Run ins with Satanic Temple, "Theistic" Satanism," etc. and its character

[Gwallard]

Hello, all,

The teen of a friend of mine would consider herself a Satanist. Of course, as is the way of many "Modern" Satanists she claims she does not believe in God nor in Satan. This feels as if it is becoming far more common, as the "Satanic Temple" continues to - apparently - capture the imagination of teenagers.

My question is this - have you all had run ins with Satanism of this type, who were they, and how would you characterize this type of Satanism. If you have seen "Theistic Satanists" who take Satan for God, then I would also like to know. But in the interest of helping my friend, I would most like to know how - besides prayer - to help teenagers in this modern popular filth.

My characterization of the Satanic Temple is as follows:
In short, if taken at face value, it is autonomous self-godhood. ("thyself is thy master")
In practicality, if taken actually, it is just industrial strength teenage atheistic activist angst taken as morality.
A mantra of morality, "F you, I won't do what you tell me" said to anyone but themselves, but practically said only to those against their feelings.

The "Hail Satan" podcast which this girl apparently listens to details this type of Satanism. I listened to one episode, unfortunately, which is an hour I will not be getting back.

Thank you for your help in advance. Any information you can give would be helpful.

 

[davejonescue]

I believe non-theistic Satanism would be what is known as LaVeyan Satanism, or, the Satanism made popular by Anton LaVey. While theistic Satanism would be known as Luciferianism. The former doesnt worship Satan as God, but instead uses Satan as a symbolic figure in embracing humans carnality as something to be celebrated. While the later holds Lucifer/Satan as a deity equal or greater than God/Jehovah. Not an expert on the issue, though. So I could be wrong. But Satanism based on the LaVey model views "sin" as the parts of human nature that should be embraced up to the point that they do not harm others. I think their motto is "do what thou will, and harm no one; this is the whole of the law." Luciferianism would be more like what many believe the Masonic Temple and such embrace (and is included in their writings) that is, Lucifer is the Light Bearer, and sought to give man freedom where God sought to enslave.

It is surprising to me that many Christians go through life understanding that there are a lot of Christians, but almost ignorantly unaware that many purposefully serve Satan, and feel he will be victorious in the end. You bring up the army of the Lord, yea, no doubt; but bring up the army of the Devil; now you are a conspiracy theorist? Doesnt make sense.

 

[J.L. Allen]

I believe non-theistic Satanism would be what is known as LaVeyan Satanism, or, the Satanism made popular by Anton LaVey. While theistic Satanism would be known as Luciferianism. The former doesnt worship Satan as God, but instead uses Satan as a symbolic figure in embracing humans carnality as something to be celebrated. While the later holds Lucifer/Satan as a deity equal or greater than God/Jehovah. Not an expert on the issue, though. So I could be wrong. But Satanism based on the LaVey model views "sin" as the parts of human nature that should be embraced up to the point that they do not harm others. I think their motto is "do what thou will, and harm no one; this is the whole of the law." Luciferianism would be more like what many believe the Masonic Temple and such embrace (and is included in their writings) that is, Lucifer is the Light Bearer, and sought to give man freedom where God sought to enslave.

It is surprising to me that many Christians go through life understanding that there are a lot of Christians, but almost ignorantly unaware that many purposefully serve Satan, and feel he will be victorious in the end. You bring up the army of the Lord, yea, no doubt; but bring up the army of the Devil; now you are a conspiracy theorist? Doesnt make sense.

I think you're right on here. I knew some Satanists of both stripes. Some started towards a spiritual Satanism and ended up in the LaVeyan camp. I've also known some who were curious about both camps but creeped out by it at the same time. Morbid curiosity, no doubt. Since Christianity is the great oppressive force in the world, these movements or curiosity about them is certainly a way of doing your part to resist such tyranny...at least, that's how they see it.

I might add that Wiccan and neo-pagan movements are very similar in mindset and outlook.

 

[davejonescue]

I think you're right on here. I knew some Satanists of both stripes. Some started towards a spiritual Satanism and ended up in the LaVeyan camp. I've also known some who were curious about both camps but creeped out by it at the same time. Morbid curiosity, no doubt. Since Christianity is the great oppressive force in the world, these movements or curiosity about them is certainly a way of doing your part to resist such tyranny...at least, that's how they see it.

Yes sir. And in my experience there is also a lot of cross-over between Satanism/Luciferianism and Wiccanism/Paganism/Witchcraft. Wish I had time to research it more, because there are a lot of people who follow such things.

