Practical views on fasting

jwithnell · #1 (**permalink**) 06-08-2008, 08:41 PM

I'd like to know how others of you incorporate fasting into your walks before God. This is not necessarily a question about if we should fast, but rather a practical discussion on the when, wheres, and whys of your incorporating this discipline into your lives.

Daniel Ritchie · #2 (**permalink**) 06-08-2008, 09:01 PM

The Sabbath is not a good time to fast, as we are to call the Sabbath a delight (Is. 58).

jwithnell · #3 (**permalink**) 06-08-2008, 09:10 PM

Funny you should mention the Sabbath, because that is one aspect I have been thinking about too, but I was starting from a broader perspective ...

Daniel Ritchie · #4 (**permalink**) 06-08-2008, 09:18 PM

Here is a link to a post on the subject:

The Discipline of Fasting (1) « Puritanism Today

VirginiaHuguenot · #5 (**permalink**) 06-08-2008, 09:37 PM

It is important to distinguish between public, private and family fasting, because the occasions and directions for each vary. Also, directions will vary depending on the person and circumstance (elderly, sick, pregnant, children, etc.). However, assuming we are talking about private fasting, I'll quote some guidance which has been useful to me.

Links and Downloads Manager - Christian Walk Links - The Christian's Daily Walk by Henry Scudder - The PuritanBoard

Links and Downloads Manager - Christian Walk Links - The Practice of Piety - The PuritanBoard

Lewis Bayly, The Practice of Piety, pp. 209-211:

Quote:

2. Of the Time.

The holy Scripture appoints no time under the New Testament to fast; but leaves it to Christians’ own free choice (Rom. xiv. 3; 1 Cor. vii. 5), to fast as occasions shall be offered to them (Matt. ix. 15; ) as when a man becomes an humble, an earnest suitor to God for the pardon of some gross sin committed; or for the prevention of some sin to which a man feels himself by Satan solicited; or to obtain some special blessing which he wants; or to avert some judgment which a man fears, or is already fallen upon himself or others; or, lastly, to subdue his flesh to his spirit, that he may more cheerfully pour forth his soul to God by prayer. Upon these occasions a man may fast a day or longer, as his occasion requires, and the constitution of his body and other needful affairs will permit (Lev. xxiii. 32; Josh. vii. 6; Esth. iv. 16.)

3. Of the Manner of a Private Fast.

The true manner of performing a private fast consists partly in outward, partly in inward actions.

The outward actions are, to abstain, for the time that we fast—First, From all worldly business and labour, making our fasting day, as it were, a Sabbath day (Lev. xxiii. 28, 36; Joel i. 14; ii. 15; ) for worldly business will distract our minds from holy devotion.

Secondly, From all manner of food; yea, from bread and water, so far as health will permit (2 Sam. iii. 35; Ezra x. 6; Dan. x. 3; Est. iv. 16; Acts ix. 9.)

1. That so we may acknowlege our own indignity, as being unworthy of life and all the means for its maintenance. 2. That by afflicting the body, the soul, which follows the constitution thereof, may be the more humbled. 3. That so we may take a godly revenge upon ourselves for abusing our liberty in the use of God’s creatures (2 Cor. vii. 11.) 4. That by the hunger of our bodies, through want of these earthly things, our souls may learn to hunger more eagerly after spiritual and heavenly food. 5. To put us in mind that as we abstain from food which is lawful, so we should much more abstain from sin, which is altogether unlawful.

Thirdly, From good and costly apparel (Exod. xxxiii. 5, 6; ) that as the abuse of these puffs us up with pride, so the laying aside their lawful use may witness our humility. And to this end in ancient times they used, especially in public fasts, to put on sackcloth, or other coarse apparel (Est. iv. 1, 2; Jonah iii. 5, 6; Joel. i. 13; Matt. xi. 21.) The equity of which still remains, especially in public fasts, at which time to come into the assembly with starched bands, crisped hair, brave apparel, and decked with flowers, or perfumes, argues a soul that is neither humble before God, nor ever knew the true use of so holy an exercise.

Fourthly, From the full measure of ordinary sleep (2 Sam. xii. 16; Joel i. 13; Est. iv. 3.) That thou mayest that way also humble thy body; and that thy soul may watch and pray, to be prepared for the coming of Christ. And if thou wilt break thy sleep early and late for worldly gain, how much more shouldst thou do it for the service of God? And if Ahab, in imitation of the godly, did in his fast lie in sackcloth, to break his sleep by night (1 Kings xxi. 27), what shall we think of those who on a fasting-day will yield themselves to sleep in the open church?

