When Jacob went to Egypt and Pharoah asked his age, he said he was 130. Joseph had entered the service of Pharoah at age 30. So Joseph was 39 at that time, 30 plus the 7 years of plenty plus 2 years of famine. Joseph, therefore, was born when Jacob was 91. Joseph was born when Jacob was still in Padan-Aram and Jacob was there for 20 years. It appears that he was born about 6 years before Jacob left Padan-Aram, so Jacob was in Padan-Aram from age 77 to 97, give or take a couple years. Even if Joseph was born right before the flight from Laban, that would still put Jacob's time in Padan-Aram from age 71-91. Bible story books convey the impression that Jacob was a teenager or young-20's when he deceived Isaac. Not so. He was still a bachelor Mama's Boy at age 70! This puts the story in new perspective if it is so. Please, someone show me where my logic is way off!
Is this chronology of Jacob's life wacky?
- Thread starter Leslie
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The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia says:
So even if 70 is not quite right, it seems that sometime after 50 is at any rate indicated. However, in his defense it should be noted that when people lived such a long time it doesn't seem to have been unusual to wait quite a while. Jared, the father of Enoch, was 162 before he had a child.
So even if 70 is not quite right, it seems that sometime after 50 is at any rate indicated. However, in his defense it should be noted that when people lived such a long time it doesn't seem to have been unusual to wait quite a while. Jared, the father of Enoch, was 162 before he had a child.
do we know that for sure? That was when he had THE son, the one who carried on the line, but he could have had others before (or perhaps he first had 100 or so daughters
)Besides the one in the OP, there are other instances of counterintuitive dating - for eg, when Hagar went off into the wilderness with Ishmael and "cast [him] under the shrubs" so as not to have to see the dying "child", he must actually have been well into his hairy teens.
When Jacob's sons had to wear down their father's resistance to letting his darling youngest go with them to Egypt,... Benjamin was the father of ten.
I've always thought that within living memory of seriously long life spans (when Jacob could refer to his own years as "few") quite possibly maturity was also much later than it was to become.
I suppose daughters are a possibility, but the emphasis laid on the right of primogeniture in the OT makes the idea that the son listed was not the eldest surviving son quite unlikely.
Sure; but those exceptions highlight the general importance of the rule. It was unusual that the elder should serve the younger in the case of Jacob and Esau. It was due to their own disqualification of themselves from the role that the authority of the firstborn was given to Judah, rather than to Reuben, Simeon or Levi. Etc.
TimV
Puritanboard Botanist
It's a good example of how the modern view of the State affects our thinking. When a kid's 18 he makes his own decisions. When he's 25 and on his own no one expects him to be under the dad's authority. The OP made me think of Judah and Tamar. He said "go get her and burn her at the stake" and they would have done so, since Judah was the source of authority rather than the State. It's hard to imagine that happening now, at least in the West. So, to a 70 year old man he would have reacted to an order from the clan leader the same way we react to an order from the State.
Hagar is more interesting to me. Any thoughts from anyone about her son's age during the episode mentioned?
Hagar is more interesting to me. Any thoughts from anyone about her son's age during the episode mentioned?
only that while I do find it curious, it's never been a particular stumblingblock. Anything could have been going on, although unmentioned by scripture, to make Ishmael more vulnerable than might have been expected. Also as I (and my sons) get older, I understand it better if anything. There's probably never going to be a time in our lives when a sight of them in extremis wouldn't evoke from me a similar reaction to Hagar's.
Willem van Oranje
Puritan Board Junior
I don't suppose there's anything unnatural about a teenager dying of thirst in the desert, and a mom mourning over him, (though not bearing to witness it) because she can't help him.
that's what I mean. the oddity is only in the way it's described, with her putting "the child" in the bushes (as if she was carrying him, but I suppose it's possible)
Jack K
Puritan Board Doctor
This is a solid theory. It is supported by reason and by passages such as the one we've been discussing about Ishamel. It is possible that a teenager like Ishmael would have been less mature physically than teens of the same age are today.
There's something else about the chronology that gets me. When Jacob fled to Laban, he made a vow to God at Bethel. When he came back, from his entry into Canaan until his moving to Egypt was 33 years, from Joseph's age 6 until his age 39. Dinah must have been Joseph's age or younger; Leah started giving birth at year 8 of his time with Laban. She had 6 sons and there was also an interval of her not bearing at all. Give her 8 years minimum to have the boys and then she had Dinah. Dinah must have been 4 when then left Laban. Jacob lived in Shechem, Bethel, and Hebron, in that order, in Canaan. Dinah could not have been sexually mature and marriageable before age 14. Therefore, Jacob lived in Shechem for a minimum of 10 years before going to fulfill his vow at Bethel, then only went because God reminded him, and during all those 10 years allowed his family to retain their foreign idols. God told him to settle in Bethel. Yet when Joseph was sold at age 17, they lived in Hebron. So he lived in Bethel for a year, maybe 2 at the most, from the time Dinah was 14 until Joseph was 17. So much for Godly obedience.
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