Approximately 3 minute clip excerpt from a sermon. Would that more ministers have the clarity and courage to call abortion for what it is:

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Mark Van Der Molen
Immanuel URC
DeMotte, Indiana

Amen, Dr. Piper! Amen.

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Dennis E. McFadden, Ex Mainline Baptist (in Remission)
Atherton Baptist Homes, CEO
First Baptist Church of Alhambra, Member, Transformation Ministries (CA)

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heard this on Wretched Radio, loved it!

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Adam - Pennsylvania - Baptist

http://www.myspace.com/aleavelle

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Ben Franks

I attend: Ketoctin Covenant Presbyterian Church (OPC)
in Purcellville, Virginia
I'm a member of: Heartland Community Church (PCA)
in Wichita, Kansas
I blog here (along with my Dad): http://rrfranks.blogspot.com/
And I'm a student here: www.phc.edu

"Remember the speeches we have spoken so often over our mead, when we raised boast on the bench, heroes in the hall, about hard fighting. Now may the man who is bold prove that he is."-Aelfwine at the Battle of Maldon

God bless you John Piper for your courage to speak the truth.

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Michael P Doyle
Waukesha WI
Member of http://www.cornerstone-pca.com/
Attending http://www.lampseminary.org/

'I just wish that Piper would not lower himself to bring politics into the pulpit. God deserves better.'

That is a quote from a 'conservative Reformed' man when he was commenting on this clip.

Made me want to puke.

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We shall not adjust our Bible to the age; but before we have done with it, by God's grace, we shall adjust the age to the Bible. - Charles Haddon Spurgeon

Lawrence Underwood, Jr.
Pastor - Providence Family Fellowship / Mobile, Alabama
1644/46 LBC
My Blog - Imprimis

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Martin - Reformed
Husband to the most godly, honorable and loyal wife Line
Searching for a Church
Webpage www.5solas.dk
Free Online Reformed Seminary - http://www.tnars.net
Soli Deo Gloria

I asked our small group Sunday night how 36 years have passed, we've had countless "Walks for Life" and "Right to Life" campaigns and yet this shame still lingers upon our nation. Does it seem that these Christian activities have been ineffective? Who needs another Walk for Life? Am I missing something?


btw, did Piper include himself when he said "There are those of us who wept for joy at your Inauguration"?

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Donald P. Grubb
theol46@embarqmail.com

Berean Baptist Church, Mansfield, OH
Mansfield, OH

John 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing.
The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

That should be directed to ALL of our elected officials NOT just the president..

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Bobbi Clark
Covenant Member
Pinewood Pres. (PCA) Middleburg

When I kept Silent, My bones wasted away through my groaning all day long. Psalm 32:3

Well, Lawrence, at least one 'conservative Reformed man' thinks differently from that quote, and agrees with you:

Christ Church PCA Blog Archive Standing Firm for Life

-----Added 1/28/2009 at 05:02:18 EST-----

Donald,

As I mentioned to my congregation last Sunday, read 2 Kings 10:28, and ask yourself if you were an Israelite after decades of Ahab rule, if you would have ever dreamed you would hear those words.

That is our hope for the scourge of abortion.

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Fred Greco
Senior Pastor, Christ Church PCA (Katy, TX)
Christ Church Blog

"The heart is the main thing in true religion...It is the hinge and turning-point in the condition of man's soul. If the heart is alive to God and quickened by the Spirit, the man is a living Christian. If the heart is dead and has not the Spirit, the man is dead before God." (J.C. Ryle)

It should make you want to puke. It is really sad how the R2K theology will not even stand up for the unborn.

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Benjamin P. Glaser, M. Div, Licentiate, Associate Reformed Presbyterian Church
Member Fairmount ARP Church
Pittsburgh, PA

Deo Vindice

Amen to the content of this clip!! I too applaud John Piper for having the courage to put this out there.

But, I have to say the timing is horrible! Obama made absolutely no bones about what what his first act as president would be when he was on the campaign trail. It would have been good to have this video circulating then.

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Dan
Member, Soaring Oaks Presbyterian (PCA)
www.soaringoaks.org
Northern California
The duty of a theologian is, not to please the ear with empty sounds, but to confirm the conscience by teaching things which are true, certain and profitable.
John Calvin, 1559

Wow. That is absurd. Since when was murder a political issue? Since when was it a political issue to be avoided? Disgusting.

