Interesting Stuff in Old Sermons and Other Writings

Status
Not open for further replies.
B

bookslover

Puritan Board Doctor
Reading John Calvin's first sermon from the Book of Genesis (on 1.1-2), he mentions the joke about which came first, the chicken or the egg? Apparently, that was already an old joke in the 1550s, which I did not know before.

I enjoy running across the occasional culture note in old sermons and such. They provide little windows on the times in which a particular sermon was preached or when a text was written. They, usually briefly, open up the world in which the speaker or writer lived.
 
Although not a joke, this Calvin quote from the end of Jonah shows a window into the population of Paris during his time.

"...for that city [Nineveh], we know, was not only like some great cities, many of which are at this day in Europe, but it surpassed most of the principal cities at this day. We know that in Paris there are more than four hundred thousand souls: the same is the case with other cities."

[Current Paris population 2.141 million.]
 
Not a sermon, but reading as Jesus comes to Jerusalem in Matthew 21 Matthew Henry says "They were come to Bethphage, which was the suburb of Jerusalem, and was accounted (say the Jewish doctors) in all things, as Jerusalem, a long scattering street that lay toward the mount of Olives...".

I was not expecting the word "suburb". Either it is older than I realized or someone changed the word. And then if right, does that even mean the same thing as today?
 
Kinghezy said:
I was not expecting the word "suburb". Either it is older than I realized or someone changed the word. And then if right, does that even mean the same thing as today
Click to expand...

You're probably already aware that the word comes from Latin sub and urbs. Sub means "below" or "lesser" while urbs means "city". At a reasoned guess, the word can probably be understood as a "city" (or, by modern standards, rather a town or a village) lesser than or dependent on a larger city. These communities would be a distance beyond the city's wall, and, in the event of war, the inhabitants of a suburb would flee to the city. There would often have been farmland between the city and the town (or suburb). The suburbs, usually unwalled, were easily sacked and burnt.

The modern use of the word "suburb", however, would merely suggest a district of a city, often residential, and often on the outskirts.

Indeed, the suburbs of major cities today were formerly entirely separate cities or towns that have been absorbed into the expanding large city. Take Paris, for example, which has Saint-Cloud, referred to in mediæval sources as a town outside the city. Into early modern times, the city of Paris was centred closely around the Île-de-la-Cité, the little island in the Seine upon which stands the Cathedral of Notre-Dame de Paris. To further illustrate city expansion, Versailles and other landmarks used to be some distance from the city of Paris itself.

Seoul is an example of a megacity that, over the course of its massive growth in the 20th century, has completely absorbed numerous smaller cities and towns. What are now districts of the city of Seoul were formerly separate communities.

I fear I am going on too long. I'll stop now.
 
Last edited:
timfost said:
Although not a joke, this Calvin quote from the end of Jonah shows a window into the population of Paris during his time.

"...for that city [Nineveh], we know, was not only like some great cities, many of which are at this day in Europe, but it surpassed most of the principal cities at this day. We know that in Paris there are more than four hundred thousand souls: the same is the case with other cities."

[Current Paris population 2.141 million.]
Click to expand...

Yes, that's the kind of thing I'm talking about. In one of his sermons, Spurgeon makes a passing reference to public drinking fountains in London.
 
Tom Hart said:
You're probably already aware that the word comes from Latin sub and urbs. Sub means "below" or "lesser" while urbs means "city". At a reasoned guess, the word can probably be understood as a "city" (or, by modern standards, rather a town or a village) lesser than or dependent on a larger city. These communities would be a distance beyond the city's wall, and, in the event of war, the inhabitants of a suburb would flee to the city. There would often have been farmland between the city and the town (or suburb). The suburbs, usually unwalled, were easily sacked and burnt.

The modern use of the word "suburb", however, would merely suggest a district of a city, often residential, and often on the outskirts.
Click to expand...

Per my Merriam-Webster dictionary, the first known use of the word "suburb" in written English is from the 14th century (Chaucer territory).
 
bookslover said:
Per my Merriam-Webster dictionary, the first known use of the word "suburb" in written English is from the 14th century (Chaucer territory).
Click to expand...

