So I was scanning through my bookshelves to see what needed to be weeded out and I saw a Rick Joiner book. I thought to myself, I'll flick through it and see if it is worth keeping!

First page I go to is talking about the apostle John and his visions

"From the earthly perspective men will get caught up in the confusion and doctrinal conflicts of Babylon... To teh earthbound and visonless the great doctrines like 'free-will' and 'election' conflict with each other, but from God's perspective the wonderfully compliment each other. John would never have been a calvinist or am arminian, but could have great fellowship with each, and would have drawn out the essence of their truths. ...John never succumbed to the carnality of doctrinal divisions"

Is this the same John who said 'whoever does not aknowledge that Jesus has come in the flesh is an antichrist?' (my paraphrase)

And....! Do we not get some of the strongest teaching about election from John's gospel?

And! Is it not a subtle error to say that division over doctrine is 'carnal'? In otherwords to take a stand on doctrine is divisive?

Uh ok Rick, so we will just abandon all doctrinal convictions in order that we can be 'spiritual' and while we think we are being spiritual we have just opened the gate for the enemy to pour in a flood of false teaching and error!!!

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"A dog barks when his master is attacked. I would be a coward if I saw that God's truth is attacked and yet would remain silent." John Calvin

John from Scotland
Denomination: Attending Baptist church
Confessional Subscription:London Baptist Confession
Blog: [url]www.three-streams.co.uk[/url]

I'm glad I don't have any of his books.

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Jonathan
Audio Engineer
Reformed Anabaptist
Ohio

Moroni's magical glasses of proper interpretation:

Doctrine divides! No creed but Christ!

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"I was found by those who did not seek me; I was made manifest to those who did not ask for me." Romans 10:20b

Angela Asano
Edwardsville, IL
Member, Center Grove Presbyterian Church - PCA

"History never repeats itself, but it rhymes." - Mark Twain

Correct me if I'm wrong, because I don't know if we're talking about the same author here (the author I'm referring to is Rick Joyner). He wrote the books The Call, The Final Quest, The Prophetic Ministry, etc.

My mother gave me copies of some of his books and I had to keep them away from me because I would literally cringe if I were just to read a bit of what he wrote. It appears to me that he thinks of himself as a prophet because IMO he is talking about his own visions in some of his books. I may be wrong about this because I have never read completely any of his books.

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Joel de Leon
Member (man under care)
Christ Presbyterian Church, OPC
Salt Lake City, UT

The Cleansed Leper

Yes, he says he is a prophet. And, so do a lot of other people. But, he is not. You can check out his latest here: MorningStar Ministries

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We shall not adjust our Bible to the age; but before we have done with it, by God's grace, we shall adjust the age to the Bible. - Charles Haddon Spurgeon

Lawrence Underwood, Jr.
Pastor - Providence Family Fellowship / Mobile, Alabama
1644/46 LBC
My Blog - Imprimis

hmmmm....

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sarah
WI
OPC
My Pastor's Sermons: Mark Jenkins...he's awesome!!!

To insist that doctrinal divisions are carnal is to assert a doctrinal division because this statement is absolute.

To insist that one, like John, be neither a Calvinist or Arminian is to assert a doctrinal division because this statement is absolute (or at least with respect to these theological approaches).

To insist that John held to the concept of 'free will' is a doctrinal division since it necessarily contradicts the Calvinist creed.

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Rev. Daniel Kok
Pastor of Grace Reformed Church (URCNA)
Leduc, Alberta CANADA

"What sort of pledge and how great is this of love towards us! Christ lives for us not for himself!"
John Calvin, Commentary on the Hebrews (7:25)

Technically, though, doctrinal divisions are carnal; they spring from our fallen natures, do they not?

Maybe we should differentiate between "doctrinal division" and "doctrinal difference". It's possible to hold a different theological position without being divisive.

edit: I do that all the time. I try to, anyway.

Hm. His stuff I wouldn't even sell on Ebay... wouldn't want to make money selling foolish things to foolish people and give them more reason to stumble. What utter rubbish.

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Todd K. Pedlar
member, First Congregational Church, (CCCC) Cresco, IA
http://inprincipiodeus.solideogloria.com
http://puritanwisdom.blogspot.com

"As God did not at first choose you because you were high, He will not now forsake you because you are low."
John Flavel in Keeping the Heart



Click to get: Board Rules -- Signature Requirements -- Suggestions?

I find Joyner's books quite useful............for replacing broken legs on a couch or firestarter.

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Rich Koster
1689'er
Browns Mills NJ USA
Often Goofy Reformed Eccentric
Romans 7:14-25

Firestarter I can see, but why would you want to use them for couch legs where everyone can see that you own them?

They can visually get my review of them as compared to what is on the bookshelf. I promise to put a big X on the cover and write WARNING: contains hooey and false prophecies inside.

A friend of mine years ago, put me on the MorningStar mailing list..it was useful for the time, in that I was able to sit down with her and share why it was garbage..and false teaching..she ended up throwing all his things away..she had a difficult time letting go of her John Hagee stuff, she was really sucked in to his teaching... Her family moved away and we lost contact..

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Bobbi Clark
Covenant Member
Pinewood Pres. (PCA) Middleburg

When I kept Silent, My bones wasted away through my groaning all day long. Psalm 32:3

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Martin - Reformed
Husband to the most godly, honorable and loyal wife Line
Searching for a Church
Webpage www.5solas.dk
Free Online Reformed Seminary - http://www.tnars.net
Soli Deo Gloria

Rick Joyner.........Sorry but did you expect to read anything good by him????

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Steve
Sonship Ministries (Reformed)
Brooklyn, NY