Accreditation: How Much Does it Matter? Why?

Joshua · #1 (**permalink**) 09-23-2007, 10:50 PM

How much does accreditation matter for a man going into the ministry? Why?

C. Matthew McMahon · #2 (**permalink**) 09-23-2007, 11:23 PM

There is more stock in going with a school that follows the Bible and the WCF (or under the tutalage of a godly pastor) than there is in accredidation of a School that has a name (Harvard, Yale, Etc.).

Ivan · #3 (**permalink**) 09-23-2007, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C. Matthew McMahon

There is more stock in going with a school that follows the Bible and the WCF (or under the tutalage of a godly pastor) than there is in accredidation of a School that has a name (Harvard, Yale, Etc.).

Southern Presbyterian · #4 (**permalink**) 09-23-2007, 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C. Matthew McMahon

There is more stock in going with a school that follows the Bible and the WCF (or under the tutelage of a godly pastor) than there is in accredidation of a School that has a name (Harvard, Yale, Etc.).

And also, 2 Timothy 2:15 says diligent study is the way to "present yourself approved" and that you should be able to accurately handle "the word of truth". This can be done under godly tutelage of any sort. (IMHO)

DMcFadden · #5 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 01:53 AM

We are living in a time when the government will likely soon make it more problematic to function as a church. Add to this the cost of traditional seminary education (I know of some who leave seminary with $50k - $60k in combined educational debt). Look at the difficulty many congregations have supporting a "full time" pastor. And, consider that some Reformed schools are putting tons of courses on the internet free in MP3 format (e.g., RTS and Covenant). If a person worked under tutelage of a solid pastor and utilized the free courses by people such as J.I. Packer, etc., I can imagine that they would receive an education equivalent to a standard accredited seminary.

And, for those who want the structure of a formal program, places like Whitefield look like they provide a credible Reformed education at an amazing price.

larryjf · #6 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 07:40 AM

I don't believe it should matter in a religious school.
The Church should not have outside organizations place any requirements on how they educate. In the end it gives someone outside of the Church authority in how the Church educates.

Also, i find no mention of accreditation in the Bible, so i would prefer to judge a school by the graduates that they produce (Mat 7:15-20).

Joshua · #7 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 08:39 AM

Ok. Thanks for the responses, although I am interested in any responses from others who may feel differently.

How likely is it, then, a Reformed & Presbyterian Church would choose a graduate from, say Greenville Presbyterian Theological Seminary as opposed to a graduate from Reformed Theological or Westminster Theological all other attributes being equal?

larryjf · #8 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sirhicks

Ok. Thanks for the responses, although I am interested in any responses from others who may feel differently.

How likely is it, then, a Reformed & Presbyterian Church would choose a graduate from, say Greenville Presbyterian Theological Seminary as opposed to a graduate from Reformed Theological or Westminster Theological all other attributes being equal?

I would consider the schools pretty much equal regarding choosing someone to pastor our church. But then again, i would have no problem with someone who does not have advanced degrees assuming that all of his attributes are still equal. I don't think one needs seminary to be an educated pastor, i just think helps, and many are not cut out for the self-discipline of doing it outside of seminary.

shackleton · #9 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 09:58 AM

Having been on both sides of it I would say it depends on what you intend to do. If you are just wanting to get involved in the ministry at a local church, even and including the level of pastor, accreditation does not matter, just that you know the material and can pass the rigorous reformed ordination process. Now, if you want to be a teacher in a bible college or seminary and especially in the big ones, any RTS, any WTS etc, then accreditation is important. In these cases you even have to factor in which schools you attend so that you will have a better shot at achieving your goal.
With counseling I am not sure but was wanting to find out. Can you can get certified in Nouthetic Counseling by going to a non-accredited school? If you do, are you allowed to practice? I am curious to know.
So I guess my answer would be, it depends.

bradofshaw · #10 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 10:37 AM

Does anyone know of any men who have trained only under a pastor (without a seminary degree) and been ordained in a body such as the OPC, PCA, etc. in recent years? I understand this was once a regular model for pastoral training. I wonder how open the reformed church is to reviving this practice?

