Thread: Children on the Mission Field

I have been reading the discussion about guns and self-defense.

Many people seem to agree it is not good for missionaries to go around using guns for self-defense.

Someone brought up the fact though that families often go on the mission field. To put aside the right of self-defense then is to put aside the right then to defend their lives as well (wife & children).

My question is should families go on the mission field? Or if they should what limits etc... are there?

Let me tell you a story.

My great uncle was a missionary with his family in _____. There was a civil war going on but they thought they were safe well behind the front lines. Over time however these lines drew ever closer yet he chose to stay and minister to the locals. One day they were warned that rebels were only hours away. My great uncle packed up his family and fled a few miles back to a Catholic mission station where all the westerners were seeking protection together. The idea was it was not their fight. Huddle in numbers and wait for the fighting to finish before going back out.

The front drew closer still. Rebel planes flew overhead and the village they had been in was bombed. A day later rebels began to fall in around the mission station as they fought government troops. The mission station fell. All those inside were taken to a death camp. They were tortured and one day all the males, including my great uncle and his sons, were taken outside and shot before a firing squad. Only one son survived who played dead. But he lived to remember seeing his three brothers and father die. He was sent back down to be with the women who were raped and tortured still.

The next day mercenaries from _____ came up the river and blew apart rebel lines. After a few hours of fighting the mercenaries had cleared the surrounding area and liberated those still in the death camp. Survivors evacuated.

As you can imagine those were went through this were scared. The father's sacrifice for the gospel because a sacrifice for the whole family. Those children of his who survived (a son and a daughter) would always remember their treatment and have since strongly disagreed with their father's decision to stay. They blame their parents for a lost childhood and a lost family. Was it right to take them onto such a journey in the first place?

I don't know.

This is a great question. I left the mission field nearly four years ago for the sake of my family. For us, it was a no-brainer decision. I don't feel comfortable talking about the details on this public forum, but if you want to message me privately, I can fill you in if need be.

The way I looked it was that God made me a husband and father before he made me a missionary, and my calling to protect my wife and children took priority. Moreover, I was not (and still am not) indispensable to God's work. It was his work and if it was his will to continue it without me, he would find other means. I could sleep well at night, resting in God's sovereign will.

Four years later, I have no regrets. It was the right decision.

Thanks for your reply. Obviously we do not want sensitive information posted here.

Recently I heard a prospective missionary tell me he found it hard because he believed where he was going he could well die and he did not know what his 4 year old son would do without him. I wondered if he should be going on the mission field at all but he claimed that God was more important than the joys of family life.

Hello;

I think a lot has to do with what the husband and wife decide together and what their appropriate level of risk is.


If a missionary and his wife decide that a people group needs to be reached and they do go and count the costs and it turns badly for them, a husband need not feel guilty or taking them overseas in the first place.

Living ANYWHERE is a risk and though he has the duty to minimize risks as much as possible, in order to live and minister in a place one has to take on the risks of that place. Safety is only one factor. The need for the Gospel is a legitimate opposing factor that may cause us to give up our safety and our family's.



If a father was ALWAYS required to choose the "safest" path for his family than they would be incapicitated from doing almost any sort of ministry.

IF a father was obligated not to choose paths in life for the sake of having sons growing up without a daddy then every single military man in the US right now is sinning if they decide to stay in the US military. If we are to not go overseas to spread the Gospel certainly we shouldn't risk orphaning our children for the policies of a government.



Of course, for individual families, some risks may become intolerable. Situations are different. One family here got into a ongoing feud with locals and they ended up leaving due to personal threats. I don't blame them. However, if me and my family are killed over here, I also expect people not to blame me.



A Southern Baptist team of singles and young marrieds without children in Africa were evangelizing a remote tribe. The team was constituted this way due to high risks. The people greatly respected them, but no covnerts occurred in 7 years. Finally they learned the reason....none of the Christians that came to evangelize them had any families. The locals had concluded that becoming Christian either barred you from marriage or made you sterile because the missionaries that came were not "family men" and the locals were more family-oriented than the missionaries.


