An article in Christianity today had some interesting quotes about NPP/FV and the road to Roman Catholicism:

Not All Evangelicals and Catholics Together | Christianity Today | A Magazine of Evangelical Conviction

"I have no doubt that the New Perspective and Federal Vision have had an effect on the Protestant-Catholic debate," Beckwith told Christianity Today. "I have met several former evangelical Protestants who have told me that Wright's work in particular helped them to better appreciate the Catholic view of grace."

Referring to former-protestant and blogger Taylor Marshal:

"Marshall said he speaks with new Catholic converts every month, about half of whom have been "deeply influenced" by Wright.

'If you buy into Wright's approach to covenantal theology, then you've already taken three steps toward the Catholic Church. Keep following the trail and you'll be Catholic,' said Marshall".

What do you think of this? Granted that not everyone who subscribes to the FV will end up at Rome, is there really a credible connection here? If so, why?

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Louis DiBiase
Louisville, KY

I was just reading about this myself. I found an article by Taylor Marshall who writes about the FV from a Catholic perspective.

Marshall was a fomer member of the PCA and now is a Catholic. He attended Westminster Theological Seminary.


Taylor Marshall gives “The Catholic Perspective on the Federal Vision” Journey to Rome

Anyone who doesn't think FV is dangerous should read this article. Marshall, a Catholic, in the last paragraph states:

Ultimately, I think that younger Presbyterians will gravitate toward what the Federal Vision offers. Many will sink their teeth into it and many will find it wanting. Many will discover that the Catholic Church is their true home, and many will discover her in a great moment of joy. This Federal Vision is really only a peek into the keyhole of the Catholic Church. The Federal Visionist has a vision of the beautiful things inside, but they have not yet appreciated the warmth of a true home.

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Mike
PCA
Edmond, OK

"Tomorrow may be our dying day; let this be our repenting day."

-Thomas Watson

The NPP and the FV IS Popery.

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Gil Garcia
Rehoboth Reformed Church (RCUS)
La Habra, CA

"Ignorance of this distinction between Law and Gospel is one of the principal sources of the abuses which corrupted and still corrupt Christianity." - Calvin's successor


"By the words of the law man is admonished and taught, not what he can do, but what he ought to do. How is it that you theologians are twice as stupid as schoolboys, in that as soon as you get hold of a single imperative verb you infer an indicative meaning...?"
-Martin Luther, The Bondage of the Will

For a Presbyterian seminarian to say, in effect,

the gospel doesn't matter,

let alone the authority of Scripture, the mediatorial reign of our Lord, the authority of the Lord over His Church on earth... is not an example of "coming home."

And also, keep this in perspective- there are many people going from the Roman Church toward evangelical Christianity. Most reformed churches see this happen on a regular basis.

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Scott
PCA
North Carolina


"Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised)"
Hebrews 10:23

I had a Reformed friend who started to get heavy into NPP and FV. He is now an Episcopalian priest. It's not just theoretical. Lives are changed for the worse by this stuff. Its too bad it wasn't just a 'theological debate.' Nothing ever is. We are what we think (Prov 23:7)

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Steve
Pastoral Intern, RPCNA
Ottawa, CA

Statements like this are overboard and more inflammatory than illuminating to doctrinal errors. I do not believe this to be true.

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Norseman Moderator

R. Martin Snyder
1689er
http://www.puritanboard.com/blogs/puritancovenanter/

"Our object should not be to have scripture on our side but to be on the side of scripture; and however dear any sentiment may have become by being long entertained, so soon as it is seen to be contrary to the Bible, we must be prepared to abandon it without hesitation."
William Symington

Click to get:Board Rules -- Signature Requirements -- Suggestions?

Answer: Yes, with a van full of candy and an Xbox 360. (kidding, I have no idea what I am talking about.)

__________________
Andrew DeShazo
Husband of Kathryn
Father of Phillip-Giles B. DeShazo
Deacon
Associate Reformed Presbyterian Church, Memphis, TN
"From out of the depth of unbroken Infinfity arose the Question, "Who am I?" And to that Question there is the answer, "I am God!" -Meher Baba, died 1969.

"I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." Christ, died 33 AD, ressurected three days later.

I thought this was an interesting article related to that topic . . .

The Happy T.R.: Popery Isn't The Nice Smelling Stuff in Your Wife's Underwear Drawer

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Brian Eschen
Ruling Elder, PCA
Pleasanton, California

The fact that NPP and FV think in corporate categories, while Romanism operates largely in personal categories with respect to justification and righteousness should give us pause about so strong an assertion; the fact that Romanism speaks of justification as an infusion of a habit of charity, while the NPP specifically refutes such a notion should give us pause about so strong an assertion; &c. The differences between the two are vast and deep.

This does not mean that we can't draw parallels between the two; or that we can't assert a connection between leaving Reformed churches for the FV and for Rome. Many things which the NPP has brought forward were also condemned in previous ages of the church. But, simply put, the "movements" are far from the same thing.

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Paul Korte
OPC
Flint, MI

They who perceive in themselves discoveries of the divine goodness, so full and absolutely perfect, and who make them the subject of earnest meditation, will never embrace new doctrines, by which the very grace they feel so powerfully in themselves is thrown into the shade. --John Calvin

Click to get: Board Rules -- Signature Requirements -- Suggestions?

I'm no expert in the details of this but think I understand what you are saying. On a very thoughtful, philosophical level there might appear to be a different approach.

But I'm afraid they both get to the same place.

When someone in any sense comes to believe that they are "earning" salvation, whether by going to church or being baptized, there is a similarity with the Roman system.

The idea that one is "united" to Christ, but might lose it if they go outside the church or don't do enough sacraments or works is one thing this set of teachings really confuses.

Confusion is one of the hallmarks of this serious error. Some within it are stridently false, but more than anything they confuse basic biblical truths.

We know confusion, particularly through those who would presume to lead God's people, is not a godly characteristic or fruit.

That confusion, which is about the gospel, at its heart, leads one to believe that in some way, perhaps corporately they are earning their salvation, or keeping up their salvation.

This shift away from faith in Christ's righteousness alone is the commonality with Rome.

It comports with our sin and the effects of the fall to believe that in some way we can be "good enough" or "do enough" to merit God's perfect standard.

If the whole of Scripture reveals one thing- it is that man cannot possibly do that and desperately needs grace and a Savior.

Nothing bothers self-centered, self-justifying sinners more than the fact they are absolutely, totally dependent on God's grace to save them.

Bad doctrine, in the end, always leads away from true Christianity. What camp of error (fringe denomination/cult/movement etc.) you end up in is determined by the tenets of defective teaching you package together. Paul cried in Acts 20 (my emphasis v31) because he knew what was in store for those in the future.

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Rich Koster
1689'er
Browns Mills NJ USA
Often Goofy Reformed Eccentric
Romans 7:14-25