Para Church Ministries?

[Deleted member 7239]

How would a confessional believer view "parachurch ministries" such as Young Life, Cru, etc. Although not usually Reformed-- these organizations do reach the unchurched with the message of the Gospel-- are they competing with the church or aiding in the mission of the church?

 

[Scott Bushey]

Hi Jesse,
I believe many here on PB would not be against para-church. in my opinion, I do not like a ministry that does not have an overseeing, governing body. So, if it has a governing body and is not independent of one, I guess I would be ok with it. If it is independent, no. You will notice that most PCM's are credo-baptist.

Are they aiding the church? Does a biblical church need help?

 

[Joshua]

Has the King ordered His Kingdom, or left it to the inventions and accretions of men?

In the last chapter of Matthew we see the delegation of authority. "All power is given unto me [Christ] in heaven and in earth. Go ye [the Apostles, and by extension, ministers and elders thereafter], therefore . . ." What did Christ purchase by His incarnation, perfection of obedience, death, and resurrection? Amongst other things, this authority in meting out His Kingdom. In Acts 1, we read:

The former treatise have I made, O Theophilus, of all that Jesus began both to do and teach, until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen: to whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God.
​

We see this practiced and worked out throughout the book of Acts, wherein the Apostles -as directed by Christ- ordain and vet men to the ministry, and said men are brought under authority. Authority of whom? Christ, as the King of His Kingdom, under the authority of His apostles, and subsequently elders, etc. with presbyterial commissions, meetings, and accounts.

What are the gifts given to men by the work of Christ? Ephesians 4 is clear:

Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men. (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth? He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.) And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; for the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ
​

Christ has ordered His Kingdom, as King of His Kingdom. The Ministry is under the auspices of His Kingdom, the Church. The Ministry of Reconciliation properly was given to the Apostles, and subsequently pastors and elders. The ministry of service (in its official capacity), to the diaconate. The service of brothers and sisters in the visible church one to another, not as office-bearing duties, but expressions of the [super]natural affection that we ought to have in our obedience to God by serving men (the 2nd table of the law).

Parachurch "ministries" are no such "ministry" authorized by Christ. They are -regardless of good intentions- by default, competitors, and the King brooks no competitors. They are those who run, but are not sent. They are not under authority and have no consequential accountability. The King orders His Kingdom. He knows how best to build it. Let us lay our wills, talents, treasures, and good intentions at His feet, seeking obedience to His commandments, and leave the secret things to Him.

 

[Deleted member 7239]

I appreciate helping me think through this. Your thoughts on this example:

A Christian rescue mission for homeless men which takes men in overnight and they hear the word preached by ordained ministers.

Would you agree with this as long as those who are preaching are ordained? I guess this caveat would apply to any parachurch-- having ordained men overseeing it? Thoughts?

 

[BGF]

Joshua, I agree with your answer. I wonder though, how would you answer possible objections that use the following parallel accounts?

John said to him, “Teacher, we saw someone casting out demons in your name, and we tried to stop him, because he was not following us.” But Jesus said, “Do not stop him, for no one who does a mighty work in my name will be able soon afterward to speak evil of me. For the one who is not against us is for us. For truly, I say to you, whoever gives you a cup of water to drink because you belong to Christ will by no means lose his reward.
Mark 9:38-41

John answered, “Master, we saw someone casting out demons in your name, and we tried to stop him, because he does not follow with us.” But Jesus said to him, “Do not stop him, for the one who is not against you is for you.”
Luke 9:49 & 50

Assuming that the objector sees these passages as justification for ministry apart from the church.

 

[Dachaser]

Hi Jesse,
I believe many here on PB would not be against para-church. in my opinion, I do not like a ministry that does not have an overseeing, governing body. So, if it has a governing body and is not independent of one, I guess I would be ok with it. If it is independent, no. You will notice that most PCM's are credo-baptist.

Are they aiding the church? Does a biblical church need help?

I think that they do a valid ministry with the Body of Christ, as while they do not directly compete with the local churches, they can assist them in reaching out and maturing the Christians.
Also, would prefer them to from either a Reformed or a Calvinist perspective on their doctrines.

 

[KeithW]

...are they competing with the church or aiding in the mission of the church?

This should be answered based on a particular parachurch organization, not by lumping every one of them together as a whole.

By "church" I assume you mean the visible church usually characterized as a local assembly which meets in a building, has a pastor, has elders, members, etc. The local church often cannot do (or does not do) every last bit of "the mission of the church". Now what? And who is doing this extra work?