Interesting. Wikipedia says it comes into English from Old French, from mediæval Latin suburbium. Cicero apparently referred to suburbani (upper-class residents of the outskirts of Rome), which suggests some concept of suburbs existed in Classical Latin.
 
Another glimpse: Calvin apparently thought that the idea that the earth revolves around the sun was nuts -

"The same is true concerning the inequality we see between winter and summer days. As the sun moves away from us, the days shorten. As it approaches and rises, the days lengthen." (sermon on Genesis 1.3-5)

"We will find some who are such lunatics, not just in religion, but in order to show everywhere they have a monstrous nature, that they say that the sun does not move and that it is the earth which moves and turns." (sermon on 1 Corinthians 10.19-24)

Goes to show that even a genius can't be right about everything!
 
bookslover said:
Another glimpse: Calvin apparently thought that the idea that the earth revolves around the sun was nuts -

"The same is true concerning the inequality we see between winter and summer days. As the sun moves away from us, the days shorten. As it approaches and rises, the days lengthen." (sermon on Genesis 1.3-5)

"We will find some who are such lunatics, not just in religion, but in order to show everywhere they have a monstrous nature, that they say that the sun does not move and that it is the earth which moves and turns." (sermon on 1 Corinthians 10.19-24)

Goes to show that even a genius can't be right about everything!
Click to expand...

Calvin had very strong words against the heliocentric model.
 
bookslover said:
Another glimpse: Calvin apparently thought that the idea that the earth revolves around the sun was nuts -

"The same is true concerning the inequality we see between winter and summer days. As the sun moves away from us, the days shorten. As it approaches and rises, the days lengthen." (sermon on Genesis 1.3-5)

"We will find some who are such lunatics, not just in religion, but in order to show everywhere they have a monstrous nature, that they say that the sun does not move and that it is the earth which moves and turns." (sermon on 1 Corinthians 10.19-24)

Goes to show that even a genius can't be right about everything!
Click to expand...
I'm sure he'll be laughing at himself in glory, haha.
 
bookslover said:
Another glimpse: Calvin apparently thought that the idea that the earth revolves around the sun was nuts -

"The same is true concerning the inequality we see between winter and summer days. As the sun moves away from us, the days shorten. As it approaches and rises, the days lengthen." (sermon on Genesis 1.3-5)

"We will find some who are such lunatics, not just in religion, but in order to show everywhere they have a monstrous nature, that they say that the sun does not move and that it is the earth which moves and turns." (sermon on 1 Corinthians 10.19-24)

Goes to show that even a genius can't be right about everything!
Click to expand...
This is also a good one to put away for when someone says to you: "It's generally not a good idea to disagree with Calvin. . .So what else do you disagree with Calvin on?" haha

- - -

Note: After showing this to my wife, she informed me that there are brilliant Christians that still believe this. Haven't really looked into it much. So maybe it will be me laughing at myself in glory...
 
JTB.SDG said:
After showing this to my wife, she informed me that there are brilliant Christians that still believe this. Haven't really looked into it much. So maybe it will be me laughing at myself in glory...
Click to expand...

https://www.puritanboard.com/threads/geocentrism.81871/

https://www.puritanboard.com/threads/geocentrist-clarifications.85511/

https://www.puritanboard.com/threads/which-is-central-the-sun-or-the-earth.54925/

https://www.puritanboard.com/threads/question-concerning-wilhelmus-a-brakel.74070/#post-945333

This is but a few threads where this has been discussed ad nauseam here.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

danmpem
  • Locked
Recordings of old sermons
Replies
6
Views
3K
Jaymin Allen
J
Wayne
  • Locked
Old sermons preached with fire
Replies
14
Views
3K
Hamalas
Hamalas
B
  • Locked
And, in Other Exciting News...
Replies
10
Views
2K
bookslover
B
M
  • Locked
Freaky Stuff in California
Replies
1
Views
2K
SmokingFlax
S
B
  • Locked
Joel Beeke's Heidelberg Catechism Sermons - New vs. Old
Replies
2
Views
662
bookslover
B
Back
Top