Biblical view of pets

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Andres

Andres

Puritan Board Doctor
How are we to view pets from a biblical worldview? I don't think there's anything wrong with having a pets, but where should the line be drawn? For that matter, where did the concept of keeping pets even come from? I can't recall reading of anyone in scripture having them. Should we love our pets? I know we don't have agape or eros love for them but does it fall under phileo love? Is it wrong to care about a pet to the point where we are upset over them? They don't have souls, so we shouldn't mourn for them the same way we do when a person dies, right? BTW, I have a little yorkie for a pet. I enjoy his company and I imagine I would miss him if he was gone, but I couldn't see myself being upset on the level I would be when a human dies, or if I did, I think I'd feel guilty about it. Curious to hear others thoughts.
 
Adam had lots of pets. The Old Testament has laws regarding treating livestock well. Also, the Scripture has a lot to say about shepherds who love their sheep.
 
I say there's gotta be sumthin' wrong with breeding dogs to be smaller and stupider instead of breeding them to work smarter and harder. If you carry a dog as an accessory like a hand-bag, there's sumthin' wrong with you.

Also, when some folks let their dogs lick them on the face, there's gotta be some sort of OT judicial punishment that we can bring back to punish those transgressors (I'll turn theonomist just for that reason if we can find enough general equity in one of the laws to stone those folks)....

Also, there is a lady in my sending church, a sweet lady, who campaigns to rescue dogs from the pound. There is another sweet lady, from another supporting church, that campaigns to give food to the homeless..... now, whereas they see two problems, I see an opportunity for these two problems to cancel each other out!
 
The nearest I can find in Scripture is the man in Nathan's parable who clearly had a particular fondness for his one sheep. But it is close enough to allow me to recognize my hatred of pets as a natural and just antipathy, perhaps, but not as an enforceable law.
 
I am not totally sure this allegorical example would have been a "pet" as we think of them, but it sounds pretty close, and causes me to think from the outrage of King David that there were "pet type" relationships known back then:

2 Sam 12:

[12:1] And the LORD sent Nathan to David. He came to him and said to him, “There were two men in a certain city, the one rich and the other poor. [2] The rich man had very many flocks and herds, [3] but the poor man had nothing but one little ewe lamb, which he had bought. And he brought it up, and it grew up with him and with his children. It used to eat of his morsel and drink from his cup and lie in his arms, and it was like a daughter to him. [4] Now there came a traveler to the rich man, and he was unwilling to take one of his own flock or herd to prepare for the guest who had come to him, but he took the poor man's lamb and prepared it for the man who had come to him.” [5] Then David's anger was greatly kindled against the man, and he said to Nathan, “As the LORD lives, the man who has done this deserves to die, [6] and he shall restore the lamb fourfold, because he did this thing, and because he had no pity.”

(2 Samuel 12:1-6 ESV)

I train competitive retrievers 6 days a week, and love dogs dearly. But I accept that I will not see my dogs in the Kingdom, the way many of the "new agers" expect. I see nothing at all in the scriptures to indicate that Christ died other than for the elect, which would include animals which are part of the fallen creation, in my opinion.

I grieve when one passes, because I love them, and I have been responsible for them. But nothing like I grieve when a loved one has died.
 
I expect that animals might inhabit the New Heaven and New Earth; for Adam started out in a Garden and Revelation brings us back to those images of Paradise. If our fallen creation can be so beautiful, I can only imagine what a restored world will look like! And it would seem odd that such a world will be empty of life.
 
Andres said:
I enjoy his company and I imagine I would miss him if he was gone, but I couldn't see myself being upset on the level I would be when a human dies, or if I did, I think I'd feel guilty
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I think you might have it backwards. When a beloved pet dies, it is gone, So it is natural to mourn it. But when a human dies, if they are Christian, our sorrow for our loss can be offset by the knowledge that they will be resurrected.
 
