As I've said, I don't view that as sinful. Just superfluous. It's not anything I view as primary.
Pactum Institute?
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davejonescue
Puritan Board Junior
By the grace of God I no longer struggle with self-gratification, or adult content, etc. And it has been that way for years by his mercy, and Lord willing will remain that way until I die by his mercy. But mentioning that is almost moot as I do not know if I were afforded this grace as a concession to my desire of perpetual celibacy, or as a normative course of progressive sanctification? This is why in my case, this whole discussion about a bride is theoretical. But at the same time, I do not know the future, and can only speak what I would most likely desire to do if I ever sought a wife. I desire to remain celibate until I die, but I have not vowed celibacy (for I do not know what tomorrow holds.) But being in the position where sexual urges are not overpowering, lends the ability to be more patient in the search for a bride if that makes sense? What I mean is, as long as the Lord keeps me, and convicts me even of thoughts and wondering eyes, he has secured a sort of freedom for me that some struggle with. This may give me the opportunity to search more peculiarly than others.
davejonescue
Puritan Board Junior
I wasnt taking it that way, and never noticed a hint of judgment. But I can see the implications for someone who may be younger, (I am 42) and possibly struggling with purity, that putting emphasis on things that agreeably dont really matter, like ethnicity, would in fact be unwise. Our first goal should be pleasing the Lord, and if we desire to be intimate, we should not let unnecessary inhibitions stop us from both pleasing God and gaining the treasure of a believing spouse; which is the only avenue in which certain intimacies can be blessedly expressed. I know marriage is much more, but there are only a few areas in pre-marital life that especially make men stumble. This doesnt mean marriage is the cure, but Paul does say "because sexually immorality abounds."
It's "the right hand of the left" to use a phrase from James Lindsay. We've seen this playbook before in 1917. Anarcho-tyranny (such as treating those who report crime as a bigger problem than those who commit crime), deliberate stoking of racial tensions (encouraging understanding of everything through an exclusively racial lens and egregiously distorting what people actually experience), and a lot of the other lunacy we experience, but now with bonus castrations.
Fascism gains plausibility when it's presented as the only realistic alternative to communism; but the actions of fascism provide popular support for authoritarian repressions. No matter which way that conflict goes, you wind up with a lurch towards further authoritarianism.
Hence the need to take a stand on equal weights and equal measures, private property, and the consistent correlation of power with accountability.
Northern Crofter
Puritan Board Junior
I put a lot of stock in the theory that the drive to establish artificial divisions "upticks" relative to economic fears. Nazism's rise, for example, was rooted in the post-WWI Depression. If everyone has a good job and low debt, they don't really care about immigration or their neighbor's skin tone.
RamistThomist
Puritanboard Clerk
Adi is involved. Mark and avoid.
J.L. Allen
Puritan Board Junior
I agree with your assessment very much. I was talking to my wife and to my oldest about this stuff. I said the softness and weakness of leadership in Europe and North America has allowed for zero vetting or protection (functionally, at least) in immigration. Not only this, but being soft on crime and the rotting of institutions from the inside out, and the widespread racism that undermines the foundations of nations has preached powerfully, vindicating extremes of the right that always lie deep in the heart of societies. Honestly, this whole thing awakens the pagan European warrior mentality that never really was subdued by Christendom.
For the sake of accuracy in speech, I should say that I think certain kinists are really trying to wrestle with Scripture and don't have ill-will towards other ethnic groups. In fact, I think some kinists don't even view it as a superiority issue but truly as an issue of keeping lines they believe God has sovereignly decreed. I still don't buy it as good or helpful. Yet, it does seem to be of a similar weight as the agenda of forced diversity or that diversity is the goal, which was something I witnessed heavily at Moody Bible Institute.
So you could say these are two different issues that happen to have people who overlap. To say it another way: not all kinists are Nazis or supremacists (whatever background), but all Nazis and supremacists are kinists.
