 » Site Navigation | | | |  | 
09-27-2009, 02:45 PM
|  | whippersnapper | | Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Purcellville, Virginia
Posts: 2,728
Thanks: 1,454
Thanked 538 Times in 327 Posts
| | | Great Calvin quote on "Free Will"
Hey, I read this last Lord's Day and just had to share it with y'all: Quote: |
Were any one to ask them, Is not God necessarily good, is not the devil necessarily wicked, what answer would they give? The goodness of God is so connected with his Godhead, that it is not more necessary to be God than to be good; whereas the devil, by his fall, was so estranged from goodness, that he can do nothing but evil. Should any one give utterance to the profane jeer that little praise is due to God for a goodness to which he is forced, is it not obvious to every man to reply, It is owing not to violent impulse, but to his boundless goodness, that he cannot do evil? Therefore, if the free will of God in doing good is not impeded, because he necessarily must do good; if the devil, who can do nothing but evil, nevertheless sins voluntarily; can it be said that man sins less voluntarily because he is under a necessity of sinning?
| Calvin Book 2, Ch. 3, Paragraph 5.
__________________
Ben Franks
I attend: Ketoctin Covenant Presbyterian Church (OPC)
in Purcellville, Virginia
I'm a member of: Heartland Community Church (PCA)
in Wichita, Kansas
I blog here (along with my Dad): http://rrfranks.blogspot.com/
And I'm a student here: www.phc.edu "Remember the speeches we have spoken so often over our mead, when we raised boast on the bench, heroes in the hall, about hard fighting. Now may the man who is bold prove that he is."-Aelfwine at the Battle of Maldon | | The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to Hamalas For This Useful Post: | |
09-27-2009, 03:03 PM
|  | Puritanboard Graduate | | Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Rockville, CT
Posts: 3,646
Thanks: 609
Thanked 925 Times in 709 Posts
| |
Also from Institutes I:18.1 Quote: |
They babble and talk absurdly who, in the place of God's providence, substitute bare permission -- as if God sat in a watchtower awaiting chance events , and his judgments thus depended upon human will.
| |
09-27-2009, 05:18 PM
| | whippersnapper | | Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Purcellville, Virginia
Posts: 2,728
Thanks: 1,454
Thanked 538 Times in 327 Posts
| | Quote:
Originally Posted by Presbyterian Deacon  Also from Institutes I:18.1 Quote: |
They babble and talk absurdly who, in the place of God's providence, substitute bare permission -- as if God sat in a watchtower awaiting chance events , and his judgments thus depended upon human will.
| | That reminds me of another Calvin quote I read today: Quote: |
We must, therefore, repudiate the oft-repeated sentiment of Chrysostom, "Whom he draws, he draws willingly"; insinuating that the Lord only stretches out his hand, and waits to see whether we will be pleased to take his aid.
| |
09-27-2009, 05:52 PM
|  | Puritanboard Junior | | Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Holland, Michigan
Posts: 1,538
Thanks: 245
Thanked 204 Times in 168 Posts
| | Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamalas Quote:
Originally Posted by Presbyterian Deacon Also from Institutes I:18.1 Quote: |
They babble and talk absurdly who, in the place of God's providence, substitute bare permission -- as if God sat in a watchtower awaiting chance events , and his judgments thus depended upon human will.
| | That reminds me of another Calvin quote I read today: Quote: |
We must, therefore, repudiate the oft-repeated sentiment of Chrysostom, "Whom he draws, he draws willingly"; insinuating that the Lord only stretches out his hand, and waits to see whether we will be pleased to take his aid.
| | Does not Calvin criticize Chrysostom for this quote? I may be mistaken, but I think he did.