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Josh Hicks, Chloë's Dad
Christ Covenant Reformed Presbyterian Church, RPCGA
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It is God that multiplies our sorrows.... God, as a righteous Judge, does it, which ought to silence us under all our sorrows; as many as they are, we have deserved them all, and more: nay, God, as a tender Father, does it for our necessary correction, that we may be humbled for sin, and weaned from the world by all our sorrows; and the good we get by them, with the comfort we have under them, will abundantly balance our sorrows, how greatly soever they are multiplied. - Matthew Henry

Dr. Piper is awesome.

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Jessica Auner
Wife, Mother,
Garden City, Ga
Ephesus Church
(a Reformed Baptist church)

Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen.

It has been a political issue ever since Roe v. Wade. Or so we are told. The sad thing is that many in the church have drunk the Kool-Aid.

It is an especially ridiculous accusation to make, given that Piper is not a political preacher.

He also went out of his way to be gracious and submissive to Obama.

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:detective:
Travis Speegle
Redeemer Presbyterian, PCA (Waco, Tx)
Pacific Cross Roads, PCA (Los Angeles, CA)


"When it comes to trustworthy theologians one can usually honor the rule of thumb that the deader the better."-Dr. John Hannah, DTS (of all places)

Whoever made that comment should be ashamed of himself. To claim that abortion is merely a political issue is the rhetoric of the godless.

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[B]Manley Beasley[/B]
Southern Baptist Convention
Fayetteville, Arkansas

[B]Wir sein pettler. Hoc est verum (We are beggars. This is true.).--Luther's dying words[/B]

Hopefully that "man" blots out portions like this from his bible:

Love the clip; but wonder if it is fruitless to EXPECT the world to be anything but the world...to do anything outside of what its father, the devil, does or would do...

simply a thought...not a statement

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http://sedwardwilson.wordpress.com

The Lord can use anyone for His purposes. It is one reason why I think the Church needs more OT history in her preaching. 2 Kings 10 shows us that the unbelieving idolater Jehu was used by God to wipe out Baalism in Israel. Why could he not do that today?

Sorry, I know this is completely off topic, but why do you say Jehu was unbeliever? He did not forsake the sins of idolarty, but he did seem to be a believer in Jehovah.

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Mark
Independent baptist
Singapore

Preaching against killing children has NOTHING to do with politics! Preaching against maiming women who have abortions has NOTHING to do with politics! It is those who PROMOTE abortion who are of the political bent. They use their political agenda for the most evil of purposes and the result is as horrible as all the death camps of the all dictators who sucked this earth of human life.

And, no, I don't feel any better after my rant!

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Ivan R. Schoen, B.A., M.A., M.L.I.S.
Pastor of Maranatha Baptist Church (SBC)
Poplar Grove, IL, USA
http://maranatha-sbc.org

The language is rather of political motivation than reality. Hosea 1:4 cites his sin of slaying the Judahites at Jezreel:
And 2 Kings recounts more than the "standard" idolatry. No king of Israel who followed in the sins of Jeroboam is well spoken of. It is part and parcel of unbelief:

But there is also this:
for which he was judged:
It is true that Jehu did execute judgment upon Ahab's line and Israel for Baal worship. But so did Hazael.

Amen Dr. Piper,Lord give us all the boldness to "speak the Truth in love"

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Brian
Grace Bible Church;E.Bridgewater
East Bridgewater MA
http://www.gracebiblehome.org

I wondered that as well. He doesn't say who the "those of us" is that he had in mind, and I would suggest that should be little reason to have rejoiced at this man's election. Nonetheless, Piper comes back to his point by directly confronting the magistrate on the abominable sin and praying for conversion.

-----Added 1/28/2009 at 08:51:50 EST-----

Amen. And by the power of the Spirit, this would be good antidote to the new fringe "reformed" dispensationalism of the radical 2k theology which leaves the kingdom of God confined to the edges of the church parking lot.

I'm glad to see a minister speaking up and out about things, rather than being fearful of "political talk" and "tax exemption"

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JC - PCA - PA...homesick for SC
A we n' de Ya, ho; I mak sikker; Deus juvat

Indicabo tibi o homo quid sit bonum, et quid Dominus requirat a te: Utique facere iudicium, et diligere, misericordiam, et sollicitum ambulare cum Deo tuo. Michaeas 6:8

"Who says you can't go back, been all around the world and as a matter of fact. There's only one place left I want to go, who says you can't go home" Bon Jovi

I think it is possible to rejoice in the fact that the United States has gone so far beyond past racism that an African-American was elected President, without implying that we are blessed by the person of Barack Obama as President.