Another thing I'll add here is that a fair amount of these guys seem to come from South Africa or have an association with South Africa. Racial tensions in the decades after Apartheid have given way to persecution of a good number of white farmers. I believe the guys who view the issues as an existential threat to whites in South Africa import their views to the USA, which has had a sordid history concerning race relations. Given the rhetoric here in the media, the import is justified, and they end up viewing the USA as being only a few steps away from violence on a wider scale that what has already been seen. The guys who are native to the USA take up the fervor and use it to sound the alarms. Things get turned up to a scary level of heat, and the (largely) imaginary talking points on both sides of the extremes' rhetoric becomes justified. "Look! There really is widespread white supremacy because white people are subhuman and evil!" and "Look! Minorities really do want to see white genocide! They are subhuman and evil!"
Self-fulfilling prophecy!
Northern Crofter
Puritan Board Junior
I experienced this in HS in the early 1990s - a kid from SA (not named Elon Musk) moved in because his parents saw the writing on the wall for so-called whites as apartheid crumbled. A few years later I worked with a couple of Afrikaner farmers who also fled SA because the previously subjugated population was now driving out the descendants of the subjugators.
I remember the kid in HS because he ticked the "African American" box on his college applications, got a free ride, and then was told when he got there he couldn't have the free ride because he wasn't the right kind of African American. Out of the frying pan of South African retribution and into the fire of American affirmative action/reverse discrimination (his parents threatened to sue and the university gave in). I think a lot of the attempts to rectify past wrongs by past generations on the backs of generations decades (or centuries) removed from those wrongs is another major reason for the current rise in racial tensions.
Ploutos
Puritan Board Junior
pgwolv
Puritan Board Freshman
pgwolv
Puritan Board Freshman
What do you know of him?
RamistThomist
Puritanboard Clerk
He's South African. Got a legit PhD but used his knowledge to go down all the wrong paths. He flirted with Orthodoxy at one time because all the Reformed churches in South Africa were liberal. Then there is the whole racism issue.
pgwolv
Puritan Board Freshman
At least one of the three main Dutch Reformed denominations has never been liberal.
What "wrong paths" would this be? I'm curious because he is a fellow citizen so we might cross paths one day, or his name may come up in some of the circles I'm in. Can you link me to anything problematic?
RamistThomist
Puritanboard Clerk
Racism and functional white supremacy, for starters.
Northern Crofter
Puritan Board Junior
Here's a link that admits Dr. Schlebusch is a Kinist: "While not all of our constituent members, research fellows or supporters are Kinists, both dr. Schlebusch as well as Rev. McAtee have identified with that particular label for years."
The CRC Synod, which is of Dutch Reformed origin, condemned Kinism as a heresy in 2019.
arapahoepark
Puritan Board Professor
Looks like the infamous Michael Spangler finished his series on 'Race Realism.'
No wonder he was defrocked. His reasons and answers to objections are nothing I haven't seen before however. It's all bizarrely 'pragmatic' trying to be wrapped up in Biblical and confessional garb.
No wonder he was defrocked. His reasons and answers to objections are nothing I haven't seen before however. It's all bizarrely 'pragmatic' trying to be wrapped up in Biblical and confessional garb.
Ploutos
Puritan Board Junior
Careful - was he actually defrocked? I am not aware that he was formally disciplined or censured.
arapahoepark
Puritan Board Professor
I thought he has its ordination taken away because he was immature...isn't that the same thing?
arapahoepark
Puritan Board Professor
Ah...ok...didn't realize the nuance.
Charles Johnson
Puritan Board Junior
He was defrocked / laicized / deordained, but through a bureaucratic rather than judicial process. I.e. he was not found guilty of heresy or sin, but instead found to lack the necessary gifts for ministry.
Ploutos
Puritan Board Junior
I happily stand corrected. Thank you for setting the record straight. @arapahoepark
LightBringer
Puritan Board Freshman
Disgusted. This kind of think does not belong in the church. Avoiding....
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