The ethic of leaving people alone versus trying to witness to strangers

[Damon Rambo]

Wow, my patriotism is being questioned?

I am living in a country right now where the Muslim call to prayer sounds 5 times a day, whether I want to hear it or not.

I am against anyone invading my personal space or my silence with any message, whether it be Muslims, Dominoes Pizza or a "Street Preacher" waving his bible at me from a lampost or trying to corner me on a bus.

You do not have a right to silence in the public arena. You encounter messages constantly throughout the day, but have learned to tune them out. Apparently the only ones that bother you, are your brothers and sisters proclaiming Christ.

If we do not show respect and politeness to strangers, what does this say about our message?

It says we care enough about them to give them a warning. It says "Hey, I don't care about the false, satanic, politically correct garbage. I want you to have life." Do you realize how ridiculous your argument sounds? People are dying and going to an eternity of torment, and you are more concerned about "Offeding" people?

How did Paul, Peter, and Stephen do it? Public proclamation. That is the Biblical method. To PREACH the gospel, not to set up booths, and try to trick the heathens into coming to you.

I believe there are ways to do street evangelism whereby people are free to approach us or not (setting up booths, etc) and we can maintain our respect for others even while being available to tell them of Jesus should they want to hear.

#1 The Biblical method is public preaching. You cannot give me one example, New Testament or Old, where the messenger worried about "offending" people with his message. #2 I think it is the epitome of disrespect, to worry so much about what others think, that you would allow them to go to hell rather than making them (or you) feel "uncomfortable" for a moment.

P.s., I get annoyed...am I, too, an enraged heathen?

I cannot answer this question. That is between you and God. However, the Bible is clear that the people of God rejoice when the Gospel is proclaimed. If someone is proclaiming the gospel rightly, and it annoys a person, I suggest they have a spiritual problem of some sort.

 

[Notthemama1984]

Sure. The first amendment. Our country was built on the idea of freedom of speech. The "Public sphere" is an avenue for the exchange of ideas. You have the right not to get annoyed in your home. Not on a Street Corner, by someone who is simply proclaiming their cause.

Abortion is legal also, but that does not mean we should partake of it.

Sure. You are seeing one now.

I am seeing people discuss how to be more effective in their evangelism. They are promoting evangelism, not resisting it. Have I missed something?

 

[Damon Rambo]

A SCENARIO:

If I were walking on a street in urban America, where crimes often occur, and I am approached by a total stranger who is VERY earnest about something, my first conclusion is that they are mentally ill or want to do me harm or they want something from me. If they begin to talk about my death ("If you died right now, where would you go?"...what, Wait?....why would I be dying right now)...that can be seen as very threatening. A natural response therefore, would be to want to punch that guy in the face and move on, in order to avoid the threat.

BUT, to most street evangelists, they are not being punched or threatened because they are annoying and irritating, but they get extra points for "sufffering for Jesus." and the guy on the street who responds out of alarm and threatens back or does not receive the message of the street preacher..well, he is not merely a decent man trying to get to work and not be hassled by a stranger or a possible freak..he becomes an "enraged heathen" or a "liberal" that "hates the truth".


I have been approached on the street by just such people. I did not welcome their message because I did not trust the messenger. They looked sort of crazy, actually.

This is why street preaching is so important. It gives people the chance to see that you are not some wild eyed, monster crier, nor someone wishing to do them harm. Yes, if you just ran up to someone throwing tracts at them, that might scare them. But I have never had anyone scared by my, or the groups I work with, approach.

 

[Notthemama1984]

How did Paul, Peter, and Stephen do it? Public proclamation. That is the Biblical method. To PREACH the gospel, not to set up booths, and try to trick the heathens into coming to you.

They preached in the synagogues where theological discussion occured. Can you show where they were standing on a street corner preaching?

 

[Damon Rambo]

Sure. The first amendment. Our country was built on the idea of freedom of speech. The "Public sphere" is an avenue for the exchange of ideas. You have the right not to get annoyed in your home. Not on a Street Corner, by someone who is simply proclaiming their cause.

