Ed Young Jr on the warpath

[KMK]

On the social front, Southern Baptists are known for being pro-life, pro-traditional definitions of marriage, against social ills like substance abuse, gambling, etc. ("I don't smoke, drink, or chew, and I don't go w/ girls who do.") and are largely republican. So, they would tend to favor positions espoused by the GOP. However, I'm sure amongst many SB's there's a growing contingency of Tea Party folk and independant Ron Paul types. This is obviously painting with a very broad brush, but I think it's accurate overall.

On the theological front, Southern Baptists have been historically commited to the inerrancy of Scripture, especially after the conservative resurgence. They may not practice the sufficiency of Scripture as we here on the PB would like, but at least they're not practicing deconstructionist hermeneutics, by and large. They also would be largely for orthodox understandings of things like the atonement (vicarious, penal substitution), salvation (even if they distort it w/ the sinners prayer and decisionism), the reality of miracles in the NT (contra Barth and the German rationalists), the list could go on and on. As was mentioned above, the Abstract of Prinicples is a very good document and many SBC churches claim to hold to it.

From what you say here, it sounds like SBC would at least be preferred over something like the ABC.

 

[SolaSaint]

My wife and I used to teach kindergarten Sunday School at the Southern Baptist church we used to attend in OKC (before Christ saved me ironically), and one weekend about 6 or 7 years ago our church paid for all the teachers to go down to Fellowship Baptist Church for the weekend to check out their kids program...which was huge. Everything else aside, I remember two very strange things...when we were walking in the building, we were the only ones walking into the building with Bibles in our hands! I kid you not! Not one other person walking in the building had a Bible with them. Anyways, the other thing I recall was that the service was about 30-45 minutes total, and the "sermon" was nothing but fluff and motivation and with only one scripture passage cited. I walked out amazed, since our pastor was an expository preacher who was very in-depth in all of his sermons. Even then, as deceived non-believer who thought he was a true believer, I knew that this was nothing but a joke. So needless to say, this video does not surprise me.

Matt,

I've seen this type of church within the SBC, it is a disease called Seeker sensative or Purpose Driven gone wild. I complained to my Pastor when we left his seeker church and one of the items was that people had quit carrying their bibles with them. He chastised me for that statement since every scriptural referrence was on the Big screen during his sermons, no need to carry a bible anymore. Needless to say Ed Young Jr was a hero of his. lol

 

[SolaSaint]

The Museum of Idolatry: Inside Ed Young Jr.'s "Parsonage"

Check out Ed's crib (parsonage).

 

[Marrow Man]

but seriously is there any reason to take this bozo with any degree of seriousness? Does he wield that much influence in the SBC? Why??

He has a very big church, and his father has a very big church. If you add the membership of those two churches together, it's far larger than the denomination I belong to (but if you took the actual number of people who attend and who haven't disappeared into oblivion, that might be a different story).

 

[Bill The Baptist]

Ed Young is a hardcore pragmatist, and the only thing that matters to hardcore pragmatists are numbers. That is why he loves Joel Osteen, because no one has numbers like Osteen. Doctrine doesn't matter (as long as it isn't Calvinism) ecclessiology doesn't matter, members actually showing up for church doesn't matter, as long as you can fill a big auditorium and baptize a bunch of people (regardless if they ever come back or not) then you are a success in these people's mind. I used to complain that a former SBC president had on his official bio that his church had 16,000 members with an average attendance of 6,000. No one seemed to have a problem with the fact that the man had 10,000 members who didn't show up on Sunday. Mind-boggling. Some of these SBC megachurches are becoming like fitness clubs, if everyone who was a member actually showed up, the fire dept. would close the place down.

 

[Marrow Man]

Some of these SBC megachurches are becoming like fitness clubs, if everyone who was a member actually showed up, the fire dept. would close the place down.

 

[cajunhillbilly53]

I have never heard ed young jr preach, but a lot of people at the church I attend- Lakepoint- like him. They also like Olsteen. I consider him to border on heresy. So I guess I would have to lump ed young in there too. Give me a Lloyd-Jones any day. Or a Charles Spurgeon. Sweet nectar of the Word.

 

["William The Baptist"]

I watched both videos in their entirety, but I could feel the frustration rising the entire time! I thought it was ironic that he was bashing reformed people while saying how wrong it was to bash him. I actually was ready to put this on FB with my own two cents under it refuting all his silly attacks but then something dawned on me...

The vast majority of my friends are not reformed and a good chunk of them like Osteen, Jakes and the like. And harder, still, is that my family (who are 100% adamantly opposed to calvinism and probably never heard "reformed theology") would LOVE a video like that and agree with everything he said (even though, ironically, they don't like Osteen, but would like him better than Calvin). So I figured it would be way too controversial to post, I try and hold back my "newness" and impulse to boil over about bad theology, it tends to get me in trouble. Instead, I am humbled to pray.

