Overture to 36th GA PCA: Deaconesses

[Romans922]

Found here:


This past Saturday, the Philadelphia Presbytery met to deliberate on several matters, each related to the role of women in the diaconate. One product produced from the meeting is an overture to be sent to this summer's General Assembly. Below is an excerpt from that overture which presents the proposal. It follows a number of "whereas" statements.


"Now therefore the Philadelphia Presbytery overtures the 36th General Assembly of the Presbyterian Church in America to create an ad interim study committee whose members are representative of various positions within the PCA with respect to women’s involvement in Diaconal ministry, to study and report back to the 37th General Assembly, on the following:

"1) Scriptural teaching bearing on women’s eligibility for election and ordination to the office of deacon and recommending, if necessary, changes to the BCO in keeping with any findings proceeding from the study of Scripture; and

"2) Should no changes to the BCO be deemed necessary, clarifying an appropriate range of practices for the involvement of women in diaconal ministry and giving guidance regarding current differences in practice among PCA churches including but not limited to the following: (a) may churches choose not to ordain any male deacons? (b) may churches choose to commission but not to ordain male deacons? (c) may women be commissioned as deaconesses without ordaining them as deacons? (d) may the same constitutional questions, or similar questions, used to ordain deacons be used to commission deacons or deaconesses who are not ordained? (e) may Presbyteries license and ordain men who submit themselves to the BCO but who also believe that women should serve as ordained deacons? (f) may churches elect ordained men and commissioned women to serve together in the diaconate? and (g) may churches use the title Deaconess for an elected position of ministry in the church or selected to serve according to BCO 9-7?"

 

[KMK]

I thought PCA already allowed for deaconesses. Maybe I am thinking of another Presbyterian denom.

 

[travis]

<devil's advocate>
Deacons are supposed to be servants of mercy correct? If so, how could a man truly empathize with a woman in the congregation that needs understanding in areas that could only be understood by another woman? What about women 'deconesses' that are only for women in the church?

 

[toddpedlar]

 

[Presbyterian Deacon]

The PCA Book of Church Order is fine just as it stands,

"9-7 It is often expedient that the Session of a church should select godly men and women of the congregation to assist the deacons in caring for the sick, the widows, the orphans, the prisoners, and others who may be in distress and need."

This overture is, in my opinion, completely unnecessary, and is heading in a direction we really ought not go.

And, considering Presbyterian history, I find that it should come from Philadelphia (of all places) to be most ironic, and little sickening.

 

[toddpedlar]

It might pay to recall that 10th Pres in Philly has had deaconesses since they were received into the PCA out of the RPCES, who allowed for ordained deaconesses

 

[Romans922]

Ken, there are 'deaconesses' in the PCA but they are not ordained (it is a way to get around the BCO, if you will).

I think, however, you are thinking of the EPC which allows churches to ordain women as deacons.

 

[fredtgreco]

<devil's advocate>
Deacons are supposed to be servants of mercy correct? If so, how could a man truly empathize with a woman in the congregation that needs understanding in areas that could only be understood by another woman? What about women 'deconesses' that are only for women in the church?

Travis,

This is a misunderstanding of the nature of deacons. Deacons are not merely "servants of mercy." All Christians are that. Deacons are called, ordained and empowered to lead the ministry of mercy in a church. Deacons, by the very fact of the office, exercise authority. It is merely in a different sphere from that of elders (who are primarily called to minister in the Word and prayer). Deacons are not "sub-elders" or "junior elders," nor are they "just like everyone else." They are called to lead the church in its mission of mercy.

How that can be done without violating the Scriptural commands against women exercising authority (cf. 1 Timothy 2) is beyond me.

 

[Presbyterian Deacon]

<devil's advocate>
Deacons are supposed to be servants of mercy correct? If so, how could a man truly empathize with a woman in the congregation that needs understanding in areas that could only be understood by another woman? What about women 'deconesses' that are only for women in the church?