Abortion is legal also, but that does not mean we should partake of it.

Right. Just as political correctness is legal, but we should not participate it. However, Gospel preaching in the public sphere is both legal, and biblical.

Sure. You are seeing one now.

I am seeing people discuss how to be more effective in their evangelism. They are promoting evangelism, not resisting it. Have I missed something?

People are resisting biblical methods, for modern man-invented methods, that remove a great deal of the offense of the cross.

 

[Notthemama1984]

People are resisting biblical methods, for modern man-invented methods, that remove a great deal of the offense of the cross.

So it is biblical to corner someone in the bus?

 

[Damon Rambo]

How did Paul, Peter, and Stephen do it? Public proclamation. That is the Biblical method. To PREACH the gospel, not to set up booths, and try to trick the heathens into coming to you.

They preached in the synagogues where theological discussion occured. Can you show where they were standing on a street corner preaching?

Are you serious? Yes, they went to the synagogue first, but then went to the streets. Too many examples to list, but...

Act 17:17 Therefore disputed he in the synagogue with the Jews, and with the devout persons, and in the market daily with them that met with him.

 

[Pergamum]

That is an unbiblical, and Un-American statement.

Can you explain the American part?

Sure. The first amendment. Our country was built on the idea of freedom of speech. The "Public sphere" is an avenue for the exchange of ideas. You have the right not to get annoyed in your home. Not on a Street Corner, by someone who is simply proclaiming their cause.

It SADDENS me, that evangelists today get as much resistance from (some so-called) Christians who have been brainwashed by modern politically correct, anti biblical beliefs, as from people who hate the Gospel.

Could you give examples?

Sure. You are seeing one now.

Your quote:

Sure. You are seeing one now

You are seeing one now?

That is classic. The street preacher gets all fired up. If people are annoyed..well, then they hate the Gospel. If their methods are questioned and more effective means are suggested, well, those naysayers just do not value evangelism.

I have seen it time and again.

Rather than accept the possibility that other means of evangelism might be more effective, many street evangelists come back with the other responses you have. Rather than a discussion of the best means, it becomes an issue of not loving the Gospel...etc....the naysayer becomes un-evangelistic and even now.... un-American.

 

[Damon Rambo]

People are resisting biblical methods, for modern man-invented methods, that remove a great deal of the offense of the cross.

So it is biblical to corner someone in the bus?

Define "corner"? If I start talking to them, and they say "Leave me alone," I move to someone else. If you are talking about preaching, how does it hurt anyone to stand up and give a quick 3 minute gospel presentation, and an exhortation to investigate these things? WHY are they bothered? Because of the message.

---------- Post added at 11:39 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:37 AM ----------

That is an unbiblical, and Un-American statement.

Can you explain the American part?

Sure. The first amendment. Our country was built on the idea of freedom of speech. The "Public sphere" is an avenue for the exchange of ideas. You have the right not to get annoyed in your home. Not on a Street Corner, by someone who is simply proclaiming their cause.

It SADDENS me, that evangelists today get as much resistance from (some so-called) Christians who have been brainwashed by modern politically correct, anti biblical beliefs, as from people who hate the Gospel.

Could you give examples?

Sure. You are seeing one now.

Your quote:

Sure. You are seeing one now

You are seeing one now?

That is classic. The street preacher gets all fired up. If people are annoyed..well, then they hate the Gospel. If their methods are questioned and more effective means are suggested, well, those naysayers just do not value evangelism.

I have seen it time and again.

Rather than accept the possibility that other means of evangelism might be more effective, many street evangelists come back with the other responses you have. Rather than a discussion of the best means, it becomes an issue of not loving the Gospel...etc....the naysayer becomes un-evangelistic and even now.... un-American.

Because the Bible is supposed to be our guide, not Rick Warren, seeker sensitive, WORLDLY "techniques." You are criticizing people for being Biblical in their approach instead of being "enlightened" like you. Sorry, but I'll do it the way Jesus said to do it i His Word, and leave the Rick Warren style to you...

