Interviewing Your Daughter's Date

[Scot]

I'm not at all a regular listener of Dennis Rainey but today while traveling I listened to him on Family Life Today. He was plugging a new book that sounded like it might be good (I have four daughters). Any opinions?

(the guy in the description was me!)

http://www.familylife.com/resources/iydd/default.asp?DCMP=BAC-FLP+Apr07+IYDD+FB&ATT=ImageFB

 

[LadyFlynt]

hmmm...

no dating...therefore he wouldn't be leaving the house with my daughters.

However, he may come in and he will get to know us quite well as a family...

 

[kvanlaan]

 

[Herald]

Mmmm...I know exactly what I would do. Here are the requirements for a young man who wishes to date my daughter:

1. Submit DNA sample for testing.
2. Background investigation by two ex-CIA and FBI agents.
3. Series of three lie detector tests. The final one administered while I sit in front of him sharpening my rusty machete.
4. Hand write the book of Romans in Greek.
5. Complete 35 page application in triplicate.
6. Mandatory one year review process of application.
7. Recite the 1689 L.B.C. once again, in front of me while I hold my machete.
8. Full financial disclosure and independent audit.
9. Psychological profile.
10. Sign waiver holding me blameless in the event the young man should suddenly disappear.

 

[Coram Deo]

Do what my father in-law did....

Phone interviewed me for 4 hours seperated into two halves. Asked every theological question he can think of and asked every personal question about my life...

Next he asked for two personal references and a Pastoral reference....
He told me he would get back to me..

He then called all 3 references and called me back asking if I would like to come down for dinner one weekend.. Courtship followed restricted to his house for a year...

We got married....

Since then, we are considered heretics by him because of our theological changes... We are no longer pre trib dispensationalist and a few other changes....

oh well...

Michael

I'm not at all a regular listener of Dennis Rainey but today while traveling I listened to him on Family Life Today. He was plugging a new book that sounded like it might be good (I have four daughters). Any opinions?

(the guy in the description was me!)

http://www.familylife.com/resources/iydd/default.asp?DCMP=BAC-FLP+Apr07+IYDD+FB&ATT=ImageFB

 

[Coram Deo]

I can't stop laughing, that is too much...



Michael

Mmmm...I know exactly what I would do. Here are the requirements for a young man who wishes to date my daughter:

1. Submit DNA sample for testing.
2. Background investigation by two ex-CIA and FBI agents.
3. Series of three lie detector tests. The final one administered while I sit in front of him sharpening my rusty machete.
4. Hand write the book of Romans in Greek.
5. Complete 35 page application in triplicate.
6. Mandatory one year review process of application.
7. Recite the 1689 L.B.C. once again, in front of me while I hold my machete.
8. Full financial disclosure and independent audit.
9. Psychological profile.
10. Sign waiver holding be blameless in the event the young man should suddenly disappear.

 

[Steve]

I don't have daughters but did find this to be a good thought on how to approach the topic:

Application.

Seriously though, we do want to follow a courtship model for our boys. We have a lot to learn though as that is not how we were raised.

 

[kvanlaan]

We've got a hard copy of this. Love it.

We've got three daughters (at present), the eldest is 9. I will be teaching all the boys (two of them now, soon to be six of them) how to shoot in the next 7 or 8 years. I don't forsee many problems.

Yep, courtship is the way we're going too.

 

[Scot]

no dating...therefore he wouldn't be leaving the house with my daughters.

However, he may come in and he will get to know us quite well as a family...

Yeah, that sounds like what I'm leaning towards. He would still be interviewed though as he got to know the family. The book may have some good interview questions.

 

[LadyFlynt]

Oh definately!

 

[Hungus]

Don't forget this thread about the same issue: http://www.puritanboard.com/showthread.php?t=16373

I still like Greg Price's form:
The Interview
This list of questions is only suggestive of the knowledge a father should have of a potential suitor for his child. Many of the following questions are designed with a male suitor in view, but they may be altered to include a young lady your son desires to court as well. In many cases, the father will be so well acquainted with the potential suitor that many of the following questions will be unnecessary. However, the father should be assured that his knowledge of the potential suitor encompasses the breadth of knowledge assumed by these questions. The father should also make phone calls to the suitor’s parents, elders, and friends to verify information. This is important because once an emotional attachment has occurred between the courting couple, it complicates matters dramatically.