Some of the most hostile lands in the world (i.e. Religion of Peace) are often most effectively served by single women and families.

Much of overseas "evangelism" occurs as locals see your family's interactions. The Gospel is shown to people in the context of family life and always is noticed and becomes a major focal point and thus an opportunity for teaching. They cannot read Scriptures often, but they read you and not beating your wife and being kind and teaching your kids really gets local people talking. One's family becomes one credentials of holiness and a jumping off point for evangelism and proof that Christianity is true. Many, many spiritual conversations have been started by the witness of a united Christian family.



For me, even if I were an atheist, I would choose to raise my children here. The almost oppressive hold that American culture has over US kids is frightening. It is hard to shield one's kids away from the all pervasive cultural influences that bombard you from every angle. Here, I can raise my kids to my own choosing. Though physically much more dangerous it is spiritually safer for my family than the sneaking yet smothering influence of the West.


Finally, I am to spiritual nurture my kids, not always to provide them the absolute most and the safest environment possible. And on the mission field this spiritual nurture almost seems easier than in my own culture.


Finally, most all mission fields are not as extreme as the example above given. Through caution one can minimize some threats. We have several friends who were temporarily evacuated from a troubled African nation and this seemed a wife move; now the situation has clamed and they are rejoicing for being able to enter this needy nation once more.

I thoroughly agree with raising children overseas. The vast majority of "Christian" children in the states have totally absorbed cultural humanism and are rampant materialists. MK's and exclusively homeschooled children are the exception.

As a slightly off-topic question, am I doing a grave disfavor to the parentless little ones whom I send to Christian families in the states, knowing that most of them will go to public schools and end up as practical enemies of the kingdom of God?

That is a really interesting point about raising kids in the west. I know when I have travelled I have something thought (even though a long way from having kids) that some parts of the developing world would be a great place to raise families.

Perhaps it becomes a balance of risk - a risk of orphaning your children balanced against them being raised in a corrupt western culture? Or have a read you wrong.

My kids were raised in Africa, and there is good and bad involved, but it would take me pages just to develop this. To speak to the subject that this branched off of, only a very twisted view of the Bible, specifically a perverse disregard for Biblical law would cause a person to question the use of corperal punishment and even deadly force to protect one's family. Beating a person to a pulp on more than one occasion actually improved my reputation in a hard area in Africa.

And make no mistake. Western culture is far superior than anywhere else. There are problems, but nothing like the problems of the third world. Let's not let liberal guilt or a romantic view of savages carry us away.

Originally Posted by TimV

And make no mistake. Western culture is far superior than anywhere else. There are problems, but nothing like the problems of the third world. Let's not let liberal guilt or a romantic view of savages carry us away.

While I agree with your statement, is it possible that some cultures are less "infectious" than others? By this I mean the bad sides of them are more clingy than the good? I am not sure how to word it. Is there a point where the sins in western culture are more marketable than sins in others? So it is easier to protect children from these sins in the developing world? Not sure if I agree with this or not but just passing it around.

Originally Posted by Leslie

I thoroughly agree with raising children overseas. The vast majority of "Christian" children in the states have totally absorbed cultural humanism and are rampant materialists. MK's and exclusively homeschooled children are the exception.

As a slightly off-topic question, am I doing a grave disfavor to the parentless little ones whom I send to Christian families in the states, knowing that most of them will go to public schools and end up as practical enemies of the kingdom of God?

Oh, Mary, surely the love of Christian parents who will teach them of Christ is worth the risk! As time goes on, hopefully more US parents will see the harm in public schools. But as the parent of an internationally adopted child, I am a great advocate for Christians adopting orphans.

As one raised mostly in SE Asia as a dependent, and having known many an MK attending MK boarding schools, I can assure you that the influence of the cultures I was in was no improvement over western culture. I smoked, drank, did drugs, and engaged in sexual sin at a much earlier age than my stateside cousins. The only 'advantage' I can think of is that having caught VD twice before my 15th birthday and having gotten tired of the alcohol blurred bar scene moved me to swear off prostitutes and pubs at the ripe old age of 15. When I returned stateside, my cousins were just getting into all that while I had settled into a more epicurean rather than hedonistic approach to my debauchery. I would rather party and 'maintain' than go full out stupid. Not much of an advantage, though. It just meant I got away with those things longer, and thus faced less chastening for it, chastening that I needed.

