[moderator tone on] Firstly, let's not allow this thread to get into a defensive, overly-sensitive, mud-slinging, ad hominemeric debate. If you're "tired" of seeing this discussed, don't read the thread. Stay out. If you're "miffed" with someone, please u2u them, as opposed to making it personal in the thread. If you have nothing of critical value to say, or if it's just sarcasm, please refrain from posting. Thanks [moderator tone off]
Back in September of 2004, Patrick said this:
I would like to see this rehashed with the ideal of coming to an agreement, which may not happen, but it would be nice to discuss these things in the realm of Christian brotherhood and unity.
I think we should begin with this particular request of Patrick:
What do you folks (that is, ones who are interested in being better honed in the subject) think?
Back in September of 2004, Patrick said this:
Well, hopefully you all aren't tired of this subject yet. I love to build a substantial unity, especially regarding the worship of God. So maybe we can change the thread a little and start from square one, and turn this into a Reformed Think Tank regarding song in worship. It seems to me that many of the arguments for either side have been dispersed throughout the thread and can be hard to follow. So let's try to peice it all together.
I think of primary importance here is how we build a hermenuetic to establish our covenant songs. It is this hermenuetic which really in the end undergirds our understanding of Paul in Eph and Col. We all admit that God institutes His worship. That is well and good. The non-EP advocates are right in that the book of Psalms did not always exist. There were no Psalms before Moses, at least none that were recorded so to say "the Psalms have always been the songs of God's covenant people" is simply not true, or at least not verifiable. The thing we must keep in mind is that the worship of God developed over time along with redemptive history. And we can only build on what God has revealed to us. It's just like covenant theology. We do not see a specific command to baptize children in the NT, nor a command to forbid it, yet we come to the conclusion with a hermeneutic based on previous revelation in the OT, that children were always included in the covenant before, and we have no indication that this has changed, rather inferential evidence that it remains. But this inferential evidence can only be understood with a correct hermenuetic.
I think we must apply this approach when discussing the issue of song in worship. There are not enough specifics to simply say "this is how it is." We must first build a hermeneutic. We can understand the mind of the apostle's regarding children in the covenant because of the redemptive historical context in which they were raised from the OT, and from what they learned from Christ and the Spirit. So now, let us build a hermenuetic to understand song in worship, so that we may better understand the mind of Paul when Eph. and Col. were written under the inspiration of the Spirit. We have no specific command either way for EP or non-EP unless the hermenuetic we use to interpret Paul is sound. Either way, Paul gives a command regarding song in worship. So we had better pay attention to it. The sins of Uzzah, Aaron's sons, and Uzziah should be burned into our mind when approaching this subject. So then, let us work on a hermenuetic to build a case for covenant song. I will try in a little while to present my hermeneutic case for EP in a bit. If someone could do that for the non-EP advocates that would be greatly appreciated.
And just a couple of side notes that I noticed during the thread so far. Mention has been made of Ian Murray's booklet on hymnody. Though he does give some good ideas to consider he fails to interact with the WCF or the Westminster liturgy. He is certainly right that some Puritans dissented from the EP position, but the Westminster Divines as a whole decided on EP and confessionalized it in the WCF and the liturgy. Murray doesn't take that into account in his historical argument against Psalmody. Now, perhaps he's working on a more comprehensive study of the issue but I thought I would just bring this up so that no one invests too much weight into his arguments yet. And I would also say the same for Bushell and Williamson. They do not address some of the issues raised here on the Board, so in some sense, we are really pioneers on this particular issue in worship.
So, again, if you're tired of the issue for now, then we can pick it up later. I also am strapped for time. But the issue of God's worship has always been an important study for me in my Reforming journey, especially since I was rescued from the sinking sands of charasmania. I'd like to help others like myself get some rocks to build on regarding this subject.
I would like to see this rehashed with the ideal of coming to an agreement, which may not happen, but it would be nice to discuss these things in the realm of Christian brotherhood and unity.
I think we should begin with this particular request of Patrick:
I will try in a little while to present my hermeneutic case for EP in a bit. If someone could do that for the non-EP advocates that would be greatly appreciated.
What do you folks (that is, ones who are interested in being better honed in the subject) think?