The most disturbing clip I've seen says Chris Ortiz. I can't believe what I just watched.

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Psa 55:16 As for me, I will call upon God; and the LORD shall save me.
Psa 55:17 Evening, and morning, and at noon, will I pray, and cry aloud: and he shall hear my voice.
James Farley
Husband of Melissa and father of Ann.
Members of Redeemer Church ARP, Blacksburg Va.
http://www.redeemerblacksburg.org/

No comment necessary

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

This was the classic definition of a train wreck. I wanted to stop watching. Really, I just couldn't pull away.

I never seen a greater display of Biblical ignorance in my life, not to mention the seedy politicians there to take advantage of it. It makes one sick at thier stomach.

Somebody break out the life preservers. These people are drowning in a pool of ignorance!

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James Helbert, Wytheville, VA
Providence Reformed Presbyterian Church, RPCUS
TheBibleAlone.com / The Edinburgh Inn
"Is this not a brand plucked from the fire?” - Zechariah 3:2

Click to get: Board Rules -- Signature Requirements -- Suggestions?

That is the most frightening display of lemming mentality I have ever seen. If Darth Vader supported Israel these people would follow him. True ignorance on parade. "If you've seen Left Behind, then you know what's going to happen." Yikes!

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Bob Vigneault C.O.L, L.E., G.E, Dr.O.P., O.U.T.
The Heartbeat of Heaven (blog)
Deacon/Christ Presbyterian Church, Janesville, WI OPC www.christ-opc.org

Click to get: Board Rules -- Signature Requirements -- Suggestions?

I thought the soldier in combat dress coming up and saluting the praying Jew on the platform was especially touching.

Let us not forget to pray for the lost reporter and his crew. He doesn't care whether or not these people are ignorant in their understanding of the Bible. He just wants to tear apart and do his best to make Jesus Christ and all His followers look foolish to all men.

His awakening one day is going to be even more rude than most of the people he was reporting about. I dare say some of them are true believers, in spite of their poor and ignorant eschatology.

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Ryan Barnhart - Pastor of OGBC
Husband to a beautiful wife, Father to two beautiful girls
Student at Greenville Presbyterian Theological Seminary - B.D.

"I confess to you, that if I can but live and die serving the Lord Jesus, it will make no difference to me whether I am eaten by Cannibals or by worms. And in the Great Day my Resurrection body will rise as fair as yours in the likeness of our risen Redeemer." - John Paton

Good point dear brother. It is kind of funny though that at a pro Israel rally the Jewish reporter is thrown out.

Lemmings all.... Looking for a high enough cliff.

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Donald Jacobs
Roanoke VA.
Covenant Reformed Episcopal Church.

Cum vero infirmor tunc potens sum.

Good point.

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Kevin Rogers
Sovereign Community Church, PCA
Moncton NB

Man... Dispy theology sure sounds cultic!

Crazy stuff! Only by the grace of God I don't believe that stuff anymore!

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John
Member
Christ Presbyterian Church (OPC)
Salt Lake City, Utah
www.christpres.net

Oy vay!

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Greg Carpenter
Attending Lake Osborne Presbyterian Church
Lake Worth, FL

"It is a throne of grace that God in Christ is represented to us upon; but yet it is a throne still whereon majesty and glory do reside, and God is always to be considered by us as on a throne." –John Owen

Every bit as sinister as the Jihadists and the mystics, basically these people are Pseudo-Christian Mystics with their own brand of jihad, not unlike the Ayrians, how ironic of the Jews and their unconditional supporters.

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:detective:
Travis Speegle
Redeemer Presbyterian, PCA (Waco, Tx)
Pacific Cross Roads, PCA (Los Angeles, CA)


"When it comes to trustworthy theologians one can usually honor the rule of thumb that the deader the better."-Dr. John Hannah, DTS (of all places)

J. C. Ryle, "Beware of self-righteousness in every possible
shape and form. Some people get as much harm
from their 'virtues' as others do from their sins."

"There is none righteous, no, not one." Romans 3:10

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Conscience may lash us, but it cannot replenish a languishing life. Conscience may be God's word and minister to you, telling you of your faults and your follies and your destitution. It may point out, but it will never supply you. Christ must give you new life. Hart has well expressed it: "He to the feeble and the faint, His mighty aid makes known; and when their languid life is spent, supplies it with His own." - J. K. Popham

At the risk of being "lemming-like" myself, aside from their overt dispensationalism, Hagee's Charismatic theology and their leaning on Left Behind for their eschatological understanding, is it merely the fact that they elevate Israel as a nation to an improper place with their slogan "Keep your eyes on the nation Israel for the signs of the end" that makes this so contemptible? Or is it that they wish our military to be the protector and ally of Israel?

Hagee is a nut-job in my opinion, anyway, but look at the thousands that gulp him down. Again, those are the ones with whom we rub shoulders and have to try and make real sense when speaking of such things.

A friend of ours just discovered that TD Jakes was a modalist and was oh-so-disappointed. But that specific doctrinal error has colored everything else he says that she would view as "solid" and she wouldn't know it.

This video exposes deep, deep problems within.

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Donald P. Grubb
theol46@embarqmail.com

Berean Baptist Church, Mansfield, OH
Mansfield, OH

John 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing.
The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

is there anything solid from T.D Jakes? I can literally predict what the guy would say next.

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~Keon Garraway~ Brooklyn, NY Member of Franklin Square OPC

Love for God demonstrated by the love for our children in giving them a God centered education is the only hope for our country. by David Morrow
Pslam 71:20 [Thou], which hast shewed me great and sore troubles, shalt quicken me again, and shalt bring me up again from the depths of the earth.

wow...how disturbing...

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-JD

So, again, what is the thing most disturbing about this? We've said that it IS disturbing but in what ways specifically? In other words, if we were to confront someone who attended this ...affair...and gushed all over us of how wonderful it was, what could be said to them to get them to think? Well, OK, not THINK think, but you know un- themselves long enough to hear something.

Good Question. The problem I see with dealing with dispy eschatology is that once you start a conversation with them, you end up all over the map trying to correct scriptures that they use to support the dispy system. It can be very draining almost like dealing Mormons.

Reasons why it's disturbing: The following quotes from some of the people interviewed

Tom Delay “We have to be connected to Israel to be connected to Christ”

People worshipping the Lord with Israeli and American Flags.

“You have to embrace Israel as part of the Second Coming”

“I am looking forward to Armageddon”

“When we disappear you better start to worry”

“If you haven’t seen the Left Behind series it’s scary”





When talking with Dispies I would begin with the following.

Why do you believe in a pretribulational rapture?
(Be prepared for the programed response)

Ask: Have you ever considered that parts of the Book of Rev, have already taken place?

Why do put so much eschatological emphasis on Israel. Wouldn't you agree that eschatology should be Christ centered?

Ask them to read through 1&2 Thess, and distinguish between the Pre-Trib Rapture and the Second Coming of the Lord. (Also, remind them that they are not allowed to use any Tim Lahaye study guides)

The key is to be kind, gentle, and patient. As, frustrating as it may get, be patient with them. Also, be prepared for people to become hostile especially if they have not ever been confronted about what they believe.

That's what I was lookin' for! Thanks, Blue. Any others?
Houseparent, where are you?

What happens to this part of Christian America if, God forbid, there is a nuclear Holocaust in Israel?

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Vaughan
BTh Student, Presbyterian Theological Centre
Student Assistant, Ashfield Presbyterian Church
Sydney, Australia
The Ransomed