 

[Recipient of Grace]

("thyself is thy master")

On a side note, that is grammatically incorrect. It would be either “Thou art thy master,” or “Thou art thine own master” (for so the phrase signifies).

 

[Gwallard]

On a side note, that is grammatically incorrect. It would be either “Thou art thy master,” or “Thou art thine own master” (for so the phrase signifies).

I agree, but this is a word-for-word slogan on one of their websites that I won't name because I don't want to give it traffic.

There's a lot of that kind of pseudo-intellectual stuff on Satanist websites, which makes it additionally grating. However, I wanted to be accurate to what they say.

I think you're right on here. I knew some Satanists of both stripes. Some started towards a spiritual Satanism and ended up in the LaVeyan camp. I've also known some who were curious about both camps but creeped out by it at the same time. Morbid curiosity, no doubt. Since Christianity is the great oppressive force in the world, these movements or curiosity about them is certainly a way of doing your part to resist such tyranny...at least, that's how they see it.

I might add that Wiccan and neo-pagan movements are very similar in mindset and outlook.

Can you give me your experience on their thoughts? It doesn't surprise me to see Satan worshippers (Luciferianism, I suppose), nor to see Satan admirers (LaVeyanism), but in the past neither was as outright as they are now. I suppose in the 1960's and 1970s there were more.
Still, I'm not surprised because all are anti-theists from birth in Adam, but I am especially wondering how to speak with such utter foolishness as this, as it is increasing all the more in our day.

I have had one long conversation with this girl, and she is utterly confused, but seems confident she is not. She claims autism and desires to be called a boy's name.

Honestly, it may be that things of this sort only go out by fasting and prayer - which I will now do! - but I want to help in any way, if possible.

 

[J.L. Allen]

I agree, but this is a word-for-word slogan on one of their websites that I won't name because I don't want to give it traffic.

There's a lot of that kind of pseudo-intellectual stuff on Satanist websites, which makes it additionally grating. However, I wanted to be accurate to what they say.

Can you give me your experience on their thoughts? It doesn't surprise me to see Satan worshippers (Luciferianism, I suppose), nor to see Satan admirers (LaVeyanism), but in the past neither was as outright as they are now. I suppose in the 1960's and 1970s there were more.
Still, I'm not surprised because all are anti-theists from birth in Adam, but I am especially wondering how to speak with such utter foolishness as this, as it is increasing all the more in our day.

I have had one long conversation with this girl, and she is utterly confused, but seems confident she is not. She claims autism and desires to be called a boy's name.

Honestly, it may be that things of this sort only go out by fasting and prayer - which I will now do! - but I want to help in any way, if possible.

To be honest, I was an unbeliever during most of those interactions. I wasn't as outwardly hostile as those I knew dabbling in Satanism, but I needed the gospel just as much as them.

That said, I think it's the desperation of many as they look for answers anywhere but the true and living God, along with their negative experiences with Christians or Christianity that brings people like this girl to the place they are in.

These people have been sold a bill of goods that giving into their lusts and outright denying Christ will give them only what Christ can actually give. Don't get me wrong, they have the temporary affirmation that sin tends to bring. If sinning only ever hurt, people wouldn't be so quick to do it. However, that's just it: sinning feels good for a season. The problem that this young lady is facing is that the seasons change and she must find the next season, experiencing the pleasures and preparing to run from the subsequent pain. She feels important right now. She feels valued. She feels freedom and her longings touched momentarily. That's exhilarating. She thinks she's feeling the raptures of ecstasy. Inevitably, this means that she has a target in mind to seek after when reality comes crashing back in upon her.

Prayer and fasting is exactly what must be done. She must be driven away from these demons as much as the demons must be driven from her. It's quite possible that that is the literal situation, too.

 

[jwright82]

I agree, but this is a word-for-word slogan on one of their websites that I won't name because I don't want to give it traffic.

There's a lot of that kind of pseudo-intellectual stuff on Satanist websites, which makes it additionally grating. However, I wanted to be accurate to what they say.

Can you give me your experience on their thoughts? It doesn't surprise me to see Satan worshippers (Luciferianism, I suppose), nor to see Satan admirers (LaVeyanism), but in the past neither was as outright as they are now. I suppose in the 1960's and 1970s there were more.
Still, I'm not surprised because all are anti-theists from birth in Adam, but I am especially wondering how to speak with such utter foolishness as this, as it is increasing all the more in our day.

I have had one long conversation with this girl, and she is utterly confused, but seems confident she is not. She claims autism and desires to be called a boy's name.