 

[Notthemama1984]

Many street preachers, in contrast, seem to harangue passers-by on the street (i.e. not voluntarily wanting to hear). I just read the blog of one street evangelist that joked about doing evangelism on city buses and cornering folks in the back so that they could not "escape."

That is an unbiblical, and Un-American statement. People do not have the right "Not to be annoyed." That is just stupid.

This is what you responded to earlier, so at that point you seemed to have an idea of what cornering in the bus meant and you felt it was unbiblical and un-American to speak out against this cornerning.

 

[Pergamum]

Chicken evangelism versus Fish Evangelism:

The chicken only lies one egg at a time. It sits and then, after a long wait, it begins to cluck and dance and very visibly announces that egg for all who are around.

The fish, on the other hand, goes underwater and deeply lays many small eggs. No sound is made and this is not very public. But, hundreds of fish hatch.


Many Western methods of evangelism are very Chicken. I suspect that the chicken-style occurs sometimes among street evangelists. Very loud and showy, but usually not much lasting fruit. On the other hand, discipleship of those who are already deep friends, more slowly and thoroughly, and letting the Gospel spread along family and relational lines often is more quiet and fish-like...but I have seen this more effective.

That, of course, is not to say that mass evangelism or a public witness should not be done. But, it is far from the most effective method in many contexts, especially if targetting total strangers with no follow-up in an obstrusive way that offends the recipient.

 

[Notthemama1984]

Because the Bible is supposed to be our guide, not Rick Warren, seeker sensitive, WORLDLY "techniques." You are criticizing people for being Biblical in their approach instead of being "enlightened" like you. Sorry, but I'll do it the way Jesus said to do it i His Word, and leave the Rick Warren style to you...

I think you should really calm the tone. Perg is the farthest from Rick Warren. When the world has their kids watching TV, Perg is teaching his kids how to know if the water would have crocodiles in it. Why? Because he has forsaken the nice things of life for the sake of the Gospel.

 

[JML]

I am thankful that both of you have a zeal for evangelism. Damon, I am glad that you are not ashamed of the gospel and willing to preach it anywhere to anyone. Pergamum, your love of Christ has you living in a foreign land preaching the gospel to others. You both may disagree with the other's methods but I don't think we can question either one of you in your zeal for evangelism and your desire to see souls saved.

 

[Grillsy]

How is what Paul and Stephen did different than (biblical!) modern street evangelists?

Well Paul, for example, was duly called to his office. Many street evangelists, as they are called, are not. One cannot simply go out and call his or herself a preacher. Once again I have to point out that Stephen was brought before the High Priest before his famous exhortation. He was on trial so to speak. In Acts 6 we know that Stephen was going around performing miracles and wonders. This indicates a special status he held at a particular time in Church history. Again I submit that modern street preachers need not be compared to these men.

ARE enraged heathens who hate the gospel

As the Perginator already mentioned not all who are annoyed by street preaching tactics are heathens...some of us are right here on the Puritan Board.

Lastly Damon, since you love to bring up the first amendment, we actually do have a right to reasonable expectation of privacy.

 

[Pergamum]

Colossians 4:

Withal praying also for us, that God would open unto us a door of utterance, to speak the mystery of Christ, for which I am also in bonds:

4That I may make it manifest, as I ought to speak.

5Walk in wisdom toward them that are without, redeeming the time. Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that ye may know how ye ought to answer every man.

Much street preaching does not seem to fit in with Colossians 4 of walking in wisdom with unbelievers. Nor is the speech of many always seasoned with grace.


Some common scenarios:

-A street preacher shouting loudly at a corner or lamp-post where he knows many people must pass.

-Setting up in a subway and speaking loudly to a mass of people who are just trying to wait on their train and cannot really get out of earshot if they do not like the message.

-Cornering people on a bus, as one man bragged about.

-Positioning themselves in front of some big event, thereby forcing people to pass them unless they want to walk way out of their way to avoid the street preacher.

-Approaching strangers in an urban setting and trying to engage them while reaching into their pockets and looking very intent on the "target"



Some reasonable scenarios:

-Outdoor preaching where people voluntarily gather to hear preaching. City permits can be obtained.