Nathan is one, and there is another in Isaiah:

The wolf shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the young goat, and the calf and the lion and the fattened calf together; and a little child shall lead them.
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And another in James:

For every kind of beast and bird, of reptile and sea creature, can be tamed and has been tamed by mankind,
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---------- Post added at 06:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:30 PM ----------

Ed, I think you can tell a kid that if in Heaven everyone will be happy, then if the kid's pet coming back to life will make them happy that pet will be there. It's an honest answer if phrased that way.
 
Here is one thought:

Pets are not part of your family, because family is biblically defined. I always feel weird when I receive a greeting card that is signed by the mother, father, children, and the dog!
 
Have we been influenced by the anthropomorphism of animals in our culture? When we deal with pets we often times treat them as if they were subhuman and ascribe to them the same thoughts and emotions that only humans are capable of having. Animals were not created in the image of God and thus do not have the same characteristics that man possesses. I know that I have been unduly influenced by the Mickey Mouses and Bugs Bunny's of the world and often catch myself thinking of my pet as having human thoughts and emotions, which they do not.

Given that thought, we are taught to care for and provide for our animals in the Scriptures. "A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel." Pr. 12:10 for example. I don't see anything inherently sinful in having pets, unless they become a preoocupation for us. In the United States we spend millions, if not billions, in pet care every year. We give them presents on birthdays, holidays and such. We even have pet health insurance if we so desire! In fact, people will include them in their wills, not merely for their continued care, but as recepients of an inheritance! We must guard carefully our hearts and treat our animals with care and regard their life, but not act as if they were human.
 
Pergamum said:
I expect that animals might inhabit the New Heaven and New Earth; for Adam started out in a Garden and Revelation brings us back to those images of Paradise. If our fallen creation can be so beautiful, I can only imagine what a restored world will look like! And it would seem odd that such a world will be empty of life.
Click to expand...

I agree that we'll have animals in the new Kingdom for the same reasons Perg's given above. Although I'm not sure if that means that we'll have our exact pets that we have here. But then again, I really don't think it will matter. I can't picture anyone getting to heaven and then being upset that Fluffy isn't there.

---------- Post added at 08:51 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:48 AM ----------
FCC said:
Have we been influenced by the anthropomorphism of animals in our culture? When we deal with pets we often times treat them as if they were subhuman and ascribe to them the same thoughts and emotions that only humans are capable of having. Animals were not created in the image of God and thus do not have the same characteristics that man possesses. I know that I have been unduly influenced by the Mickey Mouses and Bugs Bunny's of the world and often catch myself thinking of my pet as having human thoughts and emotions, which they do not.
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You're right animals aren't created in the image of God, but they do seem to have emotions. My dog sure does get happy when I get home and sad when I admonish him for something.

---------- Post added at 08:57 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:51 AM ----------
FCC said:
In the United States we spend millions, if not billions, in pet care every year. We give them presents on birthdays, holidays and such. We even have pet health insurance if we so desire! In fact, people will include them in their wills, not merely for their continued care, but as recepients of an inheritance! We must guard carefully our hearts and treat our animals with care and regard their life, but not act as if they were human.
Click to expand...

This is some of what I am wondering about. Is it wrong to spend money on our pets? I could see someone argue it's poor stewardship because we could use that money for something else. On the other hand, if we have pets, we should be responsible and give them proper care. We have to buy them food and we should get them vaccinated, right? But how much is too much to spend on a dog?
 
National Review magazine once had an editorial about how there is a relationship between the civilization of a nation and how it treats it dogs. I think the point was how Muslim cultures are not often crazy about dogs. Muhammad preferred cats it seems...
 
Pergamum said:
National Review magazine once had an editorial about how there is a relationship between the civilization of a nation and how it treats it dogs. I think the point was how Muslim cultures are not often crazy about dogs. Muhammad preferred cats it seems...
Click to expand...

Well, let's look at how the Bible typically represents dogs.