There are four major categories to which questions should be directed: (1) Background; (2) Faith and Biblical Convictions; (3) Character; and (4) Intentions/Goals. If in asking questions there should be conflicting answers, do not neglect to resolve the inconsistencies as soon as possible. Fathers, you should conduct the interview, but mothers should be permitted to sit and listen as well (it is better to have the mother ask any questions she might have through the father rather than firing questions simultaneously). Mothers should excuse themselves when the section on Character is reached due to the sensitive nature of these questions. It would be very wise to set aside at least three hours for the interview and have any small children supervised and phones taken off the hooks. I am thankful to my congregation at the Puritan Reformed Church of Edmonton for suggesting a sample list of questions to be used by fathers, particularly the first time through this process.

A. Background

1. Where were you born?
2. When were you born?
3. Tell me about your parents (ages, health, marital status, employment, residence, citizenship, education).
4. Tell me about any brothers or sisters you may have (ages, marital status, employment, residence, citizenship, education).
5. Where have you lived and what schools have you attended (public schools, private schools, or home school)? How have you done academically in school? What academic degrees are you working toward and what academic degrees have you earned?
6. Where do you work? How long? What other jobs have you held?
7. What recreations or hobbies do you enjoy?
8. What books have you recently read? Who are your favorite authors?
9. To which magazines or journals do you subscribe?
10. Do you watch TV? What programs do you enjoy? How much do you watch?
11. Do you watch movies at a theater? What movies have you seen in the last year? How often do you go?
12. What kind of music do you enjoy?
13. What period of history do you most enjoy studying?
14. Do you have a savings account? What percentage of your income do you put into savings (the purpose of these questions is to gain some insight into his view of stewardship and saving for the future)?
15. Of which organizations are you a member?
16. What is your political affiliation? In the last election for which candidates did you vote?
17. Have you talked to your parents about courting my daughter/son? What do they think? If you haven’t talked with them, why not? Have you talked to the elders of your church about courting my daughter/son? What did they think? If you haven’t talked with them , why not?

B. Faith and Biblical Convictions

I strongly encourage parents not to allow too much latitude in theological disagreement between the potential suitor and your own theological convictions. The Scripture declares that Christians are to marry only "in the Lord." However, different theological perspectives amongst Christians should not be casually passed over as acceptable, for true unity in a home, as in a church, is built upon a foundational agreement of biblical truth. Some significant differences to be aware of between professing Christians are the following: infant baptism vs. believer’s baptism, exclusive psalmody vs. hymnody, instrumental music in worship vs. non-instrumental music in worship, a woman’s head covered in worship vs. a woman’s head not covered in worship, no use of birth control vs. the use of birth control, a Presbyterian form of church government vs. a congregational or episcopal form of government, Calvinism vs. Arminianism, defined biblical roles for men and women vs. egalitarianism, covenant theology vs. dispensational theology, sabbatarianism vs. nonsabbatarianism, non-charismatic vs. charismatic views, theonomic vs. nontheonomic ethics, etc.

1. What is your relationship to Christ? What is a Christian? On what do you base your salvation? How long have you been a Christian? Did you grow up in a Christian family? What is the chief end of man?
2. What churches have you attended and of which churches have you been a member? How long have you been a member of the present church? What are the theological distinctives of your church?
3. How often do your parents have family worship? What is your practice with regard to private worship (prayer, studying the Scripture)?
4. What is your view of and involvement in evangelism? Are you involved in any cultural efforts to bring the knowledge of God to society? Are you involved in any diaconal ministry?
5. What are your convictions about the Lord’s Day?
6. What are your convictions about tithing?
7. What is worship? What are your convictions about issues related to worship (e.g. head-coverings, instruments in the worship service, singing psalms, women elders, choirs and special music, drama, altar calls etc.)?
8. What do you believe concerning creation?
9. What is the role of a husband/father in the home? What is the role of a wife/mother in the home? Should wives/mothers work outside the home?
10. What do you believe concerning the use of spanking?
11. Is holiness optional in the Christian life?
12. What is your view of children? Do you believe birth control methods are biblical? How many children would you like to have as the fruit of your marriage?
13. Is abortion ever biblically justified?
14. Give a biblical evaluation of the present status of our nation?
15. Is divorce ever biblically justified?
16. What is courtship, engagement, and marriage? Thoroughly discuss the contents of this paper with the potential suitor. Proceed to courtship only after you are satisfied that there is a willingness to joyfully submit to your loving oversight.