In my 70's experience, MK's were among the wildest when let free to run. Many attended an MK boarding school in Manila, and they were pretty out of control. Maybe it's improved since those days.

I think it must also depend on country. Some places I have been you wouldn't dare drink or break the law so a missionary kid growing up there would not have those influences. On the other hand in a more open developing country they may end up worse of.

Originally Posted by Abd_Yesua_alMasih

I think it must also depend on country. Some places I have been you wouldn't dare drink or break the law so a missionary kid growing up there would not have those influences. On the other hand in a more open developing country they may end up worse of.

If you mean muslim countries, I knew many who spent time in muslim African nations, as well as Afghanistan, Indonesia and Maylaysia, and I can assure you they were no better. Muslims love to smoke weed and hashish, and in those days it was everywhere. The Arabs I knew in Manila always had the very strongest weed.

Many Muslims have a weak spot for homosexual behavior, and that can spread as well.

In Africa and PNG there is that added overwhelming sense of envy, which poisons everything, including trying to lift the people up out of poverty. They often don't want a neighbor to succeed. Instead of trying to keep up with the Joneses they'd rather pull the Joneses down to their level.

That's certainly not to say we can't learn from other cultures, and that other cultures have aspects that are superior to ours, like traditional hospitality etc... It's just to say that the vast majority of those people would love to trade places with us.

I see your point.

Originally Posted by TimV

My kids were raised in Africa, and there is good and bad involved, but it would take me pages just to develop this. To speak to the subject that this branched off of, only a very twisted view of the Bible, specifically a perverse disregard for Biblical law would cause a person to question the use of corperal punishment and even deadly force to protect one's family. Beating a person to a pulp on more than one occasion actually improved my reputation in a hard area in Africa.

And make no mistake. Western culture is far superior than anywhere else. There are problems, but nothing like the problems of the third world. Let's not let liberal guilt or a romantic view of savages carry us away.

Who has romantic notions? The smell alone for me ends any romanticism really quick, or seeing your neighbors picking and eating lice out of each others' hair doesn't domuch either.


Western culture has many advantages. But the comment about "infectiveness" is appropriate here. I have an easier time shielding my kids from the local culture than if I would be in the States.

Don't ask a fish about water because he is too close to it (plus, I don't speak fish). Leaving the grip of the West allows me to more selectively filter what aspects of Western culture gets through to my kids. Foreign sins always seem worse and we are not as aware of our own culture's failings until we step away a bit. Yes, most people would love to trade their culture for ours, but not due to a sense of our superiority but because we have more "stuff."


Brad, you're statements about missionary kids is untrue. On the whole they do better than others, but because they are more visible I guess a bad seeds gets more attention. The same about the myth about preacher's kids.

[QUOTE=Pergamum;435921]Hello;


IF a father was obligated not to choose paths in life for the sake of having sons growing up without a daddy then every single military man in the US right now is sinning if they decide to stay in the US military. If we are to not go overseas to spread the Gospel certainly we shouldn't risk orphaning our children for the policies of a government.



I think there is a difference, for one thing a man in the military is not taking his family with him into battle. Usually the family is left behind or stationed somewhere safe. The man usually goes alone. When we are speaking of missionaries, that usually includes the whole family. And there are times when they are indeed going into the battle field. I don't think it is fair to compare the two.

Brad, you're statements about missionary kids is untrue. On the whole they do better than others, but because they are more visible I guess a bad seeds gets more attention. The same about the myth about preacher's kids.

Perhaps that is true, Pergs. But I would recommend you look at some MK online stuff like MKPlanet, and find out about Third Culture Kids in general. Its not all a bed of roses (of course nothing ever is).