-Passing out tracts at appropriate venues where this is accepted practice,

-Setting up a booth or a stand allowing people to come and dialogue if they so wish or to take literature.

-Public preaching or debate in those places where such things are common, such as the Areopagus or Hyde Park. Not the crowded crosswalk as folks are rushing to work.

 

[Damon Rambo]

How is what Paul and Stephen did different than (biblical!) modern street evangelists?

Well Paul, for example, was duly called to his office. Many street evangelists, as they are called, are not. One cannot simply go out and call his or herself a preacher.

[/quote]

That's fine. I am duly ordained and called by my Church. God calls preachers, though.

ARE enraged heathens who hate the gospel

As the Perginator already mentioned not all who are annoyed by street preaching tactics are heathens...some of us are right here on the Puritan Board.

Lastly Damon, since you love to bring up the first amendment, we actually do have a right to reasonable expectation of privacy.

Reasonable expectation of privacy applies to illegal search and seizure of one's person and belongings. It has absolutely nothing to do with the right of Public Proclamation. We are guaranteed the right to publicly proclaim our message, whatever that message might be.

---------- Post added at 12:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:03 PM ----------

Colossians 4:

Withal praying also for us, that God would open unto us a door of utterance, to speak the mystery of Christ, for which I am also in bonds:

4That I may make it manifest, as I ought to speak.

5Walk in wisdom toward them that are without, redeeming the time. Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that ye may know how ye ought to answer every man.

Much street preaching does not seem to fit in with Colossians 4 of walking in wisdom with unbelievers. Nor is the speech of many always seasoned with grace.


Some common scenarios:

-A street preacher shouting loudly at a corner or lamp-post where he knows many people must pass.

-Setting up in a subway and speaking loudly to a mass of people who are just trying to wait on their train and cannot really get out of earshot if they do not like the message.

-Cornering people on a bus, as one man bragged about.

-Positioning themselves in front of some big event, thereby forcing people to pass them unless they want to walk way out of their way to avoid the street preacher.

-Approaching strangers in an urban setting and trying to engage them while reaching into their pockets and looking very intent on the "target"



Some reasonable scenarios:

-Outdoor preaching where people voluntarily gather to hear preaching. City permits can be obtained.

-Passing out tracts at appropriate venues where this is accepted practice,

-Setting up a booth or a stand allowing people to come and dialogue if they so wish or to take literature.

-Public preaching or debate in those places where such things are common, such as the Areopagus or Hyde Park. Not the crowded crosswalk as folks are rushing to work.

Paul preached in the Market place, in a jail cell, and on a boat full of soldiers. That is about as crowded as one can get. There is simply no debating that Paul and the apostles preached WHENEVER and WHEREVER there were people.

 

[Grillsy]

Reasonable expectation of privacy applies to illegal search and seizure of one's person and belongings. It has absolutely nothing to do with the right of Public Proclamation. We are guaranteed the right to publicly proclaim our message, whatever that message might be.

You are right. I did not explain my thinking. I had in my mind door to door and loud bull horn style evangelism in mind when I mentioned privacy.

---------- Post added at 01:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:07 PM ----------

God calls preachers, though

My point exactly. Although I don't want to downplay any aspect of the external call.

---------- Post added at 01:10 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:08 PM ----------

Paul preached in the Market place. That is about as crowded as one can get. There is simply no debating that Paul and the apostles preached WHENEVER and WHEREVER there were people.

The market place was also a common place of public speaking and even debate in those days in addition to commerce. It is not like our malls today.

 

[Pergamum]

Damon,

I love your zeal. This is a discussion of best methods, not a discussion of whether or not we should be zealous. I would rather see thousands of yous than have folks NEVER want to engage anyone with the Gospel.

And YES Jesus did speak to the crowds. And they followed him. I don't see many people following after some of the street preachers I have seen, but I have seen a few cases of street evangelists hounding folks who are trying to avoid or walk away.

p.s., in some countries public preaching is VERY accepted and will gather willing crowds very easily. Especially if you are a foreigner or have white skin. If you ever get tired of street preaching in the States, this is an open invitation to come and set up and let people come and crowd around to hear you here. It WILL happen here. And if it happens still in US cities, that is great also (as long as they are voluntarily doing so).