Like a dog that returns to his vomit is a fool who repeats his folly. (Prov. 26:11)

Look out for the dogs, look out for the evildoers, look out for those who mutilate the flesh. (Phil. 3:2)

And he answered, “It is not right to take the children's bread and throw it to the dogs.” (Matt. 15:26)​


So evidently dogs were not well thought of in ancient Hebrew culture.

On the other hand we read,


And one of the elders saith unto me, "Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof." (Rev. 5:5)​
 
I don't think it's wrong to spend reasonable money on pets. Hubby and I always say our dogs are our hobby. We don't do vacations, eat out much, buy fancy clothing. We do have two dogs who eat a lot of kibble, though and need vet visits.

Could that $$ be better spent? Well, I guess. So could the funds that people spend on sports/movie tickets/eating out/vacations/fancy clothing. If you look at keeping pets as a hobby, it's no worse than any other hobby. Can folks overdo? Of course.

On the grief issue, I think it took me several days to stop getting teary over our good German shepherd Anna's death some months ago. After those weepy days, I found a sense of thankfulness for all the joy and companionship and protection that good girl gave us. I think of her often, but don't grieve for her like one would a human.

Animals in heaven? I don't see why not. I agree that it would seem odd to not have them there, in the new creation. Maybe not specific animals we have known, but animals uncorrupted by the fall. Could be quite glorious! Whatever is, will be right.
 
Phil D. said:
Pergamum said:
National Review magazine once had an editorial about how there is a relationship between the civilization of a nation and how it treats it dogs. I think the point was how Muslim cultures are not often crazy about dogs. Muhammad preferred cats it seems...
Click to expand...

Well, let's look at how the Bible typically represents dogs.


Like a dog that returns to his vomit is a fool who repeats his folly. (Prov. 26:11)

Look out for the dogs, look out for the evildoers, look out for those who mutilate the flesh. (Phil. 3:2)

And he answered, “It is not right to take the children's bread and throw it to the dogs.” (Matt. 15:26)​


So evidently dogs were not well thought of in ancient Hebrew culture.

On the other hand we read,


And one of the elders saith unto me, "Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof." (Rev. 5:5)​
Click to expand...


Hmmm, we'd better point that out to National Review and other Neo-Cons since many of them seem very pro-Hebrew...
 
Elizabeth said:
I don't think it's wrong to spend reasonable money on pets. Hubby and I always say our dogs are our hobby. We don't do vacations, eat out much, buy fancy clothing. We do have two dogs who eat a lot of kibble, though and need vet visits.

Could that $$ be better spent? Well, I guess. So could the funds that people spend on sports/movie tickets/eating out/vacations/fancy clothing. If you look at keeping pets as a hobby, it's no worse than any other hobby. Can folks overdo? Of course.

On the grief issue, I think it took me several days to stop getting teary over our good German shepherd Anna's death some months ago. After those weepy days, I found a sense of thankfulness for all the joy and companionship and protection that good girl gave us. I think of her often, but don't grieve for her like one would a human.

Animals in heaven? I don't see why not. I agree that it would seem odd to not have them there, in the new creation. Maybe not specific animals we have known, but animals uncorrupted by the fall. Could be quite glorious! Whatever is, will be right.
Click to expand...

:amen: Thank you Elizabeth for this well thought-out response. I seem to line up with your thoughts when it comes to pets.
 
I am not sure there is an objective standard on "how much is too much" to spend on a pet, other than are you still tithing off the gross, and taking care of your family. I know more than one person who has sold a young, Field Champion labrador for $200,000.00. I love my dogs, but is someone offered me close to a quarter million for one, they would be out the door in a heartbeat. Those folks would think NOTHING of spending $6,000.00 for repair of a blown out knee on a dog. Its love of a pet, its also protection of an investment at that level. They also have the resources to play what is essentially at the NFL level with competitive dogs. I know others who have put dogs to sleep over the cost of a $300.00 proceedure. I do not have pet insurance on mine, but I will carry a stop loss on my next youngster in case of a blown knee, etc.
 
