War

Josh G · #1 (**permalink**) 07-02-2008, 10:36 PM

The sixth commandment say that we should not murder, yet God told the Israelites to defeat the Philistines . How should one view war from the Bible?

Murder is wrong, but is it wrong to kill in the name of war? I am not trying to push an anti-war agenda, but I just want to find out some views on war.

BobVigneault · #2 (**permalink**) 07-03-2008, 07:37 AM

Murder is the taking of a life unjustly. Killing in war is acceptable if the war is a just war for a just cause. The government is given the authority to declare war, not the individual. There may be a just cause for the individual to kill, self defense being one.

In the Bible God's Word is always just. If God tells the Israelites to utterly destroy a city or Abraham to sacrifice his son then these are just causes for God cannot be unjust - God is just by definition.

Joshua · #3 (**permalink**) 07-03-2008, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josh G

The sixth commandment say that we should not murder, yet God told the Israelites to defeat the Philistines . How should one view war from the Bible?

Murder is wrong, but is it wrong to kill in the name of war? I am not trying to push an anti-war agenda, but I just want to find out some views on war.

Hi, Josh. As Bob has already noted, since God is by nature holy, just, and perfect, then we believe that anything God commands is just, holy, and right. As for viewing the War in light of the 6th Commandment, we have to distinguish if such an act of war is just or not. Is it in self-defense? Is it in response to true aggression? To not wage war in self-defense would also be a violation of the 6th Commandment, in that we would not be trying to prohibit the enemy from murdering our own. However, if it's a war that hasn't been legally and morally constituted, in that it's not self defense, etc., it would obviously be a violation of the 6th Commandment.

Just my

BobVigneault · #4 (**permalink**) 07-03-2008, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshua

Hi, Josh. As Bill has already noted.......

BILL! BILL???!!! How would you like a mouth full of teeth you little dweeb? And when I get done with you perhaps Bill will like an opportunity to defend HIS honor.

VirginiaHuguenot · #5 (**permalink**) 07-03-2008, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobVigneault

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshua

Hi, Josh. As Bill has already noted.......

BILL! BILL???!!! How would you like a mouth full of teeth you little dweeb? And when I get done with you perhaps Bill will like an opportunity to defend HIS honor.

Now, now, boys, why can't we be friends?

http://www.puritanboard.com/343388-post1.html

Joshua · #6 (**permalink**) 07-03-2008, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobVigneault

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshua

Hi, Josh. As Bill has already noted.......

BILL! BILL???!!! How would you like a mouth full of teeth you little dweeb? And when I get done with you perhaps Bill will like an opportunity to defend HIS honor.

So sorry, Bob.

BobVigneault · #7 (**permalink**) 07-03-2008, 09:32 AM

See, this is how wars get started. Getting someone's name wrong is a just cause for a good poke.

(Josh, you know I love you. {Big hug}.

Joshua · #8 (**permalink**) 07-03-2008, 09:34 AM

skellam · #9 (**permalink**) 07-03-2008, 09:45 AM

The command "Thou Shalt Not Kill" goes much beyond the surface of the commandment. A good principle for approaching the commandments is that for whatever is forbidden the opposite is commanded. Therefore when we read the commandment 'Thous Shalt Not Kill,' this also requires us to preserve the life of the innocent if it is in our ability. The Westminster Divines summarize it very well in the Larger Catechism. We are foridden to take life unjustly. But, taking life in the context of a just war is permitted.

Quote:

Q. 134. Which is the sixth commandment?
A. The sixth commandment is, Thou shalt not kill.

Q. 135. What are the duties required in the sixth commandment?
A. The duties required in the sixth commandment are, all careful studies, and lawful endeavors, to preserve the life of ourselves and others by resisting all thoughts and purposes, subduing all passions, and avoiding all occasions, temptations, and practices, which tend to the unjust taking away the life of any; by just defense thereof against violence, patient bearing of the hand of God, quietness of mind, cheerfulness of spirit; a sober use of meat, drink, physic, sleep, labor, and recreations; by charitable thoughts, love, compassion, meekness, gentleness, kindness; peaceable, mild and courteous speeches and behavior; forbearance, readiness to be reconciled, patient bearing and forgiving of injuries, and requiting good for evil; comforting and succoring the distressed, and protecting and defending the innocent.

Q. 136. What are the sins forbidden in the sixth commandment?
A. The sins forbidden in the sixth commandment are, all taking away the life of ourselves, or of others, except in case of public justice, lawful war, or necessary defense; the neglecting or withdrawing the lawful and necessary means of preservation of life; sinful anger, hatred, envy, desire of revenge; all excessive passions, distracting cares; immoderate use of meat, drink, labor, and recreations; provoking words, oppression, quarreling, striking, wounding, and whatsoever else tends to the destruction of the life of any.

Here is another response to a similar question to yours that is helpful.

Josh G · #10 (**permalink**) 07-06-2008, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshua

Hi, Josh. As Bob has already noted, since God is by nature holy, just, and perfect, then we believe that anything God commands is just, holy, and right. As for viewing the War in light of the 6th Commandment, we have to distinguish if such an act of war is just or not. Is it in self-defense? Is it in response to true aggression? To not wage war in self-defense would also be a violation of the 6th Commandment, in that we would not be trying to prohibit the enemy from murdering our own. However, if it's a war that hasn't been legally and morally constituted, in that it's not self defense, etc., it would obviously be a violation of the 6th Commandment.

Just my

Thanks to Bob and Joshua for your comments. I would agree with you both about this issue. I was just curious to see the "reformed" position. I guess I won't be seeing many of you on the news holding up anti-war signs

Joshua · #11 (**permalink**) 07-06-2008, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josh G

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshua

Hi, Josh. As Bob has already noted, since God is by nature holy, just, and perfect, then we believe that anything God commands is just, holy, and right. As for viewing the War in light of the 6th Commandment, we have to distinguish if such an act of war is just or not. Is it in self-defense? Is it in response to true aggression? To not wage war in self-defense would also be a violation of the 6th Commandment, in that we would not be trying to prohibit the enemy from murdering our own. However, if it's a war that hasn't been legally and morally constituted, in that it's not self defense, etc., it would obviously be a violation of the 6th Commandment.

Just my

Thanks to Bob and Joshua for your comments. I would agree with you both about this issue. I was just curious to see the "reformed" position. I guess I won't be seeing many of you on the news holding up anti-war signs

No, I won't be publicly protesting with signs (I'll stick to personal conversation, my blog, and certain message boards to protest

); there is a Reformed position on War, but their are obviously different applications of it in these days. I, for one, am against the War in Iraq, and the potential war coming with Iran. I am against it on both moral and political grounds. However, there are many of my esteemed brethren here on the PB and my own church, who differ from me in this regard. So, although there is a Reformed position, there is disagreement on current wars as to the nature of their validity or not.