Travis,

This is a misunderstanding of the nature of deacons. Deacons are not merely "servants of mercy." All Christians are that. Deacons are called, ordained and empowered to lead the ministry of mercy in a church. Deacons, by the very fact of the office, exercise authority. It is merely in a different sphere from that of elders (who are primarily called to minister in the Word and prayer). Deacons are not "sub-elders" or "junior elders," nor are they "just like everyone else." They are called to lead the church in its mission of mercy.

How that can be done without violating the Scriptural commands against women exercising authority (cf. 1 Timothy 2) is beyond me.

Book of Church Order
7-2 "The ordinary and perpetual classes of office in the Church are elders and deacons....In accord with Scripture, these offices are open to men only."

 

[Semper Fidelis]

I was listening to R.C. Sproul a number of years ago speak on this subject in a "Message of the Month" thing. He stated that he had served on the PCA Study Committee on the ordination of women deacons and was the minority opinion on the committee in favor of their ordination.

I disagree with his opinion but was just providing a bit of trivia.

 

[Theoretical]

<devil's advocate>
Deacons are supposed to be servants of mercy correct? If so, how could a man truly empathize with a woman in the congregation that needs understanding in areas that could only be understood by another woman? What about women 'deconesses' that are only for women in the church?

Travis,

This is a misunderstanding of the nature of deacons. Deacons are not merely "servants of mercy." All Christians are that. Deacons are called, ordained and empowered to lead the ministry of mercy in a church. Deacons, by the very fact of the office, exercise authority. It is merely in a different sphere from that of elders (who are primarily called to minister in the Word and prayer). Deacons are not "sub-elders" or "junior elders," nor are they "just like everyone else." They are called to lead the church in its mission of mercy.

How that can be done without violating the Scriptural commands against women exercising authority (cf. 1 Timothy 2) is beyond me.

Thank you for explaining this important distinction. I've been "on the fence" with regard to the deaconess issue, but this issue of leading the mercy ministry is key. Thanks for the insights.

 

[Pilgrim]

Ken, there are 'deaconesses' in the PCA but they are not ordained (it is a way to get around the BCO, if you will).

I think, however, you are thinking of the EPC which allows churches to ordain women as deacons.

The EPC allows churches to ordain women to all offices, although up until now I understand TE's have been rare and many churches prohibit women officers. However this may change as more congregations from the PCUSA go into the EPC.

I understand that the RPCNA and ARP have deaconnesses.

 

[Pilgrim]

Redeemer PCA in NYC has "deaconnesses" too, although I believe they are unordained.

 

[calgal]

I was listening to R.C. Sproul a number of years ago speak on this subject in a "Message of the Month" thing. He stated that he had served on the PCA Study Committee on the ordination of women deacons and was the minority opinion on the committee in favor of their ordination.

I disagree with his opinion but was just providing a bit of trivia.

If I recall correctly, there were female deaconesses (Priscilla I thought was one). Now female ELDERS are a different and unbiblical modern aberration. I really do not see the problem with female deacons (and yes women assisting women would be the preferrable role).

 

[Kevin]

<devil's advocate>
Deacons are supposed to be servants of mercy correct? If so, how could a man truly empathize with a woman in the congregation that needs understanding in areas that could only be understood by another woman? What about women 'deconesses' that are only for women in the church?

Travis,

This is a misunderstanding of the nature of deacons. Deacons are not merely "servants of mercy." All Christians are that. Deacons are called, ordained and empowered to lead the ministry of mercy in a church. Deacons, by the very fact of the office, exercise authority. It is merely in a different sphere from that of elders (who are primarily called to minister in the Word and prayer). Deacons are not "sub-elders" or "junior elders," nor are they "just like everyone else." They are called to lead the church in its mission of mercy.

How that can be done without violating the Scriptural commands against women exercising authority (cf. 1 Timothy 2) is beyond me.

The answer pastor Greco, is that the women (deaconess) do not exercise authority over men! Several very conservative Presbyterian denominations have lived with this system for years without all the supposed negatives comming to pass.

I can see that some people would be opposed to it. But please NB the covenanting tradition has produced at least 2 denominations that have remained faithful to the word & the standards and had women deacons.

