Who's Reformed??

Discussion in 'Church History' started by thbslawson, Apr 21, 2012.

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  1. C. M. Sheffield

    C. M. Sheffield Puritan Board Junior

    I have always said that calling ones self 'Reformed Baptist' is not calling oneself 'Reformed.' In the term 'Reformed Baptist,' 'Reformed' is modifying the word Baptist. So in that sense, yes! It is absolutely accurate and truthful. Among all the different kinds of Baptists out there (Independent, Free Will, Seventh Day, Southern, etc.) we are the Baptists that adhere most closely to the cornerstone doctrines of the Reformation.
     
  2. Poimen

    Poimen Puritan Board Post-Graduate

    As I said I respect the fact that Baptists have a conviction but I don't respect the conviction particularly because of what it does to the body of Christ. And yes if my baptism is not accepted because it was administered to me as an infant by sprinkling this is excommunication (1 Corinthians 12:13) regardless of the motive or reason why (neither of which I was addressing in my post).

    On the other side of the issue I have heard a well-known Reformed Baptist say that infant baptism is "the golden calf of the Reformation." Perhaps you do not hold to that strong of a conviction regarding infant baptism but I know many that do. I could say that this person meant to find my motivations for holding to paedo-baptism but I think he was just stating what he believes.
     
  3. JP Wallace

    JP Wallace Puritan Board Sophomore

    Posted this a few days ago - still no answers,

    My intent is not to create division among Presbyterians and/or Continental Reformed folks but to show that there is a fair bit of flexibility given in relation to many practices and the doctrines and interpretations that lie behind such, to fellow Presbyterians that is apparently not extended to Covenantal Baptists.

    It must be said, that for many Reformed and Presbyterians (many, not all) the notation 'Reformed' is attached quite comfortably to sister congregations and denominations BECAUSE they baptise infants, (and because on paper they still adhere to a confessional standard while practically repudiating it) irrespective of various, many and wide other departures from the historic and confessional requirements of the name i.e the very issue which Mr. McMahon says means RB's are not R at all!

    For instance the question may be asked is the PCUSA Reformed? Are PCA churches with bands, choirs, special music, etc. etc. Reformed or not. Is the RCA (Kevin DeYoung) really reformed though it's position on homosexuality is to say the least up for grabs going by Kevin's not to distant past articles?

    If so how can this be given the departures that have taken place? How is still giving them this name not giving a) a great degree of laxity in connection with the historic practice and positions of their forefathers not afforded to Reformed Baptists b) a heavier weight to the practice of infant baptism than perhaps should be in light of these other departures?
     
  4. rbcbob

    rbcbob Puritan Board Graduate

    Let's give this a brief rest folks.
     
  5. rbcbob

    rbcbob Puritan Board Graduate

    I am trusting that we can resume this dialog over our understanding of "Reformed" while endeavoring to be charitable to all parties.
     
  6. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Puritan Board Junior

    QUOTE=C. M. Sheffield;944455]
    I have always said that calling ones self 'Reformed Baptist' is not calling oneself 'Reformed.' In the term 'Reformed Baptist,' 'Reformed' is modifying the word Baptist. So in that sense, yes! It is absolutely accurate and truthful. Among all the different kinds of Baptists out there (Independent, Free Will, Seventh Day, Southern, etc.) we are the Baptists that adhere most closely to the cornerstone doctrines of the Reformation.[/QUOTE]

    This gets at the issue and clarifies it in a helpful way. Many baptists object to being called protestant because they see it as baptists were not reforming from rome...they were always seperate from them. Some of those baptistic groups were not as solid biblically as we would like to see them be...and then we have the anabaptists.
    So....we are greatful to God for the reformers and the reformation.Yet we see believers baptism as biblical.Those who want to maintain strict historical boundries are not wrong,and yet those who identify with the particular baptists and the reformers also are a distinct group in our day.
    Biblical Presbyterians are defending their historic roots.Reformed Baptists ,other than looking to and claiming the Apostles as examples....have a more nuanced and contrversial historical trail to maneuver through. While we defend believers baptism historically, we can read John Knox against anabaptists and agree with most of what he wrote.
    Among baptists today as Pastor Sheffield points out here...there are marked differences. The term Reformed Baptist says alot very quickly and has a distinct identity. No one is trying to steal the label from the Christian Reformed churches or the Presbyterians.
    It is an accurate term for us.
     
  7. JM

    JM Puritan Board Professor

    Could one be a Presbyterian Baptist? (kidding)
     
  8. JP Wallace

    JP Wallace Puritan Board Sophomore

    Well that, like 'Reformed', depends on how one is using the word doesn't it? If Presbyterian is used in a limited and specialised (and arguably proper sense) as a description of church government where elders rule - then why not? Even if it is used where there are ascending/descending courts of authority in which local churches are represented, again, why not? In this sense Presbyterian is in contrast to congregationalism, erastianism etc.

    However, it has another well-defined use as well for through-going confessionalism of the Scottish type, which must include covenant baptism etc.

    Ultimately I'm not convinced church government 'model' is so closely connected to baptism mode as it often supposed.
     
  9. Beau Michel

    Beau Michel Puritan Board Freshman

    Originally the term had nothing to do with predestination,covenant theology,etc.It had to do with the Zwinglian(Reformed) view of the presence of Christ in communion.Those who denied the real physical presence were called Reformed in contradistinction to Lutherans(Evangelicals)who held to the real physical presence.
     
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