I have a neighbor, friend, and brother who was born and raised entirely in Bolivia at a remote mission airstrip and supply facility. He experienced severe culture shock when he came stateside for college, and had a difficult time adjusting. There remains a great deal of bitterness towards his father for raising him in such an unreal setting irrelavent to what his life would be when he came back home. He is, in his later 40's, still very much a "fish out of water" just about everywhere he's been since. I am one of very few people he is able to discuss these things with here because I've had similar, but far less isolated, experience.

I know it's a difficult subject, bro, and I meant no indictment of the choices you have made.... you know the situation you're in better than anybody here. But I do pray you have considered all the aspects knowledgeably. When kids are young as yours are shielding them is easier. As time progresses and your kids become culturally and linguistically assimilated there they will certainly move among the locals more easily than you ever will be able to, not having the childhood entrenchment they will experience. That can have both good and bad consequences, I suppose, but on some level you will be an outsider looking in, and that alone can be a source of distress. Just be careful, as I know you are, and we'll be praying for both your work and your family. We'll trust God to bless and protect them both.

[quote=Mindaboo;436369]

Originally Posted by Pergamum

Hello;


IF a father was obligated not to choose paths in life for the sake of having sons growing up without a daddy then every single military man in the US right now is sinning if they decide to stay in the US military. If we are to not go overseas to spread the Gospel certainly we shouldn't risk orphaning our children for the policies of a government.



I think there is a difference, for one thing a man in the military is not taking his family with him into battle. Usually the family is left behind or stationed somewhere safe. The man usually goes alone. When we are speaking of missionaries, that usually includes the whole family. And there are times when they are indeed going into the battle field. I don't think it is fair to compare the two.

Read my statement again. If we are to not take any path that would make our children orphans then we could not be in the military. Not just endangering childrens' lives but also the risk of making them orphans was listed as a reason to not serve in hard places and so I am countering this one reason as also ruling out military services. My analogy still applies. THe fear of orphaning children would rule out even a man going in alone to a dangerous tribe or mixing too closely with the Religion of Peace.

Even in missions, the man usually goes in first, and alone before he makes a home or secures peace or a promise from locals. Within their ability, missionaries evacuate banana republics when dictator A is being replaced by Dictator B. We merely don't just rely on God and needlessly endanger ourselves. We minimize the known hazards and trust that the task is worth some risks.

Oh, Mary, surely the love of Christian parents who will teach them of Christ is worth the risk! As time goes on, hopefully more US parents will see the harm in public schools. But as the parent of an internationally adopted child, I am a great advocate for Christians adopting orphans.

If they're Christian and take parenting seriously...

We too are parents of adopted children and I would say that they are almost always better off healthy in the US than starving or stealing to get by in their home country.

However, I know that adoption agency workers that I've spoken to do dispair to a degree over those parents who adopt internationally, get the children home, and then, when they need to sit for a while and get their bearings, instead put them into school. These children have just been taken away from everything familiar, everything they've ever known, and been thrown in with the teeming masses of angst-ridden and culturally-desponant youth in the US. It's just not healthy (so Mary, I understand your concern!)

Originally Posted by Brad

Brad, you're statements about missionary kids is untrue. On the whole they do better than others, but because they are more visible I guess a bad seeds gets more attention. The same about the myth about preacher's kids.

Perhaps that is true, Pergs. But I would recommend you look at some MK online stuff like MKPlanet, and find out about Third Culture Kids in general. Its not all a bed of roses (of course nothing ever is).

I have a neighbor, friend, and brother who was born and raised entirely in Bolivia at a remote mission airstrip and supply facility. He experienced severe culture shock when he came stateside for college, and had a difficult time adjusting. There remains a great deal of bitterness towards his father for raising him in such an unreal setting irrelavent to what his life would be when he came back home. He is, in his later 40's, still very much a "fish out of water" just about everywhere he's been since. I am one of very few people he is able to discuss these things with here because I've had similar, but far less isolated, experience.