 

[toddpedlar]

Redeemer PCA in NYC has "deaconnesses" too, although I believe they are unordained.

They are unordained in a sense, but they take the same vows that ordained deacons in PCA churches do - the female deaconesses have exactly the same role and function as the male deaconesses (i mean deacons) do. I happened to be at Redeemer one Sunday when they took their vows of office. I'm not sure how they regard them "officially" - that is whether the males they consider to be ordained and the females not.

 

[toddpedlar]

I was listening to R.C. Sproul a number of years ago speak on this subject in a "Message of the Month" thing. He stated that he had served on the PCA Study Committee on the ordination of women deacons and was the minority opinion on the committee in favor of their ordination.

I disagree with his opinion but was just providing a bit of trivia.

If I recall correctly, there were female deaconesses (Priscilla I thought was one). Now female ELDERS are a different and unbiblical modern aberration. I really do not see the problem with female deacons (and yes women assisting women would be the preferrable role).

Phoebe is called a servant of the church - the word used there is a perfectly good female form of the word servant. The question is does that word connote an OFFICE? It's the only place in the whole of scripture (I believe) where the female form of servant is used. If women were meant to be ordained into the same office as deacons are, then why does Paul not talk about deaconesses in 1 Timothy 3? He had plenty of opportunity to do so - and the demands therein that call for deacons to be men of one wife makes it hard to imagine that female deacons are supportable, scripturally.

 

[Semper Fidelis]

I was listening to R.C. Sproul a number of years ago speak on this subject in a "Message of the Month" thing. He stated that he had served on the PCA Study Committee on the ordination of women deacons and was the minority opinion on the committee in favor of their ordination.

I disagree with his opinion but was just providing a bit of trivia.

If I recall correctly, there were female deaconesses (Priscilla I thought was one). Now female ELDERS are a different and unbiblical modern aberration. I really do not see the problem with female deacons (and yes women assisting women would be the preferrable role).

That's not necessarily clear from the passage as the term means servant.

It's sort of like the word apostle in the Scriptures as well. Not every apostle was an Apostle.

Incidentally, this is to take nothing away from Priscilla. From the account in the Acts, it is very obvious that she is held in very high esteem and loved very dearly by the Church for her service. I simply agree with Fred that the Diaconal office is an office that is given authority in the sphere of mercy ministry.

 

[fredtgreco]

<devil's advocate>
Deacons are supposed to be servants of mercy correct? If so, how could a man truly empathize with a woman in the congregation that needs understanding in areas that could only be understood by another woman? What about women 'deconesses' that are only for women in the church?

Travis,

This is a misunderstanding of the nature of deacons. Deacons are not merely "servants of mercy." All Christians are that. Deacons are called, ordained and empowered to lead the ministry of mercy in a church. Deacons, by the very fact of the office, exercise authority. It is merely in a different sphere from that of elders (who are primarily called to minister in the Word and prayer). Deacons are not "sub-elders" or "junior elders," nor are they "just like everyone else." They are called to lead the church in its mission of mercy.

How that can be done without violating the Scriptural commands against women exercising authority (cf. 1 Timothy 2) is beyond me.

The answer pastor Greco, is that the women (deaconess) do not exercise authority over men! Several very conservative Presbyterian denominations have lived with this system for years without all the supposed negatives comming to pass.

I can see that some people would be opposed to it. But please NB the covenanting tradition has produced at least 2 denominations that have remained faithful to the word & the standards and had women deacons.

So then there are no men involved in mercy ministry. Because the deacons lead, and they must lead all in the mercy ministry.

I will not make Providence my Bible, but to your point, I will simply note that the overwhelming evidence is contrary to your point. Virtually every church body that has rejected God's Word on 1 Timothy 2 has rejected God's Word in other significant areas.

 

[Romans922]

Is there any way that you guys can make sure that we have a reformed moderator this year at GA (like we have had in the past) so that if such a study committee were appointed it would be a good one. If I were there I know I'd nominate Fred Greco!