And what do you mean by "competing"? If a parachurch organization is undermining the Gospel of Jesus Christ by preaching something else and doing it while using the name Christian then yes it is a bad thing. If a parachurch is drawing people away from the local church then it is a bad thing. I have specific examples of these in mind.

I heard one parachurch ministry (which I follow) recently explain their governance. They have a board of directors unto whom every member is accountable. No one can be a member of the ministry unless they are a churchman first and foremost -- unless they are a member of a local church, in good standing, attend regularly, not under discipline, and under the authority of the local church. The work of this ministry is to take the Gospel of Jesus Christ, and Reformed theology, to non-Christian groups, and to point them to the local church. So in this case like minded Christians from many different churches are involved in a particular ministry which no one particular church can do. Are they competing with the "church"?

A Christian rescue mission for homeless men which takes men in overnight and they hear the word preached by ordained ministers.

Are they competing with the local church who is also giving the homeless a place to sleep? Too much help is being given?! I assume this happens every night. Does the local church preach every night so this ministry is competing with them in this regard? Are they directing people to the local church or drawing them away from the local church? Are the Christians involved in this ministry members of local churches?

Another example. There is a worldwide non-denominational Bible study organization which has meetings in my city. Groups meet midweek and are open to Christians from all Christian denominations. If my local church is so small that it does not have a permanent building (they don't), nor have the means to teach Scripture midweek (they don't), should I not go to this parachurch organization because they are "competing" with "the church"? (In all honesty I don't go to that one, I go to a midweek Bible study in a church of a different non-Reformed denomination. They have the means to perform this benefit for Christians.)

These are examples of considering the practical working out of "the mission of the church". Evaluate what different parachurch organizations are doing. Don't let "theology" prevent work being done which the local church cannot, or is not doing.

 

[Scott Bushey]

I guess my issue rests in the idea that these movements are 'beside' the church instead of a 'ministry of xyz Church'. Granted, many of these efforts address issues that most churches do not.
Why can they not be directly related to a local denom? There seems to be a propensity for independency within para church organizations and as a few people made mention, church polity is biblical and no actual local church oversite, problematic. Get attached and solve the issue!

 

[Joshua]

Joshua, I agree with your answer. I wonder though, how would you answer possible objections that use the following parallel accounts?

Assuming that the objector sees these passages as justification for ministry apart from the church.

I have not spent much time at all considering those passages, and am also reminded of the exchange between Moses and Joshua in Numbers 11 when I read them (as well as Paul's rejoicing that Christ was being preached, regardless of the intent behind those preaching). I plan to spend some time reading about those. My initial thoughts are that they're unique circumstances surrounding particular times in redemptive history and not a rule as to how the Kingdom is grown. Christ would not have the apostles go and forbid the man from doing this, nor is this casting out of demons necessarily a sign of regeneration (Matthew 7.22), but neither did he tell the disciples, "Go and follow him."

That is not intended to be an airtight answer, nor am I looking for one for the sake of being right. I would much rather be corrected if I am out of line on this, and convinced of such by the Scriptures. We also do not want to let reading (or misreading) providence determine our practice, especially when we have explicitly clear light (in the passages I have referenced above) as to how the King has ordered His Kingdom. Just because some "ministry" has been successful by the secret workings of God, does not mean He has authorized us to use such things without command in Scripture.

I suppose -before we can get into a proper discussion- we must define things like church and ministry. Providing shelter for the homeless is no doubt a good work, provided that it is not prolonged for those who are a part of that circumstance simply because they refuse to work, etc. The same can be said for other works of mercy that are performed outside of the umbrella of the church. But when we begin to call such things "parachurch ministries," this is where we must be careful. Preaching and making disciples are -by definition- churchly functions, carried out by those commissioned thereunto. The service of the diaconate primarily to those within the church, are also churchly functions, and under the authority of the local session (who are under the authority of the presbytery, etc.).

I would not seek to dissuade men from doing good works, works of mercy, so on so forth. In fact, these are parts of our overall duty to God in this life; however, we must distinguish between those things and what the Apostle calls the "Ministry of Reconciliation," covering the ministry of Word & Sacraments.

 

[Gforce9]

I guess my issue rests in the idea that these movements are 'beside' the church instead of a 'ministry of xyz Church'. Granted, many of these efforts address issues that most churches do not.
Why can they not be directly related to a local denom? There seems to be a propensity for independency within para church organizations and as a few people made mention, church polity is biblical and no actual local church oversite, problematic. Get attached and solve the issue!

I think you nailed it, Scott.....the propensity toward independency.

