Thread: David Chilton yea or nay?

Have any of you read 'Days of Vengeance'? I am told it was written before he became a preterist. What do we do with works written by men who later adopt some stange heresy? What do I do with all of my Douglas Wilson books etc?

I really don't get much use out of DoV. The book is one of GNs less satisfactory editing jobs. And he deserves most of the blame for the book in its final form. He tried to make Chilton rework the thing into a "5-part covenantal scheme" motif, after the thing was already written.

I agree with Bahnsen's low rating of DoV. The book suffers from Jordan-esque "hermeneutical maximalism". I expect that from an orthodox-preterist perspective, Gentry's book (when it is finally complete) will be vastly superior. And I say this without any real prejudice for or against their positions. I agree with the "early date" for Rev. written. But I'm more of an amillenialist.

As for what to do with books by people you don't buy-to-read anymore: classify them by subject, decide which still have some use for you, depending on the subject matter. And shelve or dump them accordingly. No mere human author deserves to be read uncritically anyway.

That's a really good point. You don't have to throw out everything just because somebody has drifted into error.

I've kept all my Wilson books. He always had to be read with a critical eye as he tends to be strident about peculiar inferences. He does have some good things to say in the way of the family. It's not as if everything he said before his involvement with the Federal Vision developed was completely off the mark. One of my frustrations about his current error is that he used to have a voice within Presbyterianism that rightfully criticized some of the need for more diligence within the home.

I honestly believe that since he was known for being one of the leading proponents for the home that it's become a false dichotomy for many - you're either FV and believe in the family and the Covenant or you're just for dead orthodoxy. It's kind of a consistent refrain that the FV "masses" repeat as if that's really what's at stake.

Sorry to sidetrack from Chilton but you brought up Wilson.

Ken, I agree with Pastor Bruce that it is not his best book. I however do have a bit more sympathy for DoV in particular and David Chilton in general, mostly for personal reasons.

As far as his 'heretical" views I would be a bit more hesitant to go that far. He did not advocate any such views in print and his alledged lapse came after recovering from a coma. He is almost always cited by the heretical preterists as though his name is a talisman that will relieve them of the stigma of heresy.

I spoke with Ken Gentry about this alleged change in view by Chilton prior to his death, and he was aware that Chilton was considering the case for some of these views (and being agressivly courted by some) however he and other were engaged in dialogue with Chilton on this issue at the time of his death.

Dr Gentry took the view that we should be careful to ascribe to Chilton a view he had openly written against just because he was discussing it with some people at the time of his death. He never edited any of his published works, he never issued any new ones advocating this view, and in Gods providence he was taken home before any of those things happened.

So lets give him the benifit of the doubt, and grant him the charity that we all look for when debating complex issues of theology.

I would have to disagree. In my opinion, Days of Vengeance is the best commentary, by far, ever written on the Book of Revelation.

For me, it is a yea plus...

That said, I can't wait for Gentry's book to come out. Always room for improvements.

Originally Posted by SemperFideles

That's a really good point. You don't have to throw out everything just because somebody has drifted into error.

I've kept all my Wilson books. He always had to be read with a critical eye as he tends to be strident about peculiar inferences. He does have some good things to say in the way of the family. It's not as if everything he said before his involvement with the Federal Vision developed was completely off the mark. One of my frustrations about his current error is that he used to have a voice within Presbyterianism that rightfully criticized some of the need for more diligence within the home.

I honestly believe that since he was known for being one of the leading proponents for the home that it's become a false dichotomy for many - you're either FV and believe in the family and the Covenant or you're just for dead orthodoxy. It's kind of a consistent refrain that the FV "masses" repeat as if that's really what's at stake.

Sorry to sidetrack from Chilton but you brought up Wilson.

The reason I asked about Wilson was for the very reasons you adressed. My wife and I have amassed quite a bit of material on 'the home' and some of Wilson's is excellent. I especially enjoy his 'pull no puches' approach to sexual sin in 'Fidelity'. I have a hard time (maybe I shouldn't) reccomending the book because I do not want to give the impression that I support what he is teaching now.

Originally Posted by Kevin

Ken, I agree with Pastor Bruce that it is not his best book. I however do have a bit more sympathy for DoV in particular and David Chilton in general, mostly for personal reasons.

As far as his 'heretical" views I would be a bit more hesitant to go that far. He did not advocate any such views in print and his alledged lapse came after recovering from a coma. He is almost always cited by the heretical preterists as though his name is a talisman that will relieve them of the stigma of heresy.

I spoke with Ken Gentry about this alleged change in view by Chilton prior to his death, and he was aware that Chilton was considering the case for some of these views (and being agressivly courted by some) however he and other were engaged in dialogue with Chilton on this issue at the time of his death.

Dr Gentry took the view that we should be careful to ascribe to Chilton a view he had openly written against just because he was discussing it with some people at the time of his death. He never edited any of his published works, he never issued any new ones advocating this view, and in Gods providence he was taken home before any of those things happened.

So lets give him the benifit of the doubt, and grant him the charity that we all look for when debating complex issues of theology.

I did not know this. Thank you for that info. I must admit that the only reason I believed Chilton died a hyper-preterist is because that is what a hyper-preterist told me.

As an aside, it is interesting that the hyper-preterists out of one mouth preach that we should give no weight to the espert counsel of the church, and then with the other mouth make up a story about how a respected church theologian advocated their position.

It looks to me like Chilton became a full preterist. Here is an email exchange with Chilton. Here are some other relevant things.

Originally Posted by Scott

It looks to me like Chilton became a full preterist. Here is an email exchange with Chilton. Here are some other relevant things.

From the forward to Steven's book:

I am particularly impressed by two arguments:

Stevens presents a powerful case that the Second Coming of Jesus Christ occurred in A.D. 70.

At the very most we can say that Chilton was impressed by Stevens and thought that Stevens presented a powerful case for hyperpreterism.

Originally Posted by KMK

Have any of you read 'Days of Vengeance'? I am told it was written before he became a preterist. What do we do with works written by men who later adopt some stange heresy? What do I do with all of my Douglas Wilson books etc?

You could give all the books you don't want to me.

Originally Posted by Scott

It looks to me like Chilton became a full preterist. Here is an email exchange with Chilton. Here are some other relevant things.

I agree with the e-mail from Gary North quoted above. Rev Chilton was affected by his coma and both his mind and theology seemed to be affected. The fact that he was taken home prior to doing anymore than send a few e-mails to some people may be a sign of Gods grace.

Those who knew him best doubted that he was functioning well when he said/wrote those things (incl. his own dear wife!!). Remember he was a dying man in those months and remember him for what he said, and wrote when he was well, and not for what he was toying with in his final hours.

Oh, the dramatic side of me is dying to know more about this piece of history! Any link / info on what exactly happened with Chilton? Also, what is this Gentry book you're talking about? I know Dr. Gentry's person and a bit of his history, but what exactly is this book he's writing? It sounds as though it's a much-anticipated title. Is it a commentary upon the whole of John's Revelation?