 

[tcalbrecht]

"Now therefore the Philadelphia Presbytery overtures the 36th General Assembly of the Presbyterian Church in America to create an ad interim study committee whose members are representative of various positions within the PCA with respect to women’s involvement in Diaconal ministry, to study and report back to the 37th General Assembly, on the following:

Just imagine, a study committee with representatives from various positions. What a novel concept.

 

[jawyman]

<devil's advocate>
Deacons are supposed to be servants of mercy correct? If so, how could a man truly empathize with a woman in the congregation that needs understanding in areas that could only be understood by another woman? What about women 'deconesses' that are only for women in the church?

Travis,

This is a misunderstanding of the nature of deacons. Deacons are not merely "servants of mercy." All Christians are that. Deacons are called, ordained and empowered to lead the ministry of mercy in a church. Deacons, by the very fact of the office, exercise authority. It is merely in a different sphere from that of elders (who are primarily called to minister in the Word and prayer). Deacons are not "sub-elders" or "junior elders," nor are they "just like everyone else." They are called to lead the church in its mission of mercy.

How that can be done without violating the Scriptural commands against women exercising authority (cf. 1 Timothy 2) is beyond me.

 

[CDM]

It would profit us all to understand what it means to hold an "Office". What is the nature of holding an Office?

Does holding an Office mean there is inherent authority associated with said office? If this office(r) is exercising authority and administering things (especially in the name of the church). . .

Are women permitted to exercise authority over men and the church?

No.

2 options:

1) Holding an Office has intrinsic authority attached to it ---therefore "No" to women.
2) Holding an Office does not have intrinsic authority attached to it ---therefore "Yes" to women. [-still waiting to hear from someone who holds to this-]

But wait, if #2 is true, how would a woman have such an Office with all its requirements when her natural domain is keeping the home? (Titus 2 & co.) This sounds as if God would be calling women away from their ordinary station in life to another and contradictory station.

This undermines God’s word and the governance of the family.

 

[JBaldwin]

It would profit us all to understand what it means to hold an "Office". What is the nature of holding an Office?

Does holding an Office mean there is inherent authority associated with said office? If this office(r) is exercising authority and administering things (especially in the name of the church). . .

Are women permitted to exercise authority over men and the church?

No.

2 options:

1) Holding an Office has intrinsic authority attached to it ---therefore "No" to women.
2) Holding an Office does not have intrinsic authority attached to it ---therefore "Yes" to women. [-still waiting to hear from someone who holds to this-]

But wait, if #2 is true, how would a woman have such an Office with all its requirements when her natural domain is keeping the home? (Titus 2 & co.) This sounds as if God would be calling women away from their ordinary station in life to another and contradictory station.

This undermines God’s word and the governance of the family.

It seems very clear to me that deacons hold an office of authority in the church as you state in option #1, but I believe that there can and should be women appointed as deaconnesses to serve under/along side the deacons. These women do not hold authority, but in much like a healthy marriage, they contribute, advise and serve along side the men performing works of mercy that are out of the realm of the men, i.e, ministering to the women.

Regarding your option #2, I believe the reason that this issue comes up at all (apart from the odd woman whose motive is to gain control and power) is because there is a general tendancy in the church for male leadership to forget that there are many women who are not yet married, whose children are out of the home, or who are widowed. So often, these women long for a more active role in the church and are ignored by the male leadership (by either action or attitude) or deemed "unfit" to minister because they are too old or not married. I do realize I am making a blanket statement and that not everyone is like this, but it is all too common.

I know what I am saying from personal experience. I married and had children later in life than most women, and so for nearly 12 years I had time on my hands (and the desire) to serve the Lord in the church in a larger capacity than a married woman with family could have done. The PCA church to which I belonged was not open to single women serving anywhere apart from teaching children's Sunday school classes and singing in the choir. To a woman with mercy and shepherding gifts, this can be totally frustrating, and it was for me.

The Lord eventually led me to serve on the mission field for 3 years where I experienced a totally different approach to women in ministry. There was plenty for me to do that didn't require me to serve as an officer in the church. Under the direction of male leadership, I counseled women, made "pastoral" visits to women, taught, cared for the sick, etc. This all ended the day I returned to my home church. It seems there is little room for women in the average church to exercise these types of gifts, and I believe that serving as a deaconess in the capacity to which I just referred is not only biblcial but necessary in the church.