Fifthly and lastly, From all outward pleasures of our senses: so that as it was not the throat only that sinned, so must not the throat only be punished; and therefore we must endeavour to make our eyes, as at all times, so especially on that day, to fast from beholding vanities, our ears from hearing mirth or music, but such as may move to mourn; our nostrils from pleasant smells, our tongues from lying, dissembling, and slandering; that so nothing may hinder our true humiliation, but that all may be signs that we are unfeignedly humbled. Thus much of the outward manner.

The inward manner of fasting consists in two things:—1. Repentance; 2. Prayer.

Repentance hath two parts:—1. Penitency for sins past; 2. Amendment of life in time to come.

This penitency consists in three things—First, An inward insight of sin, and sense of mercy; Secondly, A bewailing of thy vile state; Thirdly, An humble and particular confession of all thy known sins,

staythecourse · #6 (**permalink**) 06-08-2008, 09:42 PM

Donald Whitney did a nice job of incorporating fasting into our Christian lives. The book was Spiritual Disciplines.

Daniel Ritchie · #7 (**permalink**) 06-08-2008, 09:43 PM

Has anyone read John Piper's book on the subject?

KMK · #8 (**permalink**) 06-09-2008, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VirginiaHuguenot

It is important to distinguish between public, private and family fasting, because the occasions and directions for each vary. Also, directions will vary depending on the person and circumstance (elderly, sick, pregnant, children, etc.). However, assuming we are talking about private fasting, I'll quote some guidance which has been useful to me.

Links and Downloads Manager - Christian Walk Links - The Christian's Daily Walk by Henry Scudder - The PuritanBoard

Links and Downloads Manager - Christian Walk Links - The Practice of Piety - The PuritanBoard

Lewis Bayly, The Practice of Piety, pp. 209-211:

Quote:

2. Of the Time.

The holy Scripture appoints no time under the New Testament to fast; but leaves it to Christians’ own free choice (Rom. xiv. 3; 1 Cor. vii. 5), to fast as occasions shall be offered to them (Matt. ix. 15; ) as when a man becomes an humble, an earnest suitor to God for the pardon of some gross sin committed; or for the prevention of some sin to which a man feels himself by Satan solicited; or to obtain some special blessing which he wants; or to avert some judgment which a man fears, or is already fallen upon himself or others; or, lastly, to subdue his flesh to his spirit, that he may more cheerfully pour forth his soul to God by prayer. Upon these occasions a man may fast a day or longer, as his occasion requires, and the constitution of his body and other needful affairs will permit (Lev. xxiii. 32; Josh. vii. 6; Esth. iv. 16.)

3. Of the Manner of a Private Fast.

The true manner of performing a private fast consists partly in outward, partly in inward actions.

The outward actions are, to abstain, for the time that we fast—First, From all worldly business and labour, making our fasting day, as it were, a Sabbath day (Lev. xxiii. 28, 36; Joel i. 14; ii. 15; ) for worldly business will distract our minds from holy devotion.

Secondly, From all manner of food; yea, from bread and water, so far as health will permit (2 Sam. iii. 35; Ezra x. 6; Dan. x. 3; Est. iv. 16; Acts ix. 9.)

1. That so we may acknowlege our own indignity, as being unworthy of life and all the means for its maintenance. 2. That by afflicting the body, the soul, which follows the constitution thereof, may be the more humbled. 3. That so we may take a godly revenge upon ourselves for abusing our liberty in the use of God’s creatures (2 Cor. vii. 11.) 4. That by the hunger of our bodies, through want of these earthly things, our souls may learn to hunger more eagerly after spiritual and heavenly food. 5. To put us in mind that as we abstain from food which is lawful, so we should much more abstain from sin, which is altogether unlawful.

Thirdly, From good and costly apparel (Exod. xxxiii. 5, 6; ) that as the abuse of these puffs us up with pride, so the laying aside their lawful use may witness our humility. And to this end in ancient times they used, especially in public fasts, to put on sackcloth, or other coarse apparel (Est. iv. 1, 2; Jonah iii. 5, 6; Joel. i. 13; Matt. xi. 21.) The equity of which still remains, especially in public fasts, at which time to come into the assembly with starched bands, crisped hair, brave apparel, and decked with flowers, or perfumes, argues a soul that is neither humble before God, nor ever knew the true use of so holy an exercise.

Fourthly, From the full measure of ordinary sleep (2 Sam. xii. 16; Joel i. 13; Est. iv. 3.) That thou mayest that way also humble thy body; and that thy soul may watch and pray, to be prepared for the coming of Christ. And if thou wilt break thy sleep early and late for worldly gain, how much more shouldst thou do it for the service of God? And if Ahab, in imitation of the godly, did in his fast lie in sackcloth, to break his sleep by night (1 Kings xxi. 27), what shall we think of those who on a fasting-day will yield themselves to sleep in the open church?