C. Character

If a young man/young lady has had a problem in any of the following areas, I would not necessarily write him/her off as undesirable. God’s grace may be especially evident in such a person. A sincere honesty about the past problem, a confirmed track record of godly living for a few years, and a verified history of willing submission to parents, elders, and employers will indicate that God has been merciful to deliver one from a besetting sin. What you are looking for in a desirable suitor is not perfection, but patterns of godly or ungodly behavior. It would be appropriate for the mother to excuse herself at this point due to the explicit questions about past or present sexual practices.

1. Have you ever been sexually promiscuous (petting, intercourse, homosexuality, masturbation, etc.)? When was the last time you were sexually promiscuous? Have you repented of this sin? Did you seek the forgiveness of the people involved? Were you biblically counseled through this experience afterwards? Who can verify this?
2. Have you ever been drunk or used drugs recreationally? If yes, how did you use them (orally, intravenously)? For how long? When was the last time? Did you repent of this sin? Did you seek the forgiveness of those involved? Were you biblically counseled through this experience and to whom were you accountable afterwards? Who can verify this?
3. Have you ever been tested for sexually transmitted diseases (particularly AIDS)? If yes, would you be willing to be tested again? If no, would you be willing to be tested? (Though no covenantal vows have been made, I submit that if such issues are not resolved before courtship begins, emotional bonds between the couple will have been established and will only complicate matters later if a proposal of marriage should be brought by the suitor.)
4. Have you exhibited a problem with angry speech toward others? Have you ever struck anyone, or destroyed the property of anyone in anger? When? What were the circumstances? When was the last time this happened? Did you repent of this sin? Did you seek the forgiveness of those involved? Were you biblically counseled through this experience and to whom were you accountable afterwards? Who can verify this?
5. Have you ever purchased pornographic material (books, magazines, movies, video tapes etc.) or attended places where there is nude dancing, strip dancing etc.? When? When was the last time this happened? Did you repent of this sin? Did you seek the forgiveness of those who were involved? Were you biblically counseled through this experience and to whom were you accountable afterwards? Who can verify this?
6. Have you ever been arrested, charged, or convicted of a crime (misdemeanor or felony)? Describe the circumstances.
7. Is there a situation in which you believe you would be justified in deceiving someone? Describe such a situation?
8. Have you ever courted? Have you ever been engaged? Have you ever been married? Have you ever been divorced? Are you presently married? Do you have children?
9. What is your view of biblical submission? Does biblical submission imply that one must always agree with those in authority?
10. What is biblical love? How is it demonstrated?
11. Can a promise, vow, or oath ever be broken (cf. Westminster Confession of Faith, Chapter XXII, "Of Lawful Oaths and Vows")?
12. What is a leader? What are the responsibilities of a leader in a family?
13. When is humor appropriate and inappropriate?
14. Should a biblical principle be compromised for the sake of expediency or unity (in a family, church, business, or civil government)? Does the end ever justify the means?
15. If you are offended by others, how should you respond? If you sin against others, how should you respond?
16. What is your view of debt (personal, family, church, business, or civil government)?
17. What is your view of work?
18. What is your view of recreation?
19. Are you a good listener?
20. Are you teachable?
21. Do you aspire to become an elder or deacon in the church?
22. Do you think men should honor women by opening doors, pulling out chairs, offering their seats when there are none available, etc.?
D. Intentions/Goals

1. What are your intentions in desiring to court my daughter/son? The most important intentions should be: (1) to glorify God; (2) to find a godly companion together with whom you will fulfill God’s calling in your life; and (3) to raise many holy offspring unto the Lord.
2. In which career do you believe God has called you to labor?
3. What further training or education is required?
4. How much time will that career permit you to spend with your family and church?
5. If I should approve of your courting my daughter, and you should come to believe that she is the one God would have you spend the rest of your life with in marriage, will you come and discuss this with me first, seeking my approval even before you proceed to propose marriage to her?