Honestly, it may be that things of this sort only go out by fasting and prayer - which I will now do! - but I want to help in any way, if possible.

I'm not surprised she claims some mental illness, that's quite popular today amongst people (especially teenager's but unfortunately adults as well). Autism, OCD, and other mental illnesses (the strangest and most easy to disprove is multiple personalities, or whatever they call it nowadays).
I'm not a mental health professional so take what I say with that in mind. But as far as where it's coming from, I can't say I've noticed an increase in satanists since I first encountered one as a teenager myself. They're usually just lost and/or rebellious of the status quo.
Whatever happened post-satanic scare of the 80's I believe seems like it could be a response in some sense to that sort of thinking. What I mean is people my age might remember our parents flipping out about it but don't remember particulars but I highly doubt teenagers today are even aware of it. Just aware it ruffles feathers.
But the general uneasiness that even unbelievers have at just the mention of the devil leads me to believe they may not believe per se but they are still cautious. That's why atheistic satanism is I believe more popular.
I still would probably just say it's a cry for attention. But it's her soul that she's playing with and that's dangerous. But also remember that we live in an age of social media where everyone gets their 15 seconds of fame. Most teenagers I deal with fortunately don't talk that way but it's an underlying current.
I never really took to social media outside this website, if it counts. So take my opinion on it with a grain of salt. I'm more of a face to face kinda guy. But I recognize the benefits of it as well. I guess my main point is this is just a complicated stream within the tide of modern social media life where anyone can be anything. I believe a postmodern philosopher called it the simulacrum back in the 80's. Hyper-reality if you will.
But this poor girl is playing with her soul, and others like her, but I don't think it's really on the rise. Just my two cents.

 

[TheBoringBaptist]

Hello, all,

The teen of a friend of mine would consider herself a Satanist. Of course, as is the way of many "Modern" Satanists she claims she does not believe in God nor in Satan. This feels as if it is becoming far more common, as the "Satanic Temple" continues to - apparently - capture the imagination of teenagers.

My question is this - have you all had run ins with Satanism of this type, who were they, and how would you characterize this type of Satanism. If you have seen "Theistic Satanists" who take Satan for God, then I would also like to know. But in the interest of helping my friend, I would most like to know how - besides prayer - to help teenagers in this modern popular filth.

My characterization of the Satanic Temple is as follows:
In short, if taken at face value, it is autonomous self-godhood. ("thyself is thy master")
In practicality, if taken actually, it is just industrial strength teenage atheistic activist angst taken as morality.
A mantra of morality, "F you, I won't do what you tell me" said to anyone but themselves, but practically said only to those against their feelings.

The "Hail Satan" podcast which this girl apparently listens to details this type of Satanism. I listened to one episode, unfortunately, which is an hour I will not be getting back.

Thank you for your help in advance. Any information you can give would be helpful.

I think others have answered this question more than I can. All I will say is that although I have never encountered a Satanist of any "flavor" in my young life in person, from what I can glean from research, Satanists filing suits during certain times, and some Christian youtubers who make some small remarks about them is that Satanists are mostly a large group of atheists(particularly New Atheists) who want to "troll" Christians for the most part. I say this because Satanists have even found ways to put up "Satan clubs" in schools in different places. I think they're atheists for the most part, they do this in order to show the "absurdity" of religion(particularly the Christian religion). They want religion away from the public sphere, so they pull these stunts in order to "convince" people that religion is absurd.

Sources: https://www.gotquestions.org/satanism.html

What is Luciferianism? | GotQuestions.org

What is Luciferianism? Why would people worship Lucifer knowing that he is inferior to God? Is Luciferianism the same as Satanism?

www.gotquestions.org

Uproar as after-school Satan club forms at Tennessee elementary school

Satanic clubs, whose members do not worship the devil, usually formed in response to presence of religious groups in schools

www.theguardian.com

https://thehill.com/homenews/education/3990175-after-school-satan-clubs-gain-popularity-amid-legal-victories/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/After_School_Satan (I know wiki is not a good source, but it gives the general gist of this)

How ‘After School Satan Club’ Is Shaking Things Up

A Memphis school says it can’t bar a club sponsored by The Satanic Temple, which has been stirring fury with First Amendment challenges and public displays, including one in Iowa that was vandalized.

www.nytimes.com

Satanists are pushing for representation in schools

The 'After School Satan Club' has been igniting controversy in recent months

theweek.com

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/an-after-school-satan-club-could-be-coming-to-your-kids-elementary-school/2016/07/30/63f485e6-5427-11e6-88eb-7dda4e2f2aec_story.html

(Mike Winger video; first time stamp is about Satanism)

(Another Winger video talking about the 7 tenets)

PS - I provide these sources as helpful material for the current topic only.