Fifthly and lastly, From all outward pleasures of our senses: so that as it was not the throat only that sinned, so must not the throat only be punished; and therefore we must endeavour to make our eyes, as at all times, so especially on that day, to fast from beholding vanities, our ears from hearing mirth or music, but such as may move to mourn; our nostrils from pleasant smells, our tongues from lying, dissembling, and slandering; that so nothing may hinder our true humiliation, but that all may be signs that we are unfeignedly humbled. Thus much of the outward manner.

The inward manner of fasting consists in two things:—1. Repentance; 2. Prayer.

Repentance hath two parts:—1. Penitency for sins past; 2. Amendment of life in time to come.

This penitency consists in three things—First, An inward insight of sin, and sense of mercy; Secondly, A bewailing of thy vile state; Thirdly, An humble and particular confession of all thy known sins,

Awesome stuff, Andrew! I especially liked point number 4. I had never thought of it that way. (Good support for morning devotionals) Where would the fasting of intimacy between husband and wife fall? Point #5?

Besides often 'sleep fasting' in favor of morning devotional time, I also started fasting lunches at work a few years ago. This makes for much more fruitful devotional time during my lunch break at work.

VirginiaHuguenot · #9 (**permalink**) 06-10-2008, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KMK

Awesome stuff, Andrew! I especially liked point number 4. I had never thought of it that way. (Good support for morning devotionals) Where would the fasting of intimacy between husband and wife fall? Point #5?

Yes, I think so.

I found another good, practical resource: Samuel Miller, The Duty, the Benefits, and the Proper Methods of Religious Fasting.

Fasting (Samuel Miller)

jwithnell · #10 (**permalink**) 06-11-2008, 09:56 PM

I didn't mean to abandon this thread

I truly appreciate the perspectives offered and would like to pick this up again in the near future. My time is rather insane right now, and that last time I had for prayer and fasting is sitting as a quiet interlude in my mind and heart.

jwithnell · #11 (**permalink**) 06-15-2008, 04:51 PM

The Sabbath gives me the chance to finally give some thought to this.

When I first posted, what I was wondering is how modern folks with a reformed perspective incorporate fasting into their personal faith and practice. While my time on PB is limited, it doesn't seem like fasting is a topic that comes up very often, although scripture clearly sees it as a practice that has spiritual benefit.

I do appreciate the posts that give an historical perspective. I found Mr. Scudder's Daily Walk beneficial in many areas, but especially so regarding fasting. His "preparation" takes me a good chunk of the day and leaves me thoroughly edified.

So, what is your practice now? How is fasting practiced in your congregation?

Thanks in advance.

VirginiaHuguenot · #12 (**permalink**) 06-15-2008, 05:11 PM

Our congregation practices private, family and congregational fasting. It is a subject that our pastor teaches from the pulpit from time to time and gives emphasis to, precisely because it is part of the spiritual walk commended to us by the Bible itself and our Puritan forbears.

You're right that the subject is not given its due weight on the PB. In part, this might be because, like almsgiving or secret prayer, some might not want to talk about their secret fasting publicly. Or perhaps few think about it as a regular means of grace as understood by the Puritans. As I wrote in this thread on Puritan Piety,

Quote:

Singing of psalms, meditation, family worship, fasting are means of grace that are often overlooked by many in our day.

Nevertheless, a quick search of PB threads identified 222 which reference 'fasting.' Sometimes it comes up when people are discussing Lent and Ramadan. Here are a few from the archives which might be of interest:

Prayer, Meditation, and Fasting
What is the purpose of fasting?
On Fasting
Sanctify the Congregation: A Call to the Solemn Assembly and to Corporate Repentance
How to fast
Observing a church-wide fast
History of the Solemn Assembly
Fasting
Spiritual Fasting?
Fasting
Fasting
Fasting

jwithnell · #13 (**permalink**) 06-15-2008, 09:09 PM

I understand the "secret" part -- I don't really even discuss it with my spouse. He just knows that when meals are prepared ahead of time and I've asked to "disappear" that I'm not going to be around food that day. He is a real blessing and encouragement to me!

KMK · #14 (**permalink**) 06-15-2008, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VirginiaHuguenot

You're right that the subject is not given its due weight on the PB. In part, this might be because, like almsgiving or secret prayer, some might not want to talk about their secret fasting publicly.

I wish this was not so. I don't think there is anything wrong with discussing these issues publically if our hearts are in the right place.

I love hearing the details of people's fasting, tithing and giving. It helps me to understand my own. The problem seems to be that whenever we get into discussions about tithing for example, anti-tithers jump on board and de-rail the thread. There is also the inherant problem that some, who are not convinced in their own minds about tithing, for example, will be stumbled. (This seems to happen often in discussions about wine with the Lord's Supper or the RPW)

Perhaps a forum could be made for these kinds of discussions with a disclaimer: "The opinions expressed by individuals in this forum are their own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of your own conscience."

