Here is the question. I currently cant say that I want to be a preacher or a missionary. I have said for a few years now, and say now that i want to go to seminary to learn much more deeply about Scripture- particularly in reading in original tounges. Ive expressed this to my youth pastor- he sees that I have an inward desire but he has this idea- as do maybe my pastors too that I need an outward call? is this random people saying you should go to seminary?

furthermore, I understand that seminary is intense, and that its often a Masters degree. However 1) Im not interested enough in any regular Bachelors degree to get it- Id rather get a B Div- don't know why, thats just been how ive thought.
2) Im not touting myself, but based of my previous theological reading habits, I beileve i could do it successfully- maybe not full time even.

I guess, whats the advice? it seems my home church wont give me the necessary session recommendation.

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Jeff Rod
Eastwood Presbyterian Church PCA
member.
webpage: myspace.com/reformationforever

To live a simple, peaceable life before God
To owe as little as possible, to few as possible.

I would recommend an MAR (Master of Arts in Religion). It is not nearly as many classes as an M.Div., and it will still give you a solid grounding in the original languages, and you have great flexibility as to what classes you want to take. Most seminaries these days do not offer bachelor's degrees.

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Rev. Lane Keister
Teaching Elder, PCA, North Dakota (working out of bounds in a CRC and an RCA church)
http://greenbaggins.wordpress.com
http://brahmsgreenglove.blogspot.com
http://accenttranslation.blogspot.com

Jeff, I would recommend the MAR as well, but from your post I was wondering if you have a bachelors degree right now.

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Jeff Wyman
Seminarian
Little Farms Chapel OPC, Coopersville, MI
Puritan Reformed Theological Seminary, Grand Rapids, MI

"May grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord. His divine power has granted to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of him who called us to his own glory and excellence." 1 Peter 1:2-3 (ESV)

no bachelors degree yet.

No bachelor's degree, no recommendation from Session = no seminary.

Spend time studying your Bible instead and learn a trade or obtain the skills for a job.

__________________
Fredrick T. Greco
Senior Pastor, Christ Church PCA (Katy, TX)
Christ Church Blog

"The heart is the main thing in true religion...It is the hinge and turning-point in the condition of man's soul. If the heart is alive to God and quickened by the Spirit, the man is a living Christian. If the heart is dead and has not the Spirit, the man is dead before God." (J.C. Ryle)

i know of a few that do offer bachelors degrees, but they always want one to be 30 years of age and have some "unusual reason" for not having a bachelors. but wanting to get a bdiv instead of a B.A, B.S, etc is not "unusual" enough for them.

oky dokey.

Don't let anyone who lives thousands of miles away from you shatter all your dreams. There are ways you can get an education without going to a traditional seminary. Plenty of places offer degrees on line both bachelor and masters. I agree if you are not wanting to be a pastor don't bother with and M-DIV or a B-DIV which is basically an M-DIV without the languages. A traditional M -DIV is about 100-120 hours where an MAR is much shorter and has the same theological emphasis. You can get bachelors degrees completely on line from places like Moody Bible Institute. The PCA will accept degrees from Whitefield Seminary for ordination, and you can get both bachelors and masters and M/B-DIV's if you want.

An outward call is when you work around the people in charge and people in the church and they begin to see something in you and think that you would be good as a minister and that you should pursue ministry of some sort. Nowadays there are plenty of things you can do in the ministry with out being a pastor or missionary. Don't take the advice of one or two people who try to talk you out of what you have a desire to do, follow it through you never know what might happen.

__________________
Erick Bohndorf
http://qayaqtraveler.blogspot.com/
Jeremiah 23:16,17, "Thus says the Lord of hosts: “Do not listen to the words of the prophets who prophesy to you, filling you with vain hopes. They speak visions of their own minds, not from the mouth of the Lord. 17They say continually to those who despise the word of the Lord, ‘It shall be well with you’; and to everyone who stubbornly follows his own heart, they say, ‘No disaster shall come upon you."

I Pastor Fred, above.

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Josh Hicks, Chloë's Daddy
Member of TRBC. My Blog
The Puritan Pub (Team Blog)
Board Rules-Signature Requirements-Suggestions?

I'm not sure what there is to talk out of. The OP said that he did not want to be a minister:

He furthermore said that his church did not see evidence of gifts in him to support him in a calling (which would make sense, if he says that he does not want to be in ministry anyway).

Seminary is a place for pastors to be trained, not a place for laymen who want to skip a college degree to dabble in the Bible.

That does not mean that he should never go to seminary, or that he is forbidden, but dabbling will not do much good in the long term.

Pastor Fred, What I am not understanding yet is how me going to seminary without wanting to be a pastor at this time would be dabbling.- Yes nothing should ever replace my personal devotions, family devotions, and church attendance- but dabbling would seem to say that going would be a waste of time. where do i go to learn reformed apologetics, and such- my self teaching can only go so far- same for Hebrew and Greek. I guess i could go to Hebrew lessons at a synagouge but as the only one in my area is currently a liberal Jewish, all they teach is how to read outloud- no vocab and such.

