Reign of Christ- When did it begin?

Scott1 · #1 (**permalink**) 01-31-2009, 08:41 PM

Jesus is King of Kings and Lord of Lords now and He reigns now.

In what way do we say that He reigned in the Old Testament?

In what sense did He receive his investiture when He ascended into Heaven after His death, burial and resurrection, having conquered sin and death? (cf Acts 1).

How was His reign different when He ascended into heaven?

-----Added 1/31/2009 at 08:41:36 EST-----

Any thoughts on Christ's reign?

OPC'n · #2 (**permalink**) 01-31-2009, 09:02 PM

Scott,
I'm sure that you don't need my input, but I saw this awhile ago and thought others would participate so I didn't. But looks like no one has yet so here goes my thoughts:

In what way do we say that He reigned in the Old Testament? He reigned in all areas. I think the only difference was that He was not in His man state and had not yet defeated death and there lies the difference from the NT. In the NT, He now reigns in His man state over death. Also, in the NT He bound Satan from deceiving that nations as he (Satan) did in the OT.

In what sense did He receive his investiture when He ascended into Heaven after His death, burial and resurrection, having conquered sin and death? (cf Acts 1). Could it be when God the Father gave Him the Kingdom over which He will rule until He defeats His last enemy which is death, then He will give it back to God the Father?

How was His reign different when He ascended into heaven?...different from what OT or NT? Anyway here's my simple answer: God gave Him the kingdom and Satan is bound. Sorry, these are not very good answers because they just popped off the top of my head...didn't really research...my bad!

Theognome · #3 (**permalink**) 01-31-2009, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott1

Jesus is King of Kings and Lord of Lords now and He reigns now.

In what way do we say that He reigned in the Old Testament?

In what sense did He receive his investiture when He ascended into Heaven after His death, burial and resurrection, having conquered sin and death? (cf Acts 1).

How was His reign different when He ascended into heaven?

-----Added 1/31/2009 at 08:41:36 EST-----

Any thoughts on Christ's reign?

Christ's reign is eternal.

In the beginning was the word, and the word was with God, and the word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. In Him was life, and the life was the light of men. And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it. John 1:1-5

The only difference between OT and NT Christ is His incarnation- but said incarnation did not change His eternal rule as the second person of the Godhead.

I will declare the decree: the Lord has said to Me, You are My Son, today I have begotten You. Ask of Me, and I will give You the nations for Your inheritance, and the ends of the earth for Your possession. Psalm 2:7-8

His reign was not understood by the Hebrews of Christ's day, for they were looking for an earthly king as opposed to a heavenly one. But that is not peculiar to the NT, for the same behavior was demonstrated in 1 Samuel 8. The reign of Christ is unchanging- only the accomplishment of eternal salvation for His elect on the cross has changed; and thus our understanding of His reign on this side of the cross is more complete. But in practical terms, Christ's reign is the same from eternity to eternity, for all things were/are made through Him and are subject to him.

Theognome

Scott1 · #4 (**permalink**) 02-01-2009, 02:04 AM

So, when Christ preached the "Kingdom of God" in the New Testament, something the disciples had not heard of, was that something that did not exist in the Old Testament or was Christ only making it more explicit?

Does Christ reign as "King of Kings" beginning when He was resurrected and ascended to Heaven (cf Acts 1) because before that time He had not conquered sin and death?

Quote:

sjonee

Could it be when God the Father gave Him the Kingdom over which He will rule until He defeats His last enemy which is death, then He will give it back to God the Father?

I've not thought of Christ giving back His Kingdom because "He shall reign forever and forever" (i.e. Handel's Messiah, Hallelujah Chorus)- in what sense do you mean?

Quote:

Theognome

But in practical terms, Christ's reign is the same from eternity to eternity, for all things were/are made through Him and are subject to him.

Indeed, Colossians 1 indicates He even sustains, "holds together" the universe.

I have heard it said, our Lord received His investiture when He was resurrected and ascended (after having conquered sin and death and ascended to God the Father's right hand) and that He will "consummate" His Kingdom when He returns to judge all mankind.

It would seem then, from this statement, that Christ was not invested as King before that (not saying that, only trying to clarify understanding as some good commentators have described it this way).

OPC'n · #5 (**permalink**) 02-01-2009, 02:25 AM

I believe the OT saints saw dimly even more so than we do now, but they saw nonetheless. Abraham looked to that city with foundations whose builder is God. Others before and after viewed the same city from a distance but by faith came into that city. That city must have its King, its Savior which was first promised to Adam and many after him. They knew.

1 Cor 15:20 "But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. 25For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27For he "has put everything under his feet." Now when it says that "everything" has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. 28When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all."

Scott1 · #6 (**permalink**) 02-01-2009, 02:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sjonee

I believe the OT saints saw dimly even more so than we do now, but they saw nonetheless. Abraham looked to that city with foundations whose builder is God. Others before and after viewed the same city from a distance but by faith came into that city. That city must have its King, its Savior which was first promised to Adam and many after him. They knew.

1 Cor 15:20 "But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. 25For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27For he "has put everything under his feet." Now when it says that "everything" has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. 28When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all."

Wow.