Southern Presbyterian · #11 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradofshaw

Does anyone know of any men who have trained only under a pastor (without a seminary degree) and been ordained in a body such as the OPC, PCA, etc. in recent years? I understand this was once a regular model for pastoral training. I wonder how open the reformed church is to reviving this practice?

Our denomination, the RPCUS, currently has such a program. Our TEs work along with Christ College and offer an accredited seminary degree upon completion of the training. This gives the candidate/student the opportunity to study under the tutelage of several godly pastors. Structure is provided but also flexibility in scheduling and pace to help accommodate men who have families, jobs, and other responsibilities.

Ivanhoe · #12 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 12:05 PM

When the totalitarian Power State moves in and takes control, your accredited theological degree will mean little in the eyes of the world (and isn't that the point of accreditation anyway)?

JonathanHunt · #13 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 01:36 PM

Josh,

To my mind it entirely depends upon the church that calls a man. As far as I am concerned, the churches with the greatest spirituality look at the course a man has studies, and who has taught him and mentored him, rather than the name of the college and the piece of paper he holds at the end.

JH

Kevin · #14 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradofshaw

Does anyone know of any men who have trained only under a pastor (without a seminary degree) and been ordained in a body such as the OPC, PCA, etc. in recent years? I understand this was once a regular model for pastoral training. I wonder how open the reformed church is to reviving this practice?

RPCUS, PCC, ARP, OPC, BP; I know men in all 5 who do not have a seminary dgree ordained by these bodies.

elnwood · #15 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 04:17 PM

Of course, it matters what ministry a person is going into. If one wants to get a higher degree (D.Min., Th.M., Th.D./Ph.D.) at an accredited school, you almost always need an accredited M.Div. If you want to be a professor at an accredited school, you'll need an accredited doctorate.

A degree from an accredited school means that the school met certain minimum education standards in terms of class structures, administration, and faculty standards.

A lot of non-accredited schools do not have faculty with accredited degrees, offer degrees by correspondence, and some even make up their own masters and doctoral degrees that have no accredited school equivalent, and have degree programs that are the same name as a degree from an accredited school but have vastly different requirements.

Accreditation in the U.S. is not by government organizations, but by state-recognized organizations. Although you hear it a lot, I simply don't buy the notion that accreditation compromises biblical standards for seminaries, and to say so is to say that the Westminster and RTS seminaries are unbiblical.

Answerman · #16 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 04:34 PM

I voted little to none. I believe a signed statement of faith and a rigorous examination before taking any office would be the best idea.

As I apply this to my homeschool philosophy, I believe that Theology (the Queen of the sciences), Philosophy, History, Logic and Literature skills are the most important subjects. The government almost totally ignores these subjects (for their own benefit) in their accreditation and therefore we are at odds as to the type of person we want to create through the educational process. Many in the educational establishment consider this child abuse, but I call it pressing the antithesis.

weinhold · #17 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 04:35 PM

I voted in favor of accreditation. Can anyone name a school with an excellent academic reputation but which is not accredited?

wsw201 · #18 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by weinhold

I voted in favor of accreditation. Can anyone name a school with an excellent academic reputation but which is not accredited?

GPTS.

Ambrose · #19 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by weinhold

I voted in favor of accreditation. Can anyone name a school with an excellent academic reputation but which is not accredited?

Ummm.... Harvard University?

elnwood · #20 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chad Degenhart

Quote:

Originally Posted by weinhold

I voted in favor of accreditation. Can anyone name a school with an excellent academic reputation but which is not accredited?

Ummm.... Harvard University?

That's an old myth propagated by diploma mills.

Harvard University is accredited by the New England Association of Schools and Colleges, and Harvard Divinity School is accredited by the Association of Theological Schools. Both accreditation associations are recognized by the U.S. Department of Education.

weinhold · #21 (**permalink**) 09-24-2007, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wsw201

Quote:

Originally Posted by weinhold

I voted in favor of accreditation. Can anyone name a school with an excellent academic reputation but which is not accredited?

GPTS.

I wonder how many people would know this school by its acronym; I certainly don't.