Darryl G. Hart on The Color of Compromise: Church’s Complicity in Racism,

Discussion in 'Book Reviews' started by A.Joseph, May 2, 2019.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. A.Joseph

    A.Joseph Puritan Board Freshman

    The Unpardonable Sin? A Review Article

    “For those wanting a portal into those arguments and outlooks, The Color of Compromise is a valuable resource. At the same time, his recommendations for “effective remedies”—awareness of racism and interaction across racial lines, reparations, learning from the black church, creating a seminary for future black pastors, field trips to important historical sites—look overwhelmingly ineffective. If laws to end slavery and Jim Crow only create new conditions for racism to adapt and persist, why should readers of Tisby’s book think any redress of racial injustice could ever be satisfactory?”
    https://opc.org/os.html?article_id=754&cur_iss=Y
     
  2. alexandermsmith

    alexandermsmith Puritan Board Freshman

    Good review. A bit wishy washy for Hart, I would have thought he would be more forthright.

    But honestly, Machen a "white supremacist"? This is the nonsense we have to deal with nowadays.
     
  3. kodos

    kodos Puritan Board Junior

    Is this true?

    If so, what is the context for this remark?
     
  4. alexandermsmith

    alexandermsmith Puritan Board Freshman

    I believe the source is a letter he wrote to his mother which (recently?) came to light and was being circulated on social media.
     
  5. kodos

    kodos Puritan Board Junior

    Thanks. I had never seen it before. Disappointing, but thankful that he went to his deathbed knowing he had no hope without the active righteousness of Christ.
     
  6. Reformed Covenanter

    Reformed Covenanter Puritan Board Doctor

    There was a clash between J. Gresham Machen and B. B. Warfield over black students residing at Princeton. Warfield rightly opposed Machen's segregationism. Should we condemn Machen on this point? Yes. But before we get too sanctimonious, I wonder how many of the woker-than-thou brigade (or indeed any of us) would have behaved any differently had we lived at that time? After all, few of them speak out against crying sins in our culture, such as abortion, homosexuality, transgenderism, Cultural Marxism, and so on, as much as they ought to do. What makes us think that they would have done any better had they lived in Machen's time?

    The precise letter wherein Machen complains to his mother is as follows: J. Gresham Machen to Mary Gresham Machen, 5 October 1913 (Machen Papers, Westminster Theological Seminary).

    You may find a discussion of the clash between Machen and Warfield in Bradley J. Gundlach, '"Wicked Caste": Warfield, Biblical Authority, and Jim Crow' in Gary L. W. Johnson (ed.), B. B. Warfield: Essays on His Life and Thought (Phillipsburg NJ: Presbyterian and Reformed, 2007), pp 165-66.
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Informative Informative x 1
    • List
  7. Hamalas

    Hamalas whippersnapper

    Aren't both relevant questions/issues? I think our attitude towards other people groups and ethnicities certainly is a matter of fidelity to the Word of God and our confession.
     
  8. Hamalas

    Hamalas whippersnapper

    Whenever they appear, both sins should be addressed in ourselves, in our churches, and in our culture. And if we find figures in church history who have erred on these matters then we need to graciously and humbly be willing to critique them where they fall short. This should be a both/and issue, not an either/or.
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2019
  9. littlepeople

    littlepeople Puritan Board Freshman

    Yes, well said.

    If your proposal is that one of these issues is a little thing, and the other is a much larger thing, then I say an appropriate principle to consider would be: "One who is faithful in a very little is also faithful in much"
     
  10. alexandermsmith

    alexandermsmith Puritan Board Freshman

    Well a relevant point might be that until very recently the views expressed by Machen were not considered a sin by a large proportion of the church and until the 20th century I can't imagine they would have been viewed as remotely controversial.
     
  11. Reformed Covenanter

    Reformed Covenanter Puritan Board Doctor

    Actually, they were considered a sin by most Christians in the UK (and elsewhere) in the 19th century, especially around the time of the Disruption of 1843. I have read scores of newspaper articles from that period, including The Witness (edited by Hugh Miller of the Free Church of Scotland), wherein such prejudice was condemned.

    To refuse Christian fellowship with someone because they are of another skin colour is a wicked idea and one deserving of sharp rebuke. It is no different to Jews refusing to have Christian fellowship with Gentiles and vice-versa. Just because "racism" is wrongly regarded by the secular world as the unforgivable sin does mean that Christians should wink at such ungodly prejudices.
     
  12. Reformed Covenanter

    Reformed Covenanter Puritan Board Doctor

    Seriously, if you do not want to feed the Woker-than-thou beast, just admit that some Reformed people in the past got some things wrong on race. That approach is the easiest and most biblical way to deal with the complaint. Why people keep making the schoolboy error of apologising for things in the past that were self-evidently wrong is beyond me. If you keep trying to justify past evils, then the Woke brigade will use it to manufacture new "injustices" in their endless factory of grievances.
     