---------- Post added at 06:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:11 PM ----------

Jails: There are accepted ways to arrange prison ministries. We should do more to take full advantage of these opportunities.

Boats: Many chaplains and missionaries have asked permission of the ship's captain and have set aside times and places for divine services.

 

[Damon Rambo]

Damon,

I love your zeal. This is a discussion of best methods, not a discussion of whether or not we should be zealous. I would rather see thousands of yous than have folks NEVER want to engage anyone with the Gospel.

And YES Jesus did speak to the crowds. And they followed him. I don't see many people following after some of the street preachers I have seen, but I have seen a few cases of street evangelists hounding folks who are trying to avoid or walk away.

p.s., in some countries public preaching is VERY accepted and will gather willing crowds very easily. Especially if you are a foreigner or have white skin. If you ever get tired of street preaching in the States, this is an open invitation to come and set up and let people come and crowd around to hear you here. It WILL happen here. And if it happens still in US cities, that is great also (as long as they are voluntarily doing so).

I have seen people, and know people, who have came to Christ through not only street preaching, but gospel tracts. God's Word is effective, regardless of method, because the power is in the message, through the Spirit, not in the method.

Thanks for the invitation. If the creek ever dries up here, I might take you up on that. I know some folks who are doing this in Jamaica.

 

[Pergamum]

Damon,

If we are to try to proclaim the Gospel whenever and wherever there are people, then what do you think of Fred Phelps as he pickets the funerals of gays? Do you think there are times and places that are more or less appropriate for such activities?

---------- Post added at 06:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:29 PM ----------

Damon,

Yes, God's Word is effective, but also I believe that God blesses good methodology and that we should critically examine all that we do and seek out the best methods:

Here is William Carey:

We are firmly persuaded that Paul might plant and Apollos water, in vain, in any part of the world, did not God give the increase. We are sure that only those ordained to eternal life will believe, and that God alone can add to the church such as shall be saved. Nevertheless we cannot but observe with admiration that Paul, the great champion for the glorious doctrine of free and sovereign grace, was the most conspicuous for his personal zeal in the word of persuading men to be reconciled to God. In this respect he is a noble example for our imitation. Our Lord intimated to those of His apostles who were fishermen, that he would make them fishers of men, intimating that in all weathers, and amidst every disappointment they were to aim at drawing men to the shores of eternal life. Solomon says: "He that winneth souls is wise," implying, no doubt, that the work of gaining over men to the side of God, was to be done by winning methods, and that it required the greatest wisdom to do it with success.

 

[Damon Rambo]

Damon,

If we are to try to proclaim the Gospel whenever and wherever there are people, then what do you think of Fred Phelps as he pickets the funerals of gays? Do you think there are times and places that are more or less appropriate for such activities?

This is hardly a good comparison. Fred Phelps does not preach the gospel. And we are not talking about a private funeral service, we are talking about a public sidewalk. Shouting "God hates F"'s" at people is not evangelizing.

Damon,

Yes, God's Word is effective, but also I believe that God blesses good methodology and that we should critically examine all that we do and seek out the best methods:

I agree. But we should not examine it against what is acceptable to the World, or even what "appears" to work (as we might only be producing "tares" with our modern techniques, which only appear to be wheat). "Good Methodology" is to be defined Biblically. What methods are used in the Bible?

#1 Public Proclamation: More than any other method
#2 One on One: Mostly with strangers, though.

So, yes, we should use good, Biblical methodology.

 

[Grillsy]

This is hardly a good comparison. Fred Phelps does not preach the gospel. And we are not talking about a private funeral service, we are talking about a public sidewalk. Shouting "God hates F"'s" at people is not evangelizing.

To be fair they stand on public property outside of the funeral home or funeral procession. You are right though, they are not preaching the Gospel. The free speech issue still stands.