I agree Andres, animals do have some emotions. But are they the same as those experienced by humans? I am not sure and have not really studied the issue enough to dogmatically say one way or the other!

I think we have to be very careful in our treatment of pets especially in the financial realm. I don't think we could come up with a hard and fast rule on how much is too much but some of the things I have read and heard floor me! To spend thousands upon thousands of dollars on an animal is not good stewardship (In my humble opinion). A routine vet visit, etc., no problem. We have decided that when our cat gets ill no extended medical treatments for her, she will be mercifully put to sleep. We watch our in-laws dote on their pets as if they were their children, which sometimes is astounding! They didn't give their own children or grandchildren the kind of attention that their pets receive now. It is sad and a source of grief to the children.
 
Tim said:
Here is one thought:

Pets are not part of your family, because family is biblically defined. I always feel weird when I receive a greeting card that is signed by the mother, father, children, and the dog!
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I completely understand.


regards,

Ethan Beckler, Mia (Jack Russell Terrier RUFF!) and Koi

---------- Post added at 02:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:51 PM ----------

I am not sure if this thread was started because of me. I'd like to think so, so I will continue to do so. Anyhow, those following this thread may want to review my thread.


http://www.puritanboard.com/f37/few-my-pets-69470/

---------- Post added at 02:58 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:54 PM ----------

oh, and for those NOT fans of dogs, I beg to differ.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0atefssLylM
 
Our family owns a havanese dog. He's called Popi. God has used Popi in a special way to expose my sinful nature. I have noticed how typical it is for people to handle pets in a selfish manner. Here is a picture of our cute dog (he's just puked into our car, travelling makes his little belly messed up :D):


View attachment 2263
 
Ethan, as the thread-starter, I can assure you this thread was not started because of you. Actually I started it after hearing from a lady from my church. She found a stray and took it home and then was distraught to the point of tears fearing no one would adopt this dog. Then it apparently had a seizure and she completely freaked out. She was also upset no one would adopt this random stray. I didn't say anything to her, but it seemed a bit much, the way she was so into this dog she had just found. I wasn't sure if I was just being callous or what.
 
I had my lovebird for 8 years and he died last year. I cried when he died. I didn't take it well the first day. But, as someone who doesn't have much friends, he was a great friend. =D
 
Those are cool birds! They were native to where we stayed in SA and the kids caught several and they're easy to breed. We sure had lots. Now I just have some tarantulas, 4 cats and 3,000,000 bees, give or take a few.
 
When Jesus came back in his body after death, he ate fish with his disciples.

And in the NT there is talk of dining with Abraham, Issac and Jacob.

Will we eat in heaven? And if so, does it have to be a vegetarian meal? And if not, what of the subject of animal death in Paradise?
 
I think the financial issue is a big one -- if we have a pet, we are responsible for its well being. As others have stated, there is plenty of scriptural basis to care for critters entrusted to our care. At one point, that meant you made sure it got the food and water necessary for health and did what you could to ameliorate its pain and suffering.

Now you can get the full spectrum of medical treatment offered humans. I'm caught between meeting the expectations stated above and the growing expectation that animals should receive full human (and extremely expensive) medical care. The latter seems over the top. A dog, while beloved, is a dog. My sons would love to have one, and frankly I'd love for them to have one; but it's this issue that gives me pause.
 
Samuel, does that mean there will be no food in heaven? The analogies of heaven include a marriage feast and sitting down to sup with the patriarchs.
 
Pergamum said:
Samuel, does that mean there will be no food in heaven? The analogies of heaven include a marriage feast and sitting down to sup with the patriarchs.
Click to expand...

Perganum, I got to admit that I totally misapplied that verse in Romans. It was just all I could think of regarding your question. The verse seemingly has to do with Christian Liberty, not what heaven will or will not be like.
 
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