2 Thessalonians 2- in the temple, son of perdition

Scott1 · #1 (**permalink**) 08-17-2009, 11:30 AM

Quote:

2 Thessalonians 2

1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

2That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

5Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

6And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

10And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

12That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

13But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

14Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

15Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

Can anyone help us with a reformed theology perspective on these verses?

Modern dispensational premillenialism says this is about redemption tied to a third building of the Temple in Jerusalem, rise of the Antichrist and false prophet, 7 years of tribulation, etc.

Specifically,

1) Who or what is the "son of perdition" referring to?
2) Does this person go into a (third) Temple in Jerusalem in the future, or what is this describing?
3) Is this future event (to us today) the "abomination of desolation" Daniel refers to?

sastark · #2 (**permalink**) 08-17-2009, 11:50 AM

For what its worth, Calvin's commentary on this passage is here: Commentary on Philippians, Colossians, and Thessalonians | Christian Classics Ethereal Library

Here is his specific comments concerning "the temple of God"

Quote:

In the temple of God. By this one term there is a sufficient refutation of the error, nay more, the stupidity of those who reckon the Pope to be Vicar of Christ, on the ground that he has his seat in the Church, in whatever manner he may conduct himself; for Paul places Antichrist nowhere else than in the very sanctuary of God. For this is not a foreign, but a domestic enemy, who opposes Christ under the very name of Christ. But it is asked, how the Church is represented as the den of so many superstitions, while it was destined to be the pillar of the truth? (1 Timothy 3:15.) I answer, that it is thus represented, not on the ground of its retaining all the qualities of the Church, but because it has something of it remaining. I accordingly acknowledge, that that is the temple of God in which the Pope bears rule, but at the same time profaned by innumerable sacrileges.

Scott1 · #3 (**permalink**) 08-17-2009, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Commentary on 2 Thessalonians 2
John Calvin

In the exposition which I bring forward, there is nothing forced. Believers in that age dreamed that they would be transported to heaven, after having endured troubles during a short period. Paul, however, on the other hand, foretells that, after they have had foreign enemies for some time molesting them, they will have more evils to endure from enemies at home, inasmuch as many of those that have made a profession of attachment to Christ would be hurried away into base treachery, and inasmuch as the temple of God itself would be polluted by sacrilegious tyranny, so that Christ’s greatest enemy would exercise dominion there. The term revelation is taken here to denote manifest possession of tyranny, as if Paul had said that the day of Christ would not come until this tyrant had openly manifested himself, and had, as it were, designedly overturned the whole order of the Church.

The commentary mentions some thought Nero earlier was (the) Antichrist. Mr. Calvin seems to think the Pope was a type of antichrist but not that it is one person at one time. He mentions someone called Mahomet also.

Glenn Ferrell · #4 (**permalink**) 08-17-2009, 12:34 PM

David Silversides does a good job presenting the historic Reformed view.

http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninf...SID=1170494544

TheFleshProfitethNothing · #5 (**permalink**) 08-17-2009, 12:48 PM

If you are wondering who the son of perdition is...or for that matter...that which is taken out of the way...

Realize that Rome had Ceasars for how many years? Then came the time/day when the Ceasars were "taken out of the way"...who/whom, then took the place of the Ceasars?

By the way, Belisarius...you know, the producers slogan for such shows as CSI, CSI NY, CSI Miami and multitudes of other shows, primarily on CBS...at one time NBC (Quantum Leap) all have Bellisario (Belisarius) as a Slogan at the end of the show...usually shown as chisled in stone? He was a General of which took back Rome from the Germans, and then gave it to his best friend...who became the first, son of perdition...(I reserved the name for you to research it for yourself). I wish no one to take my word for anything...I might be wrong.

Is my conspiracy theory mind showing

?

Anyway, Rome, or the Papacy is the Antichrist in my belief system of the Historicist view of eschatology...if you would like a SLEW of info on what the Reformers believed on this subject, get a 1599 Geneva Study Bible...or download e-Sword and at least download the Geneva Bible Study notes into it. You will have most of what you need just by simpley doing that.

Then read Calvin and others on the subject, you will most likely do one of two things...perhaps three:

Get VERY angry at the attack against Rome

Be astonished and believe it as the truth

Or, lastly, be afraid...fear knowing it's true or be in denial and say it is NOT.

gregbed · #6 (**permalink**) 08-24-2009, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott1

2 Thessalonians 2

Can anyone help us with a reformed theology perspective on these verses?

Modern dispensational premillenialism says this is about redemption tied to a third building of the Temple in Jerusalem, rise of the Antichrist and false prophet, 7 years of tribulation, etc.

Specifically,

1) Who or what is the "son of perdition" referring to?
2) Does this person go into a (third) Temple in Jerusalem in the future, or what is this describing?
3) Is this future event (to us today) the "abomination of desolation" Daniel refers to?

As to your second question, try a little word experiment. Search the word "temple" in the epistles of Paul. You will see that he only uses the word when describing a pagan temple or the Church as the temple of God. If Paul were referring to some future temple this would be the only instance of Paul using the word to describe the Jewish temple. So if I understand "literal" to mean the historical-grammatical method, the most probable literal interpretation of this verse is that it is a reference to the church just as the earlier quote from Calvin indicated. As to Question 3, postmils will say it occurred in 70 A.D. during Titus' destruction of Jerusalem and premils and amils will say it is reference to a future action by the Antichrist.

Greg

ewenlin · #7 (**permalink**) 08-24-2009, 12:49 PM

Wcf,

Quote:

vi. There is no other head of the church but the lord Jesus Christ: Nor can the pope of rome in any sense be head thereof; but is that antichrist, that man of sin and son of perdition, that exalteth himself in the church against christ, and all that is called god.

The proof text cited was 2 Th. 2 if I remember correctly.