Grieving for my own sins, and grieving for the lost who don't know Christ always happens when I start walking in the presence of God... It's disturbing. It's like, I don't know how I can even work like this. How can we even work or be productive when we are so grieved and feel led by the Spirit to pray for the lost and the expansion of the kingdom?

It's disturbing, because it seems like if I walk close with God, i'll always be in deep, deep sorrow. Because I see so much sin and people away from God. I really think of all of my school mates, and how terribly I failed them as a witness. I'm out of High school now, and for the past year I haven't really ministered much, but even when I was ministering I would go through huge periods of real deep sadness that never lifted. But I don't see how I can be sad like this without having some real problem developing in my life. I mean, this is really paralyzing.

How can I grieve like this and live a life? I mean, I don't feel like I can interact socially or do good work because of this... but I also know that this happens every time I start praying and trying to walk close with God. It just seems like I can't do anything if I'm in this state.

(I would like if this thread was in a members only forum but I'm not sure which forum is best for this)

Summary : For mental sanities sake, how can this be solved? Is it right to live our lives in a state of perpetual grief over the wickedness of the world + the blaspheme done to God's name + the lost state of our loved ones(everyone should be in this category)? Will this lead to long term psychological problems as well as violate the commandments to 'Rejoice in the Lord always", 'Sing to the Lord', etc?

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Andrew Clerebout
Joy Baptist Church, IFB (Westland, MI)

www.animalfarmblog.com
^Nick Altman's blog

Andrew, while I think it is right to be concerned about the lost, the great thing is, God has chosen His people and not one of them will be lost!!! That is our greatest comfort! In spite of our failures, God will reach every one of the elect! So rejoice in His goodness and the fact that you cannot thwart His plans in any way! Seek to glorify him by spreading the good news when you have the opportunity. I think a joyful life that acknowledges God's grace and sovereignty is much more appealing to the lost than someone tied up with grief, don't you?

As far as your own sin goes, grieve over it and ask for forgiveness. Believe that Christ's blood was sufficient to atone for your sins and let it go. By staying in a continual guilt mode, you are buying into the lie of the devil. He is the one who wants you to be paralyzed by guilt.

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Janis
Christ Church ARP, NC
"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places, even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love he predestined us for adoption as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will, to the praise of his glorious grace, with which he has blessed us in the Beloved." Eph. 1:3-6 ESV

Janis is right, Andrew. No christian has ever truly been an adequate witness. We all fail in many ways. The sovereignty of God in saving His people is a wonderful comfort in that. Though we fail, He never does.
If the grief you are experiencing is not leading you to repentance and a salvation that brings you peace, it is not godly grief, brother. Your sins are paid for, every last one. Trusting in that is the gospel. Your Redeemer has delivered you from this body of death. There is now no condemnation for you. So we must follow Paul's example in doing this:
Trusting Him for all things, including the use of your imperfect witness to bring about the salvation of those we love that are elect, the comforting of our hearts when we lose those who look to us like they weren't elect, the wiping out of marks against us, and the promise to progressively conform us to the image of His Son, is where we find that peace.

Trust in Him, brother. Paralysis is not the state that will be productive in either your own walk, your witness, or you providing for your own. Knowing that makes it evident that the way of thinking that brings that on is not a gospel mindset. Forget what is behind. Press on in trust.

I'll be praying with you in this. Our Father will cause you to stand.

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Brad
PCA Member
Virginia

Pro 16:33 The lot is cast into the lap; but the whole disposing thereof is of the LORD.

Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

We are clothed in the righteousness of Christ. It is our comfort and joy in spite of our sin.

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J Baldwin
Keowee Presbyterian Church, PCA
Pickens, SC
“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind, and your neighbor as yourself.” Luke 10:27

Check Out My Blog: http://reflectjoy.blogspot.com/

Sister Janis, you are right, election is a good, comforting doctrine. I realize I haven't been thinking of it lately. I think that may be the reason for my attitude toward the lost. I totally agree with what you said, the Gospel is effective and Christ will save His elect! I think because I haven't been thinking on election I may have been becoming sentimental, and it may not actually be the best type of burden for the lost? I don't know, is that possible? But yeah, thank you sister Janis, I need to remember the truth of election in all of this, it may