 

[Deleted member 7239]

I guess my issue rests in the idea that these movements are 'beside' the church instead of a 'ministry of xyz Church'. Granted, many of these efforts address issues that most churches do not.
Why can they not be directly related to a local denom? There seems to be a propensity for independency within para church organizations and as a few people made mention, church polity is biblical and no actual local church oversite, problematic. Get attached and solve the issue!

The main reason parachurch organizations aren't denominational is because most boards of directors are from differing denominations. For example, the rescue mission I am referring to is ran by baptists, presbyterians, and non-denominational believers. They don't agree on some sacramental issues that make it necessary to worship at different locations on Sunday, but we all agree that homeless men need the gospel and a place to sleep. Or a women's crisis center that is led by women for the same reasons.

Much like the puritan board, it is made of different denominations, but fills a need that pastors and deacons can't fully address on their own.

 

[Scott Bushey]

The main reason parachurch organizations aren't denominational is because most boards of directors are from differing denominations. For example, the rescue mission I am referring to is ran by baptists, presbyterians, and non-denominational believers. They don't agree on some sacramental issues that make it necessary to worship at different locations on Sunday, but we all agree that homeless men need the gospel and a place to sleep. Or a women's crisis center that is led by women for the same reasons.

The above does not rail against these groups being attached to any actual denomination/church. Churches have men from outside a particular denomination that are involved. Most churches have budding relationships with the churches in their respective areas.

Much like the puritan board, it is made of different denominations, but fills a need that pastors and deacons can't fully address on their own.

PB is not a parachurch ministry. It's a place to hang out and dicuss theology. Theres a big difference.

 

[Deleted member 7239]

The above does not rail against these groups being attached to any actual denomination/church. Churches have men from outside a particular denomination that are involved. Most churches have budding relationships with the churches in their respective areas.



PB is not a parachurch ministry. It's a place to hang out and dicuss theology. Theres a big difference.

I agree with you. I guess I am just trying to define what actual activities are the work of the Church's officers alone and what can be done by an organized group of believers you could call a parachurch. Example: Feeding the poor can be done by a private believer, but not administering baptism. This same guideline would apply to groups of christians working together, right?

 

[Scott Bushey]

I agree with you. I guess I am just trying to define what actual activities are the work of the Church's officers alone and what can be done by an organized group of believers you could call a parachurch. Example: Feeding the poor can be done by a private believer, but not administering baptism. This same guideline would apply to groups of christians working together, right?

Nothing should be done outside of the local church. Everyone submits to the leadership of their particular congregations. If there is a group of believers gathering locally, from different denominations, this does not change the biblical need for over site; each man is officially being over seen by their respective churches. Which brings me back to the original complaint, that being that the organization itself would benefit being attached as well.

 

[Deleted member 7239]

Nothing should be done outside of the local church. Everyone submits to the leadership of their particular congregations. If there is a group of believers gathering locally, from different denominations, this does not change the biblical need for over site; each man is officially being over seen by their respective churches. Which brings me back to the original complaint, that being that the organization itself would benefit being attached as well.

Yes I agree that we are all an extension of the visible church. I don't know how the logistics would work of churches exercising oversight in a privately funded parachurch. It seems like many parachurches are functioning more like a business than a church, which seems okay since they aren't a church.

Should we view parachurches more like a Christian business? They provide a service and aren't a church, so why be under church oversight?

 

[bookslover]

It's possible that God Himself raises up parachurch organizations to do tasks that the church either can't perform or won't perform.

 

[Dachaser]

It's possible that God Himself raises up parachurch organizations to do tasks that the church either can't perform or won't perform.

I think that when they are functioning in a biblical way, that the Lord uses them to complement and assist the local churches.

 

[yeutter]

Ratio Christi, InterVarcity Christian Fellowship, Campus Crusade for Christ, and Navigators are the three main para-Church groups that operate on college campuses.

Do the staff members, of any of these groups, tell Roman Catholic students who have professed faith in Christ; that they should start attending and make profession of faith in a faithful Bible preaching Church?

 

[Deleted member 7239]

Ratio Christi, InterVarcity Christian Fellowship, Campus Crusade for Christ, and Navigators are the three main para-Church groups that operate on college campuses.

Do the staff members, of any of these groups, tell Roman Catholic students who have professed faith in Christ; that they should start attending and make profession of faith in a faithful Bible preaching Church?

I think staff members vary just like members of any denomination. I'm sure there are elders of reformed churches that would vary in their approach to ministering to Roman Catholics or members of any church in error.

 

[earl40]

What is a church, or its ordained to do? By answering this question each official office holder (TE RE and deacon) one can see a para-"church" organization is simply unbiblical.