 

[Speustais]

I agree that there are likely very many trolls around, but (certainly here in the UK) there are also visible signs of serious occult activity being widespread and sadly normalised. There are whole tourist areas practically given over to it. I know that’s anecdotal but basically every (especially seaside resort) town bookstore has a “spirituality” section dedicated to the stuff for example.

 

[michael_topple]

I agree that there are likely very many trolls around, but (certainly here in the UK) there are also visible signs of serious occult activity being widespread and sadly normalised. There are whole tourist areas practically given over to it. I know that’s anecdotal but basically every (especially seaside resort) town bookstore has a “spirituality” section dedicated to the stuff for example.

Yes, absolutely. And many Scottish towns have their own occult book/object shop too. Ichabod!

 

[Gwallard]

I agree that there are likely very many trolls around, but (certainly here in the UK) there are also visible signs of serious occult activity being widespread and sadly normalised. There are whole tourist areas practically given over to it. I know that’s anecdotal but basically every (especially seaside resort) town bookstore has a “spirituality” section dedicated to the stuff for example.

Trolling seems to be their joy in life, just like adolescent boys. It is their type of activism.

But yes, the more trendy the place, the more occult the books here in the U.S. as well - although exclusively in liberal towns and most college towns. Boulder, CO was something - one book store had a "religion" shelf with a few Christian books, but a whole wing dedicated to occult. It was something.

 

[J.L. Allen]

I think others have answered this question more than I can. All I will say is that although I have never encountered a Satanist of any "flavor" in my young life in person, from what I can glean from research, Satanists filing suits during certain times, and some Christian youtubers who make some small remarks about them is that Satanists are mostly a large group of atheists(particularly New Atheists) who want to "troll" Christians for the most part. I say this because Satanists have even found ways to put up "Satan clubs" in schools in different places. I think they're atheists for the most part, they do this in order to show the "absurdity" of religion(particularly the Christian religion). They want religion away from the public sphere, so they pull these stunts in order to "convince" people that religion is absurd.

Sources: https://www.gotquestions.org/satanism.html

What is Luciferianism? | GotQuestions.org

What is Luciferianism? Why would people worship Lucifer knowing that he is inferior to God? Is Luciferianism the same as Satanism?

www.gotquestions.org

Uproar as after-school Satan club forms at Tennessee elementary school

Satanic clubs, whose members do not worship the devil, usually formed in response to presence of religious groups in schools

www.theguardian.com

https://thehill.com/homenews/education/3990175-after-school-satan-clubs-gain-popularity-amid-legal-victories/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/After_School_Satan (I know wiki is not a good source, but it gives the general gist of this)

How ‘After School Satan Club’ Is Shaking Things Up

A Memphis school says it can’t bar a club sponsored by The Satanic Temple, which has been stirring fury with First Amendment challenges and public displays, including one in Iowa that was vandalized.

www.nytimes.com

Satanists are pushing for representation in schools

The 'After School Satan Club' has been igniting controversy in recent months

theweek.com

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/an-after-school-satan-club-could-be-coming-to-your-kids-elementary-school/2016/07/30/63f485e6-5427-11e6-88eb-7dda4e2f2aec_story.html

(Mike Winger video; first time stamp is about Satanism)

(Another Winger video talking about the 7 tenets)

PS - I provide these sources as helpful material for the current topic only.

I'm watching the first Mike Winger video and can't believe that the biggest secrets we learned in seminary and now keep are coming out... Oh no!!!

Sometimes the level of willful foolishness makes your head spin. Granted, when God blinds you by giving you over to your sinful desires, there's no telling how deep the self-deception goes.

 

[J.L. Allen]

Also, the Satanist video that he's responding to is painful to my soul. May the Lord bring to an end the efforts of the wicked ones who produced it.

 

[TheBoringBaptist]

I'm watching the first Mike Winger video and can't believe that the biggest secrets we learned in seminary and now keep are coming out... Oh no!!!

Sometimes the level of willful foolishness makes your head spin. Granted, when God blinds you by giving you over to your sinful desires, there's no telling how deep the self-deception goes.

Also, the Satanist video that he's responding to is painful to my soul. May the Lord bring to an end the efforts of the wicked ones who produced it.

Amen. May the Lord do so.