 

[Pilgrim]

Don't forget:

4. Al Mohler, Tom Nettles, Tom Schreiner, & Shawn Wright, the 4 Calvinistic heavyweights at SBTS.

5. Tom Ascol and Founders.

6. The slowly-but-surely growing number of Calvinistic pastors.

7. The slowly-but-surely increasing returnees to the Abstract of Principles (based on the Philadelphia/2LBC) & confessional theology. (I didn't say confessional practice [i.e., RPW]...that won't be for a while yet, I am guessing.)

There are problems in the SBC, undoubtedly. But the growing number of Gospel-minded men who are seeking to have expositional preaching from a Calvinistic framework is encouraging.

Note that I am not defending our errors as a Convention, and I often grow weary of the tightropes one must walk amongst some in SBC circles. More to the point of our present thread, I also often wish for some option to see denominational discipline upon pastors such as EYjr.

I've asked this question before but didn't get much of a response. What is so great about the SBC that so many Baptists want to be a part of it? I ask because we are considering associating ourselves with other churches.

1. It's one of a very very few denominations to be on the brink of a full plunge into liberalism to have returned: think conservative resurgence of the late 1980s/ early 1990s. (Now, there are many churches that are still liberal, but the convention as a whole and the seminaries were turned around).

2. Cooperative program.

3. Seminary on the cheap. Being a member of a SBC church cuts your cost literally in half (or more) if you attend a SBC seminary. If you're a baptist church and are near a SBC seminary, you will be doing your seminarians a great service by associating formally w/ the SBC.

So, is that enough for me to be SBC? No. I'm glad I'm not in the SBC because of all of the nonsense and party politics involved in the convention. But, you asked for reasons why so many are, and I think that those are pretty widely held reasons.

We could also add:

8. The Great Commission Resurgence: the self titled reemphasis on missions and missionary sending of SEBTS president Danny Akin.

9. The history of Calvinistic thought amongst the founders of the SBC (great little book out there called "Southern Baptists and the Doctrine of Election" provides a ton of source quotes of early SBCers who upheld the doctrines of grace).

10. A nationally respected name "SBC" that stands for conservative values. In fact, the SBC recently entertained a name change in order to be less regionally perceived, and ultimately opted against it b/c of the reputation that goes along w/ the name Southern Baptist.

11. Appointment of a black president of the convention, Fred Luther: significant and commendable for an organization once stigmatized by racist undertones.

11. Pot Luck dinners. Seriously, who wouldn't want to be a part those! Yum!!

I grew up in the SBC and until last spring (2011) have always been a member of an SBC church. I also attended an SBC seminary. Would I go back? Probably not. But, there's a lot of good going on there. Unfortunately there's also a lot of bad (EYJr. rant for example, and the recent document attacking Calvinism signed by many big names in the SBC, including the president of SWBTS, little to no discernment regarding what makes it on the shelves at their Lifeway bookstores, etc. etc.).

12. A rather pervasive mentality, especially on Southern home turf, that unless you're SBC, you're either a liberal, a fundamentalist or some other kind of extremist.

Not being Southern Baptist for those who grew up in it (even strongly Calvinistic men) is just unthinkable. In many parts of the South, (Deep South especially) the only kind of predominately white Baptist churches are SBC, IFBx (think Hyles-Anderson types) or Landmark Missionary Baptists. Also, in many areas, the only kind of nondenominational church is charismatic so you risk being lumped in with them if you don't have Baptist on the door. There are independent "Sovereign Grace" Baptist churches here and there, but they are usually rural, small, and tend to be lumped in with fundamentalists, (if not Primitive Baptists) even by many SBC Calvinists.

 

[DMcFadden]

The Museum of Idolatry: Inside Ed Young Jr.'s "Parsonage"

Check out Ed's crib (parsonage).

Crib? "Away in the manger, no crib for his bed, Ed Young's got a mansion, he says it's his crib."

 

[ZackF]

I need to credit someone but I can't place a name. Maybe James White. I remember learning from White or someone else that many men from an early stage in their career or even life are vaccinated against Calvinism. This stern indoctrination often comes from a close mentor. They are told firmly to "stay away from Calvinism. Be fearful of Calvinism...don't even go there." These people are nearly impenetrable to the Doctrines of Grace. This goes for this silly Young fellow to even respectable Arminian pastors like the late gentlemanly Adrian Rodgers. Nothing short of grace of course but will change their mind. It has to come from a person having an "aha" moment. Debates, assigned readings, and dialogues with the vaccinated are futile. Unless they approach you with questions and sincere inquiry from the inside out...forget it. In a similiar vein, Marxism has the same quality in its pure communist form or its more watered down liberal varieties. People who are raised for years to see themselves as entitled to their basic needs and even luxurious wants or be envious of those with more have a hard time shaking that. They have been instructed to despise those with more. They see state coercion and the political process as the answer, always. I have family members who think this way. It is an unshakeable mindset. Arguing with them is futile unless....they change their tone and start questioning their beliefs themselves.

 

[tommyb]

In 2 Peter chapter 2 Peter tells us false teachers use sensuality to corrupt the flock and are motivated by greed. Paging Ed Young, paging Ed Young.