This just seemed like a back handed comment, but maybe is was not intended to be.

I took what he said as, he was trying to find ways of getting a seminary education, possibly to see what happens down the road.

I was simply trying to show him that there were alternatives to the traditional brand of seminary, which is not for everyone, not everyone is called to be a pastor but that does not exclude them from learning or doing something more than just attending church.

Dabbling! I have talked with many pastors who have jumped through all the right hoops and it seems like all they did was dabble in theology at seminary.

I won't speak anymore for him or presume to know what he meant...

basically my question was how do i get into seminary with out a currently holding a Bachelors degree. with the Idea also that currently I have no desire to preach but only to learn how to study better, read the original tounges, and understand various aspects of church history, apologetics and such.

There's plenty of resources that you can tap into without having to spend the money to go to seminary. Also, the B.Div programs are specifically designated for men who desire gospel ministry but do not currently have a B.A., B.S.,etc.

If your just wanting to enrich your understanding of the Christian Faith try these links.

Covenant Worldwide

RTS

Greek Learning

Apologetics

__________________
John J.
Member Christ Prebyterian Church (OPC) Preparing For Eldership
Salt Lake City, Utah
www.christpres.net
And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us...
Currently reading Patristic Roots of Reformed Worship

This was the point I was trying to make. Too many people view seminary as a sort of "advanced Bible institute." There is nothing wrong with wanting to study the Bible, and nothing wrong with wanting to be grounded more in the faith. Nothing wrong with wanting to even take classes from a seminary in something like Hebrew or Greek.

But I don't understand why someone would want to get a B.Div (which is a ministerial degree) if they did not intend to be a minister. Would someone say: "I'd like to know more about the body, and learn more for nutrition, so I've decided to attend Med School and get an M.D., but I don't want to be a doctor, and those closest to me who know about medicine don't think I should be a doctor." Same thing for a J.D. or an Accounting degree.

The right approach is to find resources like mentioned above and to study.

Thanks Pastor Fred, your point about dabbling makes more since now

You can study much online as well.
At The North American Reformed Seminary we have all of our courses online and accessible...even if you are not enrolled in a program. And, you wouldn't be able to enroll without your local church recommending you. Therefore, you could just go through the classes and learn without being officially enrolled.

__________________
Larry Bray
Training for Elder - Reformed Presbyterian Church of Boothwyn, PCA
Boothwyn, PA
http://www.rpcb.org/

Free Online Reformed Seminary - http://www.tnars.net
-----------------------------------------------------
"The best Christian is still a poor Christian" - R.B. Kuiper

fredtgreco,
Is one supposed to have permission from their session prior to applying to and attending seminary? I have heard that at some point while attending seminary the candidate is supposed to put themselves under the local presbytery so that they can mentor him and keep track of his progress. I guess my question is what is the path one is to take if they want to attend seminary? What are all the steps to go through, in the Presbyterian Church?

(Or anyone who might want to answer)

Pastor Fred, you mentioned that seminary is a place to train ministers of the Gospel. Would this exclude Christian journalists and apologists like Philip Yancey or Ravi Zacharias from attending seminary? Also, would a Christian journalist need to be ordained before he wrote on Christian topics? All opinions greatly appreciated.

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Andrew Clerebout
Joy Baptist Church, IFB (Westland, MI)

"Let us never forget that truth, distorted and exaggerated, can become the mother of the most dangerous heresies." - J.C. Ryle, Holiness

Anyone who has ever applied to be accepted in a seminary program knows that the seminary looks for (among others) a sessional recommendation. This is very standard procedure.

DTK

__________________
Sola Scriptura est norma normans non normata
David T. King, pastor
Christ Presbyterian Church (OPC)
Elkton, Maryland
Augustine (354-430): Therefore what He [i.e., Christ] has deigned to speak to us, we ought to believe that He meant us to understand. But if we do not understand He, being asked, gives understanding, who gave His Word unasked. NPNF1: Vol. VII, Tractates on John, Tractate XXII, §1.

I am confused. If you want to learn more of the Scriptures and/or religion in general, why don't you enroll in a BA in Religion or Theology program. At least at PRTS a brother would find it very difficult to succeed academically without that undergraduate foundation. This is my worth.

Southern Baptist seminaries expect recommendations from the applicant's home church with at least three other recommendations. Generally those come from the local Executive Director and a couple of other experienced pastors.

__________________
Ivan Schoen, Pastor
Maranatha Baptist Church
Poplar Grove, Illinois USA
http://maranatha-sbc.org/
Husband to Nancy
Father to Sherril, Sarah, Kathryn
Grandfather to Phillip
Faith is the refusal to panic. Martyn Lloyd-Jones