  13. Reformed Covenanter

    Reformed Covenanter Puritan Board Doctor

    As an example of what I am talking about with respect to British Christians in the 19th-century, here is an extract from a speech in Glasgow given by the Revd Robert Burns of the Free Church of Scotland:

    One of the things that struck me most forcibly was, that the prejudice is almost universal against colour, and in favour of something like a modified slavery. Nothing struck me more than the pertinacity with which gentlemen in the northern States contended for the abstract principle of slavery, which they did as strongly as gentlemen in the south. Indeed, I look upon the cause of slavery as entrenched in the American republic. […]

    Moral means must be used, - the gospel must be used, - the Churches of Christ, and all who love God and man must strain every nerve to get the system destroyed; but I deliberately tell you, that if you want to get one argument more than another to tell on the American mind, from Maine to Mexico, that is the argument derived from the market for their cotton; and if Britain can show that she can act on America in that way, - if the gold which Lanarkshire and Renfrewshire, not to speak of Lancashire, gives now to American slavery, be given to support a better cause, - then America will begin to look round, and be taught the lesson that free labour is better than slave labour; […]

    Dr Burns, in the course of his subsequent remarks, addressed to the prejudice against colour as existing very generally throughout the States, and mentioned that, in the vessel in which Mr [George] Lewis came home, a respectable man of colour was excluded from the cabin
    . This was a thing which they must check; and he was sure that those who had Scottish capital invested in these steamers would be ashamed of such a thing, and that, when known, instructions will be given to maintain the honour of the British character. (Cheers.)

    The Witness, 7 August 1844.
     
  14. Edward

    Edward Puritan Board Doctor

    Sounds like a segregationist to me.
     
  15. Reformed Covenanter

    Reformed Covenanter Puritan Board Doctor

    That is precisely what it is. And yet the same people condemn others as irredeemably racist for wanting to exclude black people in the past. The whole thing is completely nuts. You can never win with these people. If you fail to condemn segregation in the past, you are winking at racism. If you condemn segregation by ethnic minorities in the present, you are exercising "white privilege." Whatever you do, you cannot win.
     
  16. bookslover

    bookslover Puritan Board Professor

    Another example, from later in the 19th century: Spurgeon condemned slavery and supported the Union during the Civil War. As a consequence, he lost more than 50% of his US readership for a time.
     
  17. ArminianOnceWas

    ArminianOnceWas Puritan Board Freshman

    These comments from Blueridge Believer and A Joseph are not appearing on my feed, have they been removed or am I blocked from seeing them? I can only see that people are quoting and replying to these comments.
     
  18. ZackF

    ZackF Puritan Board Graduate

    I can’t see them either anymore.
     
  19. Reformed Covenanter

    Reformed Covenanter Puritan Board Doctor

    They may have deleted their posts.
     
  20. alexandermsmith

    alexandermsmith Puritan Board Freshman

    To be clear: I wasn't talking about slavery. Notions against egalitarianism would have been quite common in the church. I also take with a pinch of salt calls for racial integration (if that is what they were) from people living in all white countries. It is one thing to be against slavery which many Christians were. It's quite another to believe that a fully integrated society is commanded by Scripture. Were we also sinning when we denied women the vote?

    Scripture teaches that the Gospel should be preached to all men. It says nothing about a requirement that all races must be integrated and intermingled in every sphere of life. That is for the realm of politics. Machen may have been wrong, he may have been right, he may have been neither: but I believe we go too far to make it a matter in which there is a clear and therefore binding commandment from Scripture.

    As to those woke "Christians" : they will never be satisfied. Their agenda is not about reconciliation or even "reparation" it is about resentment, revenge and destruction. They are not to be given one inch. Their judgment is irrelevant to me.
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2019
  21. Johnathan Lee Allen

    Johnathan Lee Allen Puritan Board Freshman

    Strange. I can’t see them anymore either. Not sure why they would have been deleted.
     
  22. A.Joseph

    A.Joseph Puritan Board Freshman

    No deletions from me. I’m just #1.
     
  23. Blueridge Believer

    Blueridge Believer Puritan Board Professor

    I deleted my posts brethren. I found the conversation unprofitable and felt it was going to become contentious. Maybe I was wrong.
     
    • Edifying Edifying x 4
    • Like Like x 1
    • List
  24. Johnathan Lee Allen

    Johnathan Lee Allen Puritan Board Freshman

    Glory and praise to God.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Edifying Edifying x 1
    • List
  25. Johnathan Lee Allen

    Johnathan Lee Allen Puritan Board Freshman

    That can’t be. My mom says that I’m number one and that I’m special.
     
  26. Blueridge Believer

    Blueridge Believer Puritan Board Professor

    Psalm 24:1 KJV
    [1] The earth is the Lord's , and the fulness thereof; the world, and they that dwell therein.
     
  27. A.Joseph

    A.Joseph Puritan Board Freshman

    Yeah, a bit wishy washy. But I do like Hart pretty well. He’s the only opc guy I’m familiar with who is willing to get dirty on these issues.
     
  28. Blueridge Believer

    Blueridge Believer Puritan Board Professor

     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page