep in mind in everything we do and think.

ed

Psalm 115:3 (KJV)
But our God is in the heavens: He hath done whatsoever he hath pleased.

 

[davejonescue]

The only reason I mention tension between Gods sovereignty and mans responsibility is because the Bible gives us situations where life can either be shortened or prolonged due to obedience. i.e. Prov. 9:10-11, Gal. 6:7, and Eph. 6:2-3. This would seem to indicate ignoring these things would/could produce a life less lengthy. Does God ultimately know and decree all events, yes; but to say that obedience is void in such outcomes, would also negate the believers responsibility to obey.

 

[alexanderjames]

I have always considered this as God letting Pharaoh be Pharaoh, leveraging his sinfulness circle back to believing that the things God established in eternity past do not change for any reason, and any "early death" for whatever reason we see is not God responding to our actions, as that would undermine His sovereignty. Instead, it's just Him fulfilling His purposes, and Ananias and Sapphira were, from the foundations of the world, predetermined to die for their sinfulness when they did.

God's ultimate counsel does not change, nor can it.. though it may seem to from our human perspective. I see God's response to human behaviour as being hand in hand with his predetermined will, so I am failing to understand the idea that they could be at odds.

I think it's completely fair to use the language of premature death because from our human perspective it is, and the Scriptures use such language - Ecclesaistes 7:17. And as you point out, there are plenty of examples of God putting to death people for their sin.

Obviously a premature death may not be for sin, and it is futile trying to guess why many of the saints are taken at such young ages in the brightness of their youth (I think of someone like the puritan Christopher Love). And then what about Enoch, who walked with God and was not, for God took him. Who can know the mind of the Lord, or discern His ways?

I don't know if this goes any way toward answering the question, but I thought I'd share these thoughts.

Agree with Jim. Also an "early" death would create ripple effects in the space-time continuum.

This sounds like something from doctor who!