Seriously, though, I would love to talk about the details of people's fasting practices or whether people tithe before taxes or after taxes etc.

Pergamum · #15 (**permalink**) 06-16-2008, 01:50 AM

In the Muslim world, the Ramadan fast is very vigorous - 30 days no eating or drinking during sunlight. I did it last year and it was very hard - especially in the tropics. It helped me to see the spiritual bondage of the people and every night I got to break the fast with neighbors and talk to them during this highly spiritually-charged time. It also helped me to break with my neighbors when false spiritual matters were involved and explain to them why Jesus's way of fasting is better.

I was able also to sympathize more with those who are truly lacking in food.

Also, I exercised discipline over my body (which I need to do more often...especially when I want my wive's brownies!).

Here is a question, however, about congregational fasting:

If the Puritans were against holidays set by man, why would they set a fast day as a holy day of fasting and expect their congregations to abide by it? They throw out Christmas altogether instead of merely reforming it and yet they set their own holidays themselves that are not mentioned in the Word. Why is this not inconsistent?

Pergamum · #16 (**permalink**) 06-16-2008, 02:03 AM

hmmm..I should have written "my wife's brownies" not my wives' brownies..... HA!

VirginiaHuguenot · #17 (**permalink**) 06-16-2008, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KMK

Quote:

Originally Posted by VirginiaHuguenot

You're right that the subject is not given its due weight on the PB. In part, this might be because, like almsgiving or secret prayer, some might not want to talk about their secret fasting publicly.

I wish this was not so. I don't think there is anything wrong with discussing these issues publically if our hearts are in the right place.

I love hearing the details of people's fasting, tithing and giving. It helps me to understand my own. The problem seems to be that whenever we get into discussions about tithing for example, anti-tithers jump on board and de-rail the thread. There is also the inherant problem that some, who are not convinced in their own minds about tithing, for example, will be stumbled. (This seems to happen often in discussions about wine with the Lord's Supper or the RPW)

Perhaps a forum could be made for these kinds of discussions with a disclaimer: "The opinions expressed by individuals in this forum are their own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of your own conscience."

Seriously, though, I would love to talk about the details of people's fasting practices or whether people tithe before taxes or after taxes etc.

Martin Luther said, "I have so much to do that I shall spend the first three hours in prayer.” Oliver Heywood's diaries (I don't recall if he intended them to be published) record that between 1665 and 1701, he partook of 1,256 fasts. Some have stated publicly the details of their prayer life or fasting experience or almsgiving, and we can no doubt benefit from such. My own preference is to keep that a private matter. It's something I personally would rather speak of to my own family or session or with a friend over coffee or ale, if at all, rather than post such details on the internet. But the principles involved are very much worth proclaiming from the rooftops, as it were.

KMK · #18 (**permalink**) 06-16-2008, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VirginiaHuguenot

Quote:

Originally Posted by KMK

Quote:

Originally Posted by VirginiaHuguenot

You're right that the subject is not given its due weight on the PB. In part, this might be because, like almsgiving or secret prayer, some might not want to talk about their secret fasting publicly.

I wish this was not so. I don't think there is anything wrong with discussing these issues publically if our hearts are in the right place.

I love hearing the details of people's fasting, tithing and giving. It helps me to understand my own. The problem seems to be that whenever we get into discussions about tithing for example, anti-tithers jump on board and de-rail the thread. There is also the inherant problem that some, who are not convinced in their own minds about tithing, for example, will be stumbled. (This seems to happen often in discussions about wine with the Lord's Supper or the RPW)

Perhaps a forum could be made for these kinds of discussions with a disclaimer: "The opinions expressed by individuals in this forum are their own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of your own conscience."

Seriously, though, I would love to talk about the details of people's fasting practices or whether people tithe before taxes or after taxes etc.

Martin Luther said, "I have so much to do that I shall spend the first three hours in prayer.” Oliver Heywood's diaries (I don't recall if he intended them to be published) record that between 1665 and 1701, he partook of 1,256 fasts. Some have stated publicly the details of their prayer life or fasting experience or almsgiving, and we can no doubt benefit from such. My own preference is to keep that a private matter. It's something I personally would rather speak of to my own family or session or with a friend over coffee or ale, if at all, rather than post such details on the internet. But the principles involved are very much worth proclaiming from the rooftops, as it were.

I look forward to that day, brother, when you might invite me to have that cup of coffee with you. Whether it is in this life or the next!

JonathanHunt · #19 (**permalink**) 06-16-2008, 09:44 AM

Would anyone define a fast as food and drink? Because for any lengthy fast not allowing yourself at least water could be quite dangerous. No, it IS quite dangerous!

Personally, if I fast, I allow water. My problem is that I have had to break fasts because of physical weakness and inability to do what I should be doing, and thats only after 6-8 hours or so.

J