Lev 19:27:
Shouldn't all theonomists have a beard like Rushdoony? How does the theonomist interpret such an OT law?

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I have an answer, but it calls into question the usefulness of the whole Reformed tri-partite division of the law.

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

By all means use it

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Jaymin Jordan-Allen
Student, United Reformed Church
Ontario, CA

Judaizers, Anabaptists and legalists worry about things like this. Orthodox Christians take the hint and realize that this law expired with the Hebrew state and was fulfilled in Christ. This should be easy stuff.

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Chris Stamper
Park Cities PCA
(Dallas, TX)

CL, Are you saying that this particular law "expired", or that all law has expired?

In 1 cor 9 paul used this as an example:

8Say I these things as a man? or saith not the law the same also?

9For it is written in the law of Moses, thou shalt not muzzle the mouth of the ox that treadeth out the corn. Doth God take care for oxen?

10Or saith he it altogether for our sakes? For our sakes, no doubt, this is written: that he that ploweth should plow in hope; and that he that thresheth in hope should be partaker of his hope.

11If we have sown unto you spiritual things, is it a great thing if we shall reap your carnal things?

Here he used this as an example,but then He said this:
20And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;

21To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

What law does he refer to here? -under the law to Christ? Yes, we are told that animal sacrifices are not
required since the cross, but Paul also says in romans 13:10
8Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

9For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

10Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

What law is this? You are not saying we are "law-less" are you?

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Anthony D'Arienzo
Sunday School Teacher
Hope Reformed Baptist Church:
Medford, N.Y.

And let's also keep this in mind: Bahnsen is not alive to answer this question. I do think that in itself would make a difference. I think there would be a lot more humility on the theonomy question if he were here. Remember how many people were bold enough to debate him in public (like three, maybe).

It is a good question. And no doubt some theonomists have good answers. We shall see what they are.

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

That's actually a poor translation. This is better:
Thou shalt not hinder the foaming of your brew's head, neither shalt thou stop the frothing of thy beer.

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C. Gorsuch
Glencullen Baptist
Portland, Oregon

Would this not be considered a case law that did in fact separate Israel (as God's people) from other nations? Today, the application has changed as society has changed, but the principle remains the same. The Church (as God's people) are to be separate from the world.

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Ryan Barnhart - Pastor of OGBC
Husband to a beautiful wife, Father to two beautiful girls
"But by the grace of God I am what I am." I Corinthians 15:10

"I confess to you, that if I can but live and die serving the Lord Jesus, it will make no difference to me whether I am eaten by Cannibals or by worms. And in the Great Day my Resurrection body will rise as fair as yours in the likeness of our risen Redeemer." - John Paton

Because it itched!

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Bryan Maes (on Facebook)
Trinity Reformed Church (CREC mission)
Edgewood, NM

Why did he shave it? Probably because he didn't see the general equity requiring it.

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

Off topic: This thread reminds me of Joe Morecraft telling the story of being at a conference that served pork chops and telling Rushdoony that if he felt convicted, Joe would be happy to take them of his hands.

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Devin Brian
1689er
Attending Trinity Baptist Church in Shreveport, LA.
Vivian, Louisiana, USA

"The fall of man is written in too legible characters not to be understood: Those that deny it, by their denying, prove it." - George Whitefield

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Kevin Rogers
Sovereign Community Church, PCA
Moncton NB

Seriously,
This is a *psychological* question, and one in the nature of the case can't be answered. We can theologize and speculate all we want, but the most sensible thing is to email David Bahnsen and ask him.

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

You bet. Christ is the end of the law. The old statutes have passed away. We are not the ancient Hebrews. The NT repeatedly reminds us of this. Any other position is legalism of the worst sort.

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Chris Stamper
Park Cities PCA
(Dallas, TX)

I don't know that we can simply say that "Christ is the end of the law". The WCF clarifies this statement (see part V) as well as the question in the original post:

III. Besides this law, commonly called moral, God was pleased to give to the people of Israel, as a church under age, ceremonial laws, containing several typical ordinances, partly of worship, prefiguring Christ, His graces, actions, sufferings, and benefits;[4] and partly, holding forth divers instructions of moral duties.[5] All which ceremonial laws are now abrogated, under the New Testament.[6]

IV. To them also, as a body politic, He gave sundry judicial laws, which expired together with the State of that people; not obliging under any now, further than the general equity thereof may require.[7]

V. The moral law does forever bind all, as well justified persons as others, to the obedience thereof;[8] and that, not only in regard of the matter contained in it, but also in respect of the authority of God the Creator, who gave it.[9] Neither does Christ, in the Gospel, any way dissolve, but much strengthen this obligation.[10]

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Tim Lindsay
member, Covenant Reformed Presbyterian Church, Halifax, NS, Canada
Living in Cape Town, South Africa
"at the foot of Table Mountain, not far from the Cape of Good Hope"

Jacob, why dont we do this. Do you know of anyone who knew him that the question could be asked? ASk his wife Cathie or his son's...I know he was divorced, but perhaps she can answer..

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N. Robert; Trinity Reformed Church RCA, Holland MI

Once in a while you can get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right."

Why don't we do this? I can think of a million more pressing issues. As to asking Cathie, to put it very politely, that would be a very biased against Bahnsen source.

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

Telos can also mean "goal," not just termination. Did the statute against kidnapping pass away?

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J. B. Atken
John Knox PCA
Layman, M.A. student at Louisiana College

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Kevin Rogers
Sovereign Community Church, PCA
Moncton NB

Sheesh, I hope you are not one of these "worst sort" of legalists who still think that rape and murder should still be against the law.

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Kevin Rogers
Sovereign Community Church, PCA
Moncton NB

Is that why Jesus said in Matthew 5, "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, but to fulfil it." Whatever meaning the word fulfil takes on it can't mean destroy or abrogate because he just got through saying he didn't come to do this. Further proof of that is the fact that he says, "Whosoever breaks the least of these (commandments from the Old Testament) shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven."

As Bahnsen notes, surely you don't think sexual relations with animals is not breaking God's law. But you won't find that stated anywhere in the New Testament. So then are we not to consider it sinful? The problem is not legalism. The problem is autonomous man picking and choosing which laws from the Old Testament he thinks he should follow. Following out that logical sequence, autonomous man becomes the ethical standard of life as opposed to the Word of God.

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Ryan Barnhart - Pastor of OGBC
Husband to a beautiful wife, Father to two beautiful girls
"But by the grace of God I am what I am." I Corinthians 15:10

"I confess to you, that if I can but live and die serving the Lord Jesus, it will make no difference to me whether I am eaten by Cannibals or by worms. And in the Great Day my Resurrection body will rise as fair as yours in the likeness of our risen Redeemer." - John Paton

Pity there weren't more like Rush in my family, then I would get all the good food.

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Daniel Ritchie
Saintfield, Northern Ireland - Queen's University, Belfast:History/Politics
Member of Dromara Reformed Presbyterian Church of Ireland (Covenanter)