To keep using my (ever present on the mind) analogy - we could rejoice in Jehu's purge of Baal, without being happy that he ended up as king.

Well put.

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Joel Batts
Christ Presbyterian Church (PCA) - Memphis, TN

I believe that many would find that the heart sings unbidden while they are working their way through a tough bit of theology with a pipe in their teeth and a pencil in their hand. - CS Lewis

Jehu's Cool. There I've said it.

As to the OP -

Joel 3:19 Egypt shall be a desolation, And Edom shall be a desolate wilderness; For the violence against the children of Judah, Because they have shed innocent blood in their land.

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Timothy Johnson
First United Presbyterian of Moline
PCUSA (Yea, I know)
Theology/Philosophy Sunday School Teacher
Davenport, IA

In re-reading this thread I thought I had better clear something up in one of my posts about abortion being political. I strongly disagree that abortion is primarily a political issue. It is first and foremost a moral issue before Almighty God.

Actually every 'political' issue is a moral issue. Politics/Policy is merely the outworking of morals in the public/governmental sector. Christians would be wise to realise this and not allow the state to muzzle us by crying 'Politics!' at every turn where we would disagree based upon Scriptural grounds with the current emphasis. We would also be wise to use the term 'policy' in discussion. Politics can and usually should refer to the debate, cajoling, and dealing by the men involved in making policy.

Acts 24:25
And as he reasoned of righteousness, temperance, and judgment to come, Felix trembled, and answered, Go thy way for this time; when I have a convenient season, I will call for thee.

Go Pastor John.

As to the "tears of joy," prior to the election Piper made it quite clear that abortion was the #1 voting issue for him, implying that he would vote McCain. Likewise, as Pastor Fred stated, there was joy in the prospect of having our first black president, but that was not the #1 issue.

So, I suppose John could have had joy for one but deep sorrow for the other.

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Andrew Thornquist My Photo Album
Calvinistic Baptist
Ukiah, California
To follow Christ was the best decision God made for me!

Amen. Just pray they don't try to extend the fairness doctrine into churches.

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Aaron Josh Wright
Deerbrook Baptist Church, Humble Tx
New Orleans Baptist Theological Seminary

Having watched the video I ask: is it possible that this could be a misunderstanding? Piper directly addresses the president in the video. Perhaps the author of this quote meant that he didn't like that kind of (perceived) posturing, instead of speaking out against or attacking abortion from the pulpit.

P.S. I can't see the youtube video so I can't read the context of the statement.

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Rev. Daniel Kok
Pastor of Grace Reformed Church (URCNA)
Leduc, Alberta CANADA

"What sort of pledge and how great is this of love towards us! Christ lives for us not for himself!"
John Calvin, Commentary on the Hebrews (7:25)

I know you don't brother. I was talking about the person you were quoting.

I have to make a point here that angers me every time I hear someone say "We should rejoice that we now have a black president." Race has not played a part in voting in this country for years. We've had plenty of black senators, representatives and members of the president's cabinet for a long time.

Thousands of conservatives voted for a black candidate, Alan Keyes, years ago when he ran for president, but no one noticed that. When these same conservatives (who voted for Keyes years ago) chose to vote against Obama this election cycle because of his liberal policies, they were called racist. Did the African American community vote for Keyes because he was black then? Of course not.

Face it, one of the reasons why Obama got in office was because the media was screaming "racist" at everyone, and folks were scared to death not to vote for Obama lest they be considered racist.

Frankly, I don't care if the president's skin is purple, and I believe that a large majority of folks in this country have felt that way for a long time. God allowed Obama to rise to the top, and I honor God's sovereignty over the affairs of men. I honor the office of president, no matter what color the president's skin is, but I am sick of people handing a white flag to the folks in this country who care more about skin color than they do about personal integrity.

RANT OVER

-----Added 1/30/2009 at 02:03:19 EST-----

By the way, I, too, am thankful that Piper had the courage to speak out against abortion.

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J Baldwin
Keowee Presbyterian Church, PCA
Pickens, SC
“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind, and your neighbor as yourself.” Luke 10:27

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