 

[No Longer A Libertine]

Mmmm...I know exactly what I would do. Here are the requirements for a young man who wishes to date my daughter:

1. Submit DNA sample for testing.
2. Background investigation by two ex-CIA and FBI agents.
3. Series of three lie detector tests. The final one administered while I sit in front of him sharpening my rusty machete.
4. Hand write the book of Romans in Greek.
5. Complete 35 page application in triplicate.
6. Mandatory one year review process of application.
7. Recite the 1689 L.B.C. once again, in front of me while I hold my machete.
8. Full financial disclosure and independent audit.
9. Psychological profile.
10. Sign waiver holding me blameless in the event the young man should suddenly disappear.

11.) He must be a eunuch.

 

[satz]

hmm...

Don't forget this thread about the same issue: http://www.puritanboard.com/showthread.php?t=16373

I still like Greg Price's form:

I'am not saying I have any strong views on this yet, just thinking aloud.

I feel a little wary about some of the first few questions in the 'character' section, particularly those to do with past sin.

Are these things really any of a father's business if they have been repented of and forsaken? I can understand why a father might feel he has the need to know but I can't think of any other situation where a christian would be justified to pry into another christian's past like that. Yes, sins even when forgiven have consequences, so questions regarding things like virginity would not be inappropriate (as the bible sets that forth as a attractive characteristic in a potential spouse), but I do think some of those questions do cross the line. By all means ask do you currently have any problems with such and such, but do you really have a right to request intimate details of the past like that?

(Don't get me wrong, of course a parent has the 'right' in that they have the authority and responsibility from God to conduct their child's courtship as they please, but I am asking if this is the most appropriate thing to do)

As I said in another thread, sin when repented of should not follow a christian around like some sort of criminal record that employers will always ask for. Yes, some sins have physical consequences that never go away and a christian will have to deal with that even if he or she has repented. But there is no need for other christians to go out of the way to 'dig up dirt' on others.

Thoughts?

 

[Carolyn]

I would also toss out the question asking the guy how he voted in the last election. Instead I would be more interested in hear how he makes his decision regarding for whom he would vote.

There just seems to be a double-standard here regarding this interview form. A lot of adults have come to their views over time and later in life, but they expect a 24 year old guy to have fully developed positions on this stuff? What about a daughter who holds different views on theonomy or agrarianism than her parents? I hope no one is really using this form without modifying it - a lot!

 

[Herald]

I would also toss out the question asking the guy how he voted in the last election. Instead I would be more interested in hear how he makes his decision regarding for whom he would vote.

There just seems to be a double-standard here regarding this interview form. A lot of adults have come to their views over time and later in life, but they expect a 24 year old guy to have fully developed positions on this stuff? What about a daughter who holds different views on theonomy or agrarianism than her parents? I hope no one is really using this form without modifying it - a lot!

Carolyn - it's called "tongue-in-cheek"...."humor".....which is based in truth. Plus, if it takes the guy 45 years to come to the right views, then I guess he was never meant to date my daughter.

 

[Coram Deo]

Carolyn - it's called "tongue-in-cheek"...."humor".....which is based in truth. Plus, if it takes the guy 45 years to come to the right views, then I guess he was never meant to date my daughter.

 

[Kevin]

Do what my father in-law did....

Phone interviewed me for 4 hours seperated into two halves. Asked every theological question he can think of and asked every personal question about my life...

Next he asked for two personal references and a Pastoral reference....
He told me he would get back to me..

He then called all 3 references and called me back asking if I would like to come down for dinner one weekend.. Courtship followed restricted to his house for a year...

We got married....

Since then, we are considered heretics by him because of our theological changes... We are no longer pre trib dispensationalist and a few other changes....

oh well...

Michael

If you are becoming reformed, brother then he must not have asked the correct questions!

 

[Coram Deo]

I was in no way reformed at that time... Her family and I were Dispensational Calvinist... Sovereign Grace Baptist....

He even asked if I was a PreTribber and such and at the time I was a die hard PreTribber.....

A year after we were married my wife and I started down the path of Reforming.....

He found out we gave up dispensationalism and he had a cow....

Oh well...

Michael

If you are becoming reformed, brother then he must not have asked the correct questions!

 

[LadyFlynt]

Past sin does play a role to a certain extent for some ppl. Some ppl don't want someone that has been around the block with several other ppl first, and you can't blame them.

 

[Davidius]

Past sin does play a role to a certain extent for some ppl. Some ppl don't want someone that has been around the block with several other ppl first, and you can't blame them.

Are you saying you think it's reasonable for someone to reject a godly, repentant person because of their past?