Much to ponder here. I Cor. 15:20-28.

**py3ak** · #7 (**permalink**) 02-01-2009, 12:55 PM

It would seem that Christ's mediatorial kingdom extends from the ascension until the judgment. He was King before that time, but entered into that authority, sitting on the right hand of God, at that time; and then He will reign until the last enemy has been put under His feet, and all things are summed up in Him.

Guido's Brother · #8 (**permalink**) 02-01-2009, 02:10 PM

According to Article 27 of the Belgic Confession:

This church has existed from the beginning of the world and will be
to the end, for Christ is an eternal King who cannot be without
subjects.

Rangerus · #9 (**permalink**) 02-01-2009, 04:56 PM

Reign of Christ- When did it begin?

In the beginning.

Scott1 · #10 (**permalink**) 02-02-2009, 01:50 AM

Quote:

py3ak

It would seem that Christ's mediatorial kingdom extends from the ascension until the judgment. He was King before that time, but entered into that authority, sitting on the right hand of God, at that time;

Very helpful, thanks.

So looking at the statement I have heard from some good commentators, words to the effect:

Quote:

"When Jesus ascended, He received His investiture and rules now. When He returns, His Kingdom will be consummated when He returns as Judge."

Is it biblical to say the difference in Christ's reign is at the point when He accomplished the atonement (resurrected and then ascended into Heaven)? At that point, He conquered sin and death by atoning for the sins of all God has chosen to redeem and is now "invested" as mediator (adding somehow, to His glorious role from eternity past as King of Kings and Lord of Lords)?

**py3ak** · #11 (**permalink**) 02-02-2009, 07:06 PM

I think the question is related to Psalm 110. When did Christ sit at the right hand of God? The ascension seems like the logical answer. Some of the Puritans also held that He received an even fuller measure of the Spirit at that time, and so the Spirit is called the Spirit of Christ (and I think we could extrapolate from that, that the sending of the Spirit on Pentecost was, so to speak, the first official act of the enthroned Christ).

There is a distinction between Christ's essential glory, as God the Son; His native glory, which relates to His person as the God-man; and His glory as Mediator (which perhaps could be called official). Obviously His essential glory knows no increase, diminution, or boundary.

Scott1 · #12 (**permalink**) 03-06-2009, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott1

Quote:

Originally Posted by sjonee

I believe the OT saints saw dimly even more so than we do now, but they saw nonetheless. Abraham looked to that city with foundations whose builder is God. Others before and after viewed the same city from a distance but by faith came into that city. That city must have its King, its Savior which was first promised to Adam and many after him. They knew.

1 Cor 15:20 "But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. 25For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27For he "has put everything under his feet." Now when it says that "everything" has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. 28When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all."

Wow.

Much to ponder here. I Cor. 15:20-28.

I have done some research and thinking about this. This aspect of Christ's reign is becoming more clear. Christ has reigned as mediator since His resurrection and ascension, and will eventually present the kingdom to His Father. I think I'm understanding Christ has always reigned, even in the Old Testament, but not as a mediator. That came after the atonement and fulfilled His New Testament role as prophet, priest and king. Types and shadows of that role existed in the Old Testament, but it had not yet occurred and been fulfilled in Christ.

Wow.

Mr Packer seems to sum this up brilliantly.

Concise Theology, JI Packer p. 130

Quote:

Christ's session [reign in heaven] will continue until all his and our enemies, including death, are brought to nothing. Death, the last enemy, will cease to be when Christ at his appearing raises the dead for judgment (John 5:28-29). Once judgment has been executed, the work of the mediatorial kingdom will be over, and Christ will triumphantly deliver the kingdom to th Father (I Cor. 15:24-28).

Pergamum · #13 (**permalink**) 03-06-2009, 11:02 PM

GREAT THREAD!!!!!!!!! Thanks for starting it!

TheocraticMonarchist · #14 (**permalink**) 03-07-2009, 02:02 PM

I'm no theologian, but my understanding is something like this:

As God, Christ has always been ruler of heaven and earth.
Adam was created in the image of God, and given dominion over earth, but fell into sin and lost dominion to Satan. (Satan was able to tempt Christ in the wilderness with this dominion).
Christ came as the second Adam and took dominion back. Thus Christ as God has always been ruler of heaven and earth, and Christ after the incarnation, being the second Adam, is now the ruleing over what Adam lost.

John 12:31

"Now is the judgment of this world; now the ruler of this world will be cast out."

Thoughts???

Scott1 · #15 (**permalink**) 03-07-2009, 05:05 PM

Is it correct to say that in Christ's resurrection and ascension, the devil was "bound" (restrained)?

If so, before that time, in the Old Testament, do we assume the devil was not "bound" (restrained) and if so, how can we think of Christ reigning if the devil was "free" at that time?

And since, Scripture tells us (I Cor 15:24-28) that Jesus will put everything under His feet at the final judgment, including death, and present the Kingdom to the Father, was there ever a time in the past when the Kingdom was given to the Son? That is, a time when the Son did not reign, because it was the Father's?

(Please don't assume I'm advocating a view on this, only trying to understand, especially our terminology)

Anyone have biblical theology to input on these questions?