When I married, of course, my focus changed. Paul addressed this in I Cornithians 7. Paul addresses both the single men and the single women saying that as single people, they are free to be concerned with things of the Lord. If there is not some larger ministry for a single or widowed woman to do in the church, then why would Paul even make this statement? Again, I am NOT saying that a woman should hold an office of authority. I am saying that male leadership often has too narrow of a view of what women can do in the church, and this push for recognition of women deaconnesses is merely an attempt to address this problem.

 

[Blueridge Believer]

I think I just found a new avatar!!

 

[CDM]

It would profit us all to understand what it means to hold an "Office". What is the nature of holding an Office?

Does holding an Office mean there is inherent authority associated with said office? If this office(r) is exercising authority and administering things (especially in the name of the church). . .

Are women permitted to exercise authority over men and the church?

No.

2 options:

1) Holding an Office has intrinsic authority attached to it ---therefore "No" to women.
2) Holding an Office does not have intrinsic authority attached to it ---therefore "Yes" to women. [-still waiting to hear from someone who holds to this-]

But wait, if #2 is true, how would a woman have such an Office with all its requirements when her natural domain is keeping the home? (Titus 2 & co.) This sounds as if God would be calling women away from their ordinary station in life to another and contradictory station.

This undermines God’s word and the governance of the family.

It seems very clear to me that deacons hold an office of authority in the church as you state in option #1, but I believe that there can and should be women appointed as deaconnesses to serve under/along side the deacons. These women do not hold authority, but in much like a healthy marriage, they contribute, advise and serve along side the men performing works of mercy that are out of the realm of the men, i.e, ministering to the women.

Regarding your option #2, I believe the reason that this issue comes up at all (apart from the odd woman whose motive is to gain control and power) is because there is a general tendancy in the church for male leadership to forget that there are many women who are not yet married, whose children are out of the home, or who are widowed. So often, these women long for a more active role in the church and are ignored by the male leadership (by either action or attitude) or deemed "unfit" to minister because they are too old or not married. I do realize I am making a blanket statement and that not everyone is like this, but it is all too common.

I know what I am saying from personal experience. I married and had children later in life than most women, and so for nearly 12 years I had time on my hands (and the desire) to serve the Lord in the church in a larger capacity than a married woman with family could have done. The PCA church to which I belonged was not open to single women serving anywhere apart from teaching children's Sunday school classes and singing in the choir. To a woman with mercy and shepherding gifts, this can be totally frustrating, and it was for me.

The Lord eventually led me to serve on the mission field for 3 years where I experienced a totally different approach to women in ministry. There was plenty for me to do that didn't require me to serve as an officer in the church. Under the direction of male leadership, I counseled women, made "pastoral" visits to women, taught, cared for the sick, etc. This all ended the day I returned to my home church. It seems there is little room for women in the average church to exercise these types of gifts, and I believe that serving as a deaconess in the capacity to which I just referred is not only biblcial but necessary in the church.

When I married, of course, my focus changed. Paul addressed this in I Cornithians 7. Paul addresses both the single men and the single women saying that as single people, they are free to be concerned with things of the Lord. If there is not some larger ministry for a single or widowed woman to do in the church, then why would Paul even make this statement? Again, I am NOT saying that a woman should hold an office of authority. I am saying that male leadership often has too narrow of a view of what women can do in the church, and this push for recognition of women deaconnesses is merely an attempt to address this problem.

Good post, and very well stated.

I commend you sister for your sevice to Christ's church.

 

[toddpedlar]

I think I just found a new avatar!!

Enjoy it with my compliments

 

[greenbaggins]

It would profit us all to understand what it means to hold an "Office". What is the nature of holding an Office?

Does holding an Office mean there is inherent authority associated with said office? If this office(r) is exercising authority and administering things (especially in the name of the church). . .

Are women permitted to exercise authority over men and the church?