NR
__________________
N. Robert; Trinity Reformed Church RCA, Holland MI
"Once in a while you can get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right."
|
09-27-2009, 06:02 PM
|  | Puritanboard Senior | | Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Browns Mills NJ
Posts: 2,316
Thanks: 617
Thanked 702 Times in 404 Posts
| |
I'm really starting to like this Calvin fellow 
__________________
Rich Koster
1689'er
Browns Mills NJ USA
Often Goofy Reformed Eccentric
Romans 7:14-25
| | The Following User Says Thank You to Rich Koster For This Useful Post: | |
09-27-2009, 06:51 PM
| | whippersnapper | | Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Purcellville, Virginia
Posts: 2,728
Thanks: 1,454
Thanked 538 Times in 327 Posts
| | Quote:
Originally Posted by Amazing Grace Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamalas Quote:
Originally Posted by Presbyterian Deacon Also from Institutes I:18.1
| That reminds me of another Calvin quote I read today: Quote: |
We must, therefore, repudiate the oft-repeated sentiment of Chrysostom, "Whom he draws, he draws willingly"; insinuating that the Lord only stretches out his hand, and waits to see whether we will be pleased to take his aid.
| | Does not Calvin criticize Chrysostom for this quote? I may be mistaken, but I think he did.
NR | No, you are correct. He does criticize Chrysostom in this quote. That's why he says we must repudiate Chrysostom's statement. He's trying to show how ridiculous it is.  |
09-27-2009, 07:08 PM
| | Puritanboard Junior | | Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Holland, Michigan
Posts: 1,538
Thanks: 245
Thanked 204 Times in 168 Posts
| | Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Koster I'm really starting to like this Calvin fellow | I just finished reading a book titled "The Genius of Geneva" It is a tremendous book time lining his life. Opened my eyes to what a wonderful man he actually was and what he suffered for the Gospel.
| | The Following User Says Thank You to Amazing Grace For This Useful Post: | |
09-27-2009, 07:26 PM
|  | Puritanboard Freshman | | Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Nampa
Posts: 24
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
| | |
Was Calvin a fruit bearing christian?
__________________
Paul
Member OPC
Idaho
Be the master of many books, but let the Bible master you.
|
09-27-2009, 07:28 PM
| | Puritanboard Junior | | Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Holland, Michigan
Posts: 1,538
Thanks: 245
Thanked 204 Times in 168 Posts
| | Quote:
Originally Posted by akennethjr Was Calvin a fruit bearing christian? | In what sense do you mean? I believe he was. His devotion and Love for the Lord is unbelievable. His care for people is unbelievable.
|
09-27-2009, 07:40 PM
|  | Puritanboard Freshman | | Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Leesburg, VA
Posts: 368
Thanks: 17
Thanked 120 Times in 76 Posts
| | Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamalas That reminds me of another Calvin quote I read today: Quote: |
We must, therefore, repudiate the oft-repeated sentiment of Chrysostom, "Whom he draws, he draws willingly"; insinuating that the Lord only stretches out his hand, and waits to see whether we will be pleased to take his aid.
| | In a sense, though, Chrysostom is right: God draws a person, He makes them willing.
|
09-27-2009, 10:04 PM
| | whippersnapper | | Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Purcellville, Virginia
Posts: 2,728
Thanks: 1,454
Thanked 538 Times in 327 Posts
| | Quote:
Originally Posted by P. F. Pugh Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamalas That reminds me of another Calvin quote I read today: Quote: |
We must, therefore, repudiate the oft-repeated sentiment of Chrysostom, "Whom he draws, he draws willingly"; insinuating that the Lord only stretches out his hand, and waits to see whether we will be pleased to take his aid.
| | In a sense, though, Chrysostom is right: God draws a person, He makes them willing. | I'm no expert on the church fathers but I don't think that was what Chrysostom meant. Perhaps someone with more familiarity with Chrysostom could comment?  | |
| Thread Tools | | | | Display Modes |  Linear Mode |
Posting Rules
| You may not post new threads You may not post replies You may not post attachments You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
| | |
|
John Calvin, Institutes III:xv.3.
Martin Luther, Table Talk
