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The Confession of Faith Discuss Westminster Standards, 1689 Confession and 3 Forms of Unity
Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for He who promised is faithful (Heb. 10:23)

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Old 09-22-2008, 01:40 PM
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Additional areas you would like see addressed in the confessions - and sample drafts

On several other threads this has been floated:




Areas I'd like to see addressed in the Confession:

Relationship of Confessional churches to those of other beliefs.

Statement on the Lordship Controversy (of course, there are already chapters on Saving Faith and Repentance Unto Life, but I think it might be possible to amend or add to them in such a way that they speak clearly to the problems created by Chafer/Ryrie/Hodges/Wilkin.)

Family and gender issues

Evangelism and Missions






What other areas would you like to see added?


Furthermore, if you had to write a draft of what would be a representative view for the reformed or the reformed baptist, please submit it here.
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Old 09-22-2008, 02:34 PM
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Well, this list was drafted by my best friend in college (you reading, Charlie?)...and I'm pretty much in agreement. I would especially like the last, "Evangelism and Missions."

Doctrine of the Holy Spirit may be relevant, as well.

What do you think of the PCUS 1903 emendation which follows? The EPC has adopted it; to my knowledge, no others have, though some have adopted chapter 34 on the Holy Spirit. Some say that this chapter 35 embraces Arminianism. However, I really like point 35.4.

Quote:
CHAPTER 35

Of the Gospel of the Love of God and Missions

35.1 GOD in infinite and perfect love, having provided in the covenant of grace,
through the mediation and sacrifice of the Lord Jesus Christ, as way of life and
salvation, sufficient for and adapted to the whole lost race of man, doth freely offer this
salvation to all men in the gospel.

35.2 In the gospel God declares his love for the world and his desire that all men
should be saved; reveals fully and clearly the only way of salvation; promises eternal life
to all who truly repent and believe in Christ; invites and commands all to embrace the
offered mercy; and by his Spirit accompanying the word pleads with men to accept his
gracious invitation.

35.3 It is the duty and privilege of everyone who hears the gospel immediately to
accept its merciful provisions; and they who continue in impenitence and unbelief incur
aggravated guilt and perish by their own fault.

35.4 Since there is no other way of salvation than that revealed in the gospel, and
since in the divinely established and ordinary method of grace faith cometh by hearing
the word of God, Christ hath commissioned his church to go into all the world and to
make disciples of all nations. All believers are, therefore, under obligation to sustain the
ordinances of the Christian religion where they are already established, and to
contribute by their prayers, gifts, and personal efforts to the extension of the kingdom of
Christ throughout the whole earth.
You can find this, and chapter 34 on the Holy Spirit, here.
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Old 09-22-2008, 03:09 PM
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More in depth teachings on the apographs of Scripture.
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Old 09-22-2008, 03:19 PM
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The Church needs an expanded statement on Biblical inerrancy and the nature and extent of Biblical authority. Maybe the Church should just adopt the Chicago Statement on Biblical Inerrancy.
Two recent confessional statements of faith have been attempted by Churches in Southeast Asia. In Indonesia, Dr. Stephen Tong's group, which I think is called the Gereja Reformed Injili Indonesia, has an additional confessional statement besides the three forms of unity. The Evangelical Reformed Church of Singapore, a congregation related to the Protesant Reformed Churches, wrote their own statement of faith back in the 1980s.
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Old 09-22-2008, 03:33 PM
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I would want something a bit better than the Chicago statement.

Quote:
We affirm that inspiration, strictly speaking, applies only to the autographic text of Scripture, which in the providence of God can be ascertained from available manuscripts with great accuracy. We further affirm that copies and translations of Scripture are the Word of God to the extent that they faithfully represent the original.
To say that copies are the Word of God to the extent that they represent the original, which doesn't exist, really doesn't say much for our copies.

I would love to see something more definitive regarding the copies. We are unable to compare them to the original, yet they are what we have in hand, so let's try a bit harder to make a definitive statement on them.
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Old 09-22-2008, 03:41 PM
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Here is an article by Dr. Stonehouse and John Murray on the 1903 revsions (Murray says chp 35 is not reformed).
Articles on the 1903 Revisions of the Confession of Faith by Murray and Stonehouse
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Old 09-22-2008, 03:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NaphtaliPress View Post
Here is an article by Dr. Stonehouse and John Murray on the 1903 revsions (Murray says chp 35 is not reformed).
Articles on the 1903 Revisions of the Confession of Faith by Murray and Stonehouse
There are a few things that may cross the line in Chap 35. John Murray did believe in the free offer to all men (if I remember correctly) but the language in Chap 35 seems to say that the Holy Spirit is calling any who hear the Word, which is certainly arminian.