No.

2 options:

1) Holding an Office has intrinsic authority attached to it ---therefore "No" to women.
2) Holding an Office does not have intrinsic authority attached to it ---therefore "Yes" to women. [-still waiting to hear from someone who holds to this-]

But wait, if #2 is true, how would a woman have such an Office with all its requirements when her natural domain is keeping the home? (Titus 2 & co.) This sounds as if God would be calling women away from their ordinary station in life to another and contradictory station.

This undermines God’s word and the governance of the family.

It seems very clear to me that deacons hold an office of authority in the church as you state in option #1, but I believe that there can and should be women appointed as deaconnesses to serve under/along side the deacons. These women do not hold authority, but in much like a healthy marriage, they contribute, advise and serve along side the men performing works of mercy that are out of the realm of the men, i.e, ministering to the women.

Regarding your option #2, I believe the reason that this issue comes up at all (apart from the odd woman whose motive is to gain control and power) is because there is a general tendancy in the church for male leadership to forget that there are many women who are not yet married, whose children are out of the home, or who are widowed. So often, these women long for a more active role in the church and are ignored by the male leadership (by either action or attitude) or deemed "unfit" to minister because they are too old or not married. I do realize I am making a blanket statement and that not everyone is like this, but it is all too common.

I know what I am saying from personal experience. I married and had children later in life than most women, and so for nearly 12 years I had time on my hands (and the desire) to serve the Lord in the church in a larger capacity than a married woman with family could have done. The PCA church to which I belonged was not open to single women serving anywhere apart from teaching children's Sunday school classes and singing in the choir. To a woman with mercy and shepherding gifts, this can be totally frustrating, and it was for me.

The Lord eventually led me to serve on the mission field for 3 years where I experienced a totally different approach to women in ministry. There was plenty for me to do that didn't require me to serve as an officer in the church. Under the direction of male leadership, I counseled women, made "pastoral" visits to women, taught, cared for the sick, etc. This all ended the day I returned to my home church. It seems there is little room for women in the average church to exercise these types of gifts, and I believe that serving as a deaconess in the capacity to which I just referred is not only biblcial but necessary in the church.

When I married, of course, my focus changed. Paul addressed this in I Cornithians 7. Paul addresses both the single men and the single women saying that as single people, they are free to be concerned with things of the Lord. If there is not some larger ministry for a single or widowed woman to do in the church, then why would Paul even make this statement? Again, I am NOT saying that a woman should hold an office of authority. I am saying that male leadership often has too narrow of a view of what women can do in the church, and this push for recognition of women deaconnesses is merely an attempt to address this problem.

The burden of how to direct women to use their gifts in the church is a vitally important issue for the church, precisely because we live in an age of increasing egalitarianism, even apart from the fact that we ought to encourage everyone who has gifts to use them in the proper context. However, what must be kept firmly in mind is that those of us who wish to keep the offices of the church in the hands of men are equally desirous of seeing the gifts and talents of women used to the full. If it were only an issue of gifts and talents, then there would be no reason to refuse the office of elder to women. I am convinced that there are many women out there who have gifts of leadership, counseling, and teaching. But again, what does Scripture say? Now, I would freely grant that the case for female deaconesses is stronger than that for female elders (which is non-existent). However, every passage that might seem to point in the direction of female deacons is disputed, as this thread has already shown. I am convinced that Scripture does not command us one way or the other in any explicit way. I believe that 1 Tim3 is talking about the wives of deacons, not deaconesses. I believe Romans 16 is talking about a servant. The semantic range of the word "diaconia" is greater than the word that means "office." Therefore, there is no clear case for deaconesses. Given the problems that Fred has outlined, I think we ought to be governed here by a "regulative principle:" what Scripture has not commanded ought not to be followed.

 

[greenbaggins]

And furthermore, the work that is usually given to "deaconesses" can be done by women without handing them an office. Who needs an office to be doing the work of mercy?

 

[Romans922]

OPC has addressed this issue a long time ago:

Hermeneutics of Women in Ordained Office
Report of the Committee on Women in Church Office