Where the confusion arises is when those that hold to such a position are seen as against the laity doing good works outside the church (common grace) as conferring saving grace. BTW I see the TE as the only office holder that should dispense saving grace, and the RE and deacons should be doing the common things so as the TE can be free to dispense his charge.

 

[Deleted member 7239]

What is a church, or its ordained to do? By answering this question each official office holder (TE RE and deacon) one can see a para-"church" organization is simply unbiblical.

Where the confusion arises is when those that hold to such a position are seen as against the laity doing good works outside the church (common grace) as conferring saving grace. BTW I see the TE as the only office holder that should dispense saving grace, and the RE and deacons should be doing the common things so as the TE can be free to dispense his charge.

I honestly have never heard the term "dispense saving grace"--can you explain what that practically means so I understand your position? They are the only ones who should share the Gospel, or the only ones to declare someone saved?

 

[earl40]

I honestly have never heard the term "dispense saving grace"--can you explain what that practically means so I understand your position? They are the only ones who should share the Gospel, or the only ones to declare someone saved?

How will they believe unless a preacher is sent? In our culture of today it is common belief that many are saved by their next door neighbor who is a plummer or an ultrasound technician.

 

[Deleted member 7239]

How will they believe unless a preacher is sent? In our culture of today it is common belief that many are saved by their next door neighbor who is a plummer or an ultrasound technician.

I see what you are saying, but you can't deny that people are regenerated apart from hearing an ordained teaching elder preach. I would say that most of us are. How would a non-believer unwittingly find himself in a church pew on a Sunday morning to have saving grace dispensed to him? I thought we would say that he is dead in his sin and wouldn't willingly seek out a sermon. Where am I wrong on this?

 

[Scott Bushey]

Yes I agree that we are all an extension of the visible church. I don't know how the logistics would work of churches exercising oversight in a privately funded parachurch.

Well ultimately, each local church is responsible for it's members.

It seems like many parachurches are functioning more like a business than a church, which seems okay since they aren't a church. I've confused myself...

How will they believe unless a preacher is sent? In our culture of today it is common belief that many are saved by their next door neighbor who is a plummer or an ultrasound technician.

The scriptures tell us differently. Preaching is a characteristic of an office holder only. My sharing with my neighbor is not one and the same. Can a man be saved by my sharing, yes. Most everyone knows the gospel here in the states. But it is not 'preaching'. The means of grace are solely distributed by the office holder.

 

[Edward]

Ratio Christi, InterVarcity Christian Fellowship, Campus Crusade for Christ, and Navigators are the three

That looks like 4. I'm unfamiliar with the first one named.

 

[Edward]

How will they believe unless a preacher is sent?

Where is that found in the scriptures?

 

[Scott Bushey]

I would imagine Earl would cite Romans 10:

14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

The Holy Bible: King James Version, Electronic Edition of the 1900 Authorized Version. (Bellingham, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc., 2009), Ro 10:15.

 

[Deleted member 7239]

The question of every member evangelism is one that great men disagree on. T David Gordon and R Fowler White both had great articles on this and they disagree.

I see merit in both of their arguments.

 

[yeutter]

That looks like 4. I'm unfamiliar with the first one named.

Edward, you are right, I didn't count accurately.

As to your question about Ratio Christi, it is a campus apologetics alliance; that seeks to equip students to give philosophical, scientific, and historical reasons for believing in and following Jesus Christ. The focus of the organization is not so much fellowship, or discipleship as it is to demonstrate that Christianity is intellectually defensible. Ratio Christi seeks to give Christian Students good reason for believing in God's existence, the reliability of Scripture, and the factual nature of Christ's bodily resurrection from the grave.

On some campuses Ratio Christi draws from the same pool of students who might have joined IV. As IV has changed directions in recent years Ratio Christi has continued to set forth the case that it is reasonable to believe in the Gospel. Ratio Christi's focus is on defending mere Christianity not on being missional or transformational.

I do not have a problem with what Ratio Christi stands for. I am concerned with the number of Roman Catholic students that seem to be drawn to it. That may be a reflection on the change in the Church of Rome. She no longer warns her students away from Protestant oriented groups. Her Newman Societies are all but defunct on many campuses. She no longer is keen to ground her students in the philosophy of St. Thomas Aquinas and St. Anselm.

I doubt that the staff, and faculty advisors of Ratio Christi or by and large most of the other para-Church groups are pointing out to students their need to ground themselves spiritually, and their need to affiliate with a Bible believing, Bible preaching Church. This is one reason I have doubts about the appropriateness of supporting para-Church groups.

 

[yeutter]

Here is a link to Ratio Christi. https://ratiochristi.org