I know it's a difficult subject, bro, and I meant no indictment of the choices you have made.... you know the situation you're in better than anybody here. But I do pray you have considered all the aspects knowledgeably. When kids are young as yours are shielding them is easier. As time progresses and your kids become culturally and linguistically assimilated there they will certainly move among the locals more easily than you ever will be able to, not having the childhood entrenchment they will experience. That can have both good and bad consequences, I suppose, but on some level you will be an outsider looking in, and that alone can be a source of distress. Just be careful, as I know you are, and we'll be praying for both your work and your family. We'll trust God to bless and protect them both.

Here's some relevant articles:


http://www.ijfm.org/PDFs_IJFM/23_4_PDFs/Ward.pdf


http://www.ijfm.org/PDFs_IJFM/23_4_PDFs/Sharp.pdf

http://www.ijfm.org/PDFs_IJFM/23_4_PDFs/cameron.pdf


http://www.ijfm.org/PDFs_IJFM/23_4_PDFs/wintermk.pdf










Here's a funny list that seems true here for my kids and kids I know:



You Know You're a Missionary Kid When...

You can't answer the question, "Where are you from?"

You speak two languages, but can't spell in either.

You flew before you could walk.

The U.S. is a foreign country.

You have a passport, but no driver's license.

You have a time zone map next to your telephone.

You would rather eat seaweed than cafeteria food.

Your life story uses the phrase "Then we went to..." five times.

You watch nature documentaries, and you think about how good that would be if it were fried.

You think in grams, meters, and liters.

You speak with authority on the quality of airline travel.

You send your family peanut butter and Kool-Aid for Christmas.

National Geographic makes you homesick.

You have strong opinions about how to cook bugs.

You sort your friends by continent.

You keep dreaming of a green Christmas.

You tell people where you're from, and their eyes get big.

The nationals say, "Oh, I knew an American once..." and then ask if you know him or her [and you DO]

You are grateful for the speed and efficiency of the U.S. Postal Service.

You realize that furlough is not a vacation.

You know what REAL coffee tastes like.

The majority of your friends don't speak English as a first language.

Someone brings up the name of a team, and you get the sport wrong.

You believe vehemently that football is played with a round, spotted ball.

You know there is no such thing as an international language.

You know the difference between patriotism and nationalism.

You never take anything for granted.

You know how to pack.

All preaching sounds better under a corrugated tin roof.

When guests come to your house and bring a fish as a gift.

Going to the post office is the highlight of your day.

When you sing songs to yourself in a language other than English.

When you mother gets excited over finding Doritos at 7-11.

When on deputation you have memorized Dad's messages.

When after the church service you look for a slide projector to put away.

When wearing shoes in the house sounds disgusting.

You get excited to find cokes are on sale for only 99 cents.

You carry Bibles in two languages to church.

You watch an English language video and read the foreign language subtitles.

When you dream in a foreign language.

You send out birthday invitations in a foreign language.

When you carry a dictionary everywhere you go.

When your five foot tall mother is taller than most of your church members.

Your Dad scolds you in a foreign language.

When you go on furlough your Mom buys everything in the store.

When adults want to pay you to teach them English.

When you can't find shoes to fit your feet in any of the shoe stores.

When you would rather sleep on the floor than on the bed.

When the family gathers around the computer to check the E-mail.

When you enjoy getting together with other MK's and talking about old news.

When all your clothes have been worn by someone else.

When at your yard sale the 80 year old man next door buys your mother's culottes.

When you find a seven year old picture of yourself on someone's refrigerator.

When you have carried the same dollar bill in your wallet for four years.

When driving on the right side of the road gives you the willies.

When you have explained the difference between "The cow is on the field" and "The cow is in the field."

When you take a shower before taking a bath.

When you call senior missionaries grandma and grandpa.

When the message on your answering machine is in two languages.

When you move into a new house you take a gift to all your neighbors.

When earthquakes seem normal.

When your Mom sends you out to sweep the street in front of your house.

You consider parasites, dysentery, or tropical diseases to be appropriate dinner conversation.

You tell people what certain gestures mean in different parts of the world.

You have stopped in the middle of an argument to find the translation of a word you just used.

You calculate exchange rates by the price of Coke.

You would rather have a Land Rover Defender than a Lexus.