Thanks for the link to Murray's critique by the way. As Murray said, Chap 35 definitely errs in not distinguishing between the general love of everyone and God's love for His elect (2 very different things).
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Old 09-22-2008, 03:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ManleyBeasley View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by NaphtaliPress View Post
Here is an article by Dr. Stonehouse and John Murray on the 1903 revsions (Murray says chp 35 is not reformed).
Articles on the 1903 Revisions of the Confession of Faith by Murray and Stonehouse
There are a few things that may cross the line in Chap 35. John Murray did believe in the free offer to all men (if I remember correctly) but the language in Chap 35 seems to say that the Holy Spirit is calling any who hear the Word which is certainly arminian.
Yes; see Matthew Winzer's review of the Murray/Stonehouse view of the Free Offer at the link below.

http://www.thebluebanner.com/pdf/bluebanner9-10&12.pdf
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Old 09-22-2008, 05:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NaphtaliPress View Post
Here is an article by Dr. Stonehouse and John Murray on the 1903 revsions (Murray says chp 35 is not reformed).
Articles on the 1903 Revisions of the Confession of Faith by Murray and Stonehouse
Interesting! Thanks.
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Old 09-22-2008, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NaphtaliPress View Post
Here is an article by Dr. Stonehouse and John Murray on the 1903 revsions (Murray says chp 35 is not reformed).
Articles on the 1903 Revisions of the Confession of Faith by Murray and Stonehouse
Bad link.
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Old 09-22-2008, 09:48 PM
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It was working earlier; may be a Yahoo Groups things; my file originally so see my new PB blog entry,
Articles on the 1903 Revisions of the Confession of Faith by Murray and Stonehouse - The PuritanBoard
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaseyBessette View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by NaphtaliPress View Post
Here is an article by Dr. Stonehouse and John Murray on the 1903 revsions (Murray says chp 35 is not reformed).
Articles on the 1903 Revisions of the Confession of Faith by Murray and Stonehouse
Bad link.
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Old 09-22-2008, 10:28 PM
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Despite necessary rewritings of points 1-3 of chapter 35 to avoid the intentional inclusion or unintended implication, whichever it be, of Arminian teaching, I think that point 4 is well stated.

I would also like to see a clear section on the role of the Mosaic law.
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Old 09-22-2008, 10:45 PM
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No revisions, expansions, clarifications, or any other changes can or should be made to the WCF. For to posit such a need would be to suggest that the WCF is imperfect, in as much as it would be an admission that it doesn't articulate everything we need to know about God from the Bible. And as many of this site's best have pointed out, the Confession is so true, and so faithful to Scripture, that for the Confession to be inadequate would be the same thing as saying the Scriptures are inadequate.

So all of you wanting to expand or clarify or (whatever) the Confession: REPENT!
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Old 09-22-2008, 10:46 PM
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A confession can be a unifying asset or a divisive liability. Additions without consensus will undoubtedly make it divisive.
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Old 09-22-2008, 11:18 PM
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A confession can be a unifying asset or a divisive liability. Additions without consensus will undoubtedly make it divisive.
Seems to me that a confessional statement is inherently both unifying and divisive at the same time. It serves to rally and unify those who are in agreement while serving as a bone of contention with regards to those who disagree.
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Old 09-22-2008, 11:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SolaScriptura:
for the Confession to be inadequate would be the same thing as saying the Scriptures are inadequate
I was tempted to take this as a joke. That doesn't sound like "Sola Scriptura" to me.

The Bible contains what we need to know about God. The WCF sums it up. A summary of the Scripture is, by definition, inadequate as an expression of what God wants us to know. This isn't to say it's bad or even mediocre! To the contrary, the WCF is a great summary. But it's just that -- a summary.


Oh, by the way important: my last post wasn't referring to revising the original confession, but chapter 35, which isn't actually in the WCF as we have it here on PB. It's an addition considered to be tainted by Arminianism. I was saying that its inclusion would require rewriting.
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Old 09-22-2008, 11:52 PM
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Seems to me that a confessional statement is inherently both unifying and divisive at the same time. It serves to rally and unify those who are in agreement while serving as a bone of contention with regards to those who disagree.
Carry out this idea consistently over a range of issues, as is addressed in a confession, and the only rallying will be the head of the home calling his family to join with him in maintaining his particular interpretation of Scripture.
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Old 09-23-2008, 12:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NaphtaliPress View Post
Here is an article by Dr. Stonehouse and John Murray on the 1903 revsions (Murray says chp 35 is not reformed).
Articles on the 1903 Revisions of the Confession of Faith by Murray and Stonehouse
Got another link. Or just Google it?
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Old 09-23-2008, 12:34 AM
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Quote:
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A confession can be a unifying asset or a divisive liability. Additions without consensus will undoubtedly make it divisive.
Brother,that is an EXCELLENT point!

Every extra sentence added thus becomes another hurdle that could trip up people who would like to sign onto the confession.

So, there does seem to be a virtue in keeping confessions purposely broad and simple it seems.


I guess another question then would be, "If we could throw out any portion of the confession" which would it be. But onceit is written, then it is written and binding, but folks are free to vary somewhat in the realm of the unwritten.
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