 

[tdowns]

I agree.

Well, personally, I don't think that's a biblically legitimate reason to refuse courtship/marriage for your son/daughter.

I'm sure glad my past wasn't held against me......I don't want my daughter's marrying a man like me pre-regeneration, but I'd be happy if they married a man like me post.....

This whole topic stresses me out actually, with one daughter in college, one 13, and one 6.....I'd really like to just move to an island till they are 30......."Lord Bring Godly men into their lives!"

 

[KMK]

The Lord has blessed me with two good friends who have daughters older than my own. One believes in dating (with lots of counseling and prayer) and the other in courtship. I get to watch and learn from their mistakes!

My courtship believing friend looks at it as the prospective boy is actually courting him, as well as his daughter. I thought this was a good way to look at it.

I teach my boys that the father has the authority over the daughter until she is married. Therefore, they need to respect God's system and treat her father with the respect that God says he deserves.

 

[Davidius]

The Lord has blessed me with two good friends who have daughters older than my own. One believes in dating (with lots of counseling and prayer) and the other in courtship.

What exactly is the difference? I thought courtship was dating with lots of counseling and prayer.

 

[HuguenotHelpMeet]

I agree that the Father has authority over the daughter until she's married-unless he refuses a Christian couple marriage/courtship for reasons that aren't biblically legitimate. There's a difference between headship and tyranny.

This may also be helpful to the discussion.

 

[KMK]

What exactly is the difference? I thought courtship was dating with lots of counseling and prayer.

That is an excellent question. I understand the terms this way:

Dating: Boy and girl decide to 'go out'. Boy and girl decide where to go and what to do and they do it without parental supervision. The boy and the girl date for the fun of it. Dating is 'recreational'.

Courtship: Boy asks father for permission to enter into courtship with his daughter. The father and the daughter both get to know the boy. The boy and the girl do not do anything without a chaperone. Courtship is a trial period to see if the father and the daughter find the boy desirable for marraige. The boy, likewise, to see if the daughter is desirable for marraige. Courtship serves a purpose.

Those definitions are off the top of my head and I am sure that those who have done more reading on the subject could probably do a better job.

 

[KMK]

There's a difference between headship and tyranny.

This is a truth in many spheres of life.

 

[Davidius]

That is an excellent question. I understand the terms this way:

Dating: Boy and girl decide to 'go out'. Boy and girl decide where to go and what to do and they do it without parental supervision. The boy and the girl date for the fun of it. Dating is 'recreational'.

Courtship: Boy asks father for permission to enter into courtship with his daughter. The father and the daughter both get to know the boy. The boy and the girl do not do anything without a chaperone. Courtship is a trial period to see if the father and the daughter find the boy desirable for marraige. The boy, likewise, to see if the daughter is desirable for marraige. Courtship serves a purpose.

Those definitions are off the top of my head and I am sure that those who have done more reading on the subject could probably do a better job.

Ok...well, that sounds similar to how I would've defined the two, although I would consider my relationship with my girlfriend a courtship even though we don't always have a chaperone. But you said that one of your friends allows "dating with counsel and prayer," which seems quite different from the definition of dating you just gave and quite similar to courtship.

*shrug*

 

[Me Died Blue]

Well, personally, I don't think that's a biblically legitimate reason to refuse courtship/marriage for your son/daughter.

Indeed. This reminds me of the "Desiring a Pure Wife" discussion we had here a few years ago with a lot of good posts and clarification...but I can't seem to find it here or in the archives for the life of me.

 

[LadyFlynt]

Call it a matter of preference. You prefer the person courting your child to be likeminded with the family in most areas. You might also prefer a person that is pure in certain ways. Why? Because some sins still carry the consequences years later and you might not want your child having to deal with the consequences caused by another. Yes, it is reasonable to turn away certain suitors based upon the conditions of their previous life/lifestyle.

 

[LadyFlynt]

Preference is fine, but to out right reject courtship/marriage on those grounds is not biblical.

Joshua, this is why I mentioned that it might "play a role"...not neccesarily determine it from the offset. Circumstances and type of issues would be taken into consideration. But you can't tell me that you would except a repentant person with no knowledge of their past or what might follow them for your little girl. There are things to be considered. I'm not trying to sound ungracious. These are things my husband and I even took into consideration during our courtship. I've watched the effects on marriages that certain kinds of past sins can have.