No one denies that. We are only exercising our prophetic abilities.

obviously.
Remember, Paul was writing to the Church, not to the Civil government.

So? Of course we are thankful. But let's apply your maxim on a different level. What about a serial killer? We would rejoice in his conversion, but does that clear him with the civil law?

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

Agreed. Off course, I believe Paul never wrote to the Civil government because practically speaking, regulation of government is not the church's concern in the NT.

No, it does not clear him with the civil law and the state is completely just to put him to death. If he was genuinely repentent and showed the fruit of conversion, I would still rejoice if for some reason the state dropped the ball and didn't execute him.

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Mark Li
International University Church
New South Wales, Australia

In addition, wasn't there a place for atonement and forgiveness under the Mosaic Law, especially in cases of sins of ignorance?

People who oppose theonomy sometimes seem to paint a cruel picture of God's Law in order to bolster their argument.

After all, Aaron was not put to death for his idolotry. Moses was not put to death for misrepresenting God.

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Yes. And even if the State wanted to prosecute, logistically it would be very difficult because of its reduced size.

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

I was being biblical....

__________________

(Norseman Moderator)

R. Martin Snyder
1689er
Harmony Baptist Church (Member)
PuritanCovenanter MSN Blog
PuritanCovenanter's MySpace Page

"Our object should not be to have scripture on our side but to be on the side of scripture; and however dear any sentiment may have become by being long entertained, so soon as it is seen to be contrary to the Bible, we must be prepared to abandon it without hesitation."
William Symington

Click to get:Board Rules -- Signature Requirements -- Suggestions?

Neither was he put to death for killing the Egyptian.

Hey Jacob, serious question, who was supposed to carry out the penal sanctions? And are there any examples of this even happening in the OT?

And dont pull the "Arguement from silence" bologna. I am asking seriously. Not trying to Pigeon hole you. Hey is pigeon whole a sophist word like the rest you use?

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N. Robert; Trinity Reformed Church RCA, Holland MI

Once in a while you can get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right."

But your head looked kinda round in that picture.

__________________
R.Vic Bottomly
Providence Reformed Baptist Church, Tacoma, WA

Click to get: Board Rules -- Signature Requirements -- Suggestions?

Can you elaborate on this? Why are you accusing Jacob of 'sophism'?

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That wasn't a crime, but an act of war. Either way, beside the point.

Elders of the gate. # Deuteronomy 19:12
the elders of his town shall send for him, bring him back from the city, and hand him over to the avenger of blood to die.

# Joshua 20:4
"When he flees to one of these cities, he is to stand in the entrance of the city gate and state his case before the elders of that city. Then they are to admit him into their city and give him a place to live with them.

Hopefully my answer shall suffice. But I don't really understand why you asked the question. Your question sort of assumed that God never really intended his law to be carried out. Even the Reformed Relativist believes that the Israelites should have carried it out.

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

Well, maybe you are right. Maybe it got a little to rounded.

__________________

(Norseman Moderator)

R. Martin Snyder
1689er
Harmony Baptist Church (Member)
PuritanCovenanter MSN Blog
PuritanCovenanter's MySpace Page

"Our object should not be to have scripture on our side but to be on the side of scripture; and however dear any sentiment may have become by being long entertained, so soon as it is seen to be contrary to the Bible, we must be prepared to abandon it without hesitation."
William Symington

Click to get:Board Rules -- Signature Requirements -- Suggestions?

Just teasing a tad, hence the wink. I honestly enjoy Jacobs rhetoric much.

I spelled pigeon hole wrong though.

I accuse all philosophers and logicians of being sophists..... That sais, my questions were serious though.

Who carried out teh penal sanctions and are there examples of it happening besides directly from the hands of God..

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N. Robert; Trinity Reformed Church RCA, Holland MI

Once in a while you can get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right."

There is some truth to his teasing. Sadly, there have been times when I used my meager skills at logic to dance an argument. Hopefully, that is past me.

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

How was moses killing the egyptian when he fled an act of war?

I asked becasue I did not know. And I do not know of any recorded incident..

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N. Robert; Trinity Reformed Church RCA, Holland MI

Once in a while you can get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right."

That was tongue-in-cheek. My point was Moses was not guilty of a capital crime since he acted in self-defense of his neighbor. Most civilized societies recognize that (or did before this generation).

As to the recorded incident, my references say who was usually in charge of jurisdiction.

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

You are a beautiful man, brother!

Pro 20:29

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I'm in favor of captial punishment, but not for pagans, perverts, and problem children.
The Bishop is no good for civilian affairs, and the magistrate is no good for ecclesiastical affairs.

__________________
David Cronkhite, Elder
Pasadena United Reformed Church

"I count myself one of the number of those
who write as they learn, and learn as they write."

And who said we should mix the two? Bahnsen had a whole chapter in TiCE defending the Separation of Church and State. Rushdoony's lectures on American History extol in the highest of praises the voluntary church. Rather, it is usually the critics of theonomy who have a hard time consistently maintaining the separation.

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

OK, but if the church and state are mirror images of one another what is the net effect?

__________________
David Cronkhite, Elder
Pasadena United Reformed Church

"I count myself one of the number of those
who write as they learn, and learn as they write."