That's a great list, Pergs. Much of it applies to all third culture kids.

The answer to the question, "Where are you from?" is "When?".

Originally Posted by kvanlaan

Oh, Mary, surely the love of Christian parents who will teach them of Christ is worth the risk! As time goes on, hopefully more US parents will see the harm in public schools. But as the parent of an internationally adopted child, I am a great advocate for Christians adopting orphans.

If they're Christian and take parenting seriously...

We too are parents of adopted children and I would say that they are almost always better off healthy in the US than starving or stealing to get by in their home country.

However, I know that adoption agency workers that I've spoken to do dispair to a degree over those parents who adopt internationally, get the children home, and then, when they need to sit for a while and get their bearings, instead put them into school. These children have just been taken away from everything familiar, everything they've ever known, and been thrown in with the teeming masses of angst-ridden and culturally-desponant youth in the US. It's just not healthy (so Mary, I understand your concern!)

Kevin, I will say that my personal experience is mostly with people adopting young children under school age or infants. So I don't really know anyone who adopted and just stuck a child in a school of any kind. I will tell you that most of the children now (years later) are in schools rather than being homeschooled, but many are in Christian or charter schools. Even though that may not be ideal, I can't say that I think they'd have been better off staying in an orphanage in a communist country.

Originally Posted by Brad

As one raised mostly in SE Asia as a dependent, and having known many an MK attending MK boarding schools, I can assure you that the influence of the cultures I was in was no improvement over western culture. I smoked, drank, did drugs, and engaged in sexual sin at a much earlier age than my stateside cousins. The only 'advantage' I can think of is that having caught VD twice before my 15th birthday and having gotten tired of the alcohol blurred bar scene moved me to swear off prostitutes and pubs at the ripe old age of 15. When I returned stateside, my cousins were just getting into all that while I had settled into a more epicurean rather than hedonistic approach to my debauchery. I would rather party and 'maintain' than go full out stupid. Not much of an advantage, though. It just meant I got away with those things longer, and thus faced less chastening for it, chastening that I needed.

In my 70's experience, MK's were among the wildest when let free to run. Many attended an MK boarding school in Manila, and they were pretty out of control. Maybe it's improved since those days.

The problem stateside is not overt rebellion such as you had. It would be hard to find any location where that is preventable. The problem with raising kids stateside is that the church has incorporated ungodly cultural values. The antithesis between good and evil has been abolished. Missionaries are consumed with keeping their own bodies and souls together, with education and discipleship, and helping others with these things. That's a healthy situation for raising kids. In contrast, stateside culture is consumed with food (to excess), clothes (to look good rather than to cover the body), and entertainment (to squander the resource of time)--just check out any mall.

My kids were raised stateside for which I'm now sorry. We are on the fringes of the Ethiopian missionary community so I'm speaking as an outsider about the healthy, happy, younger families whom we occasionally see. There is much admirable about them.

The last local guests we had stay overnight squatted on my sit-down toilet, couldn't work the shower nobs and so bathed in the sink and used our toothbrushes.

Ha... lots of cultural differences. I was glad to put THEM through culture shock instead of me always being the one confused!

Crossing cultures is hard, but often amusing.

see my blog to see a (so far) happy family oversees: TandTfamily... and PLEASE pray that they stay that way.

I do not take ANYTHING for granted but hug my children hard every day.

One point should be addressed: there are evil influences everywhere. Sin is everywhere. Perhaps it's a little more likely that if my child grows up in North Dakota he'll be a hypocrite, and if he grows up in Chile he'll be a party animal: but either way, he's a sinner (of course you hope and pray and bring him under the means of grace as much as you can). Do you think Cain had a lot of bad cultural influences all around him? It didn't stop him from fratricide. If a person is going to be bitter, they'll find something to be bitter about no matter where they grow up; if a person is going to be discontented they would be discontented with heaven itself. The circumstances of our childhood shape our personalities and to some extent determine the form that our particular sinful life will take; but God's grace is the only thing that counteracts the sin we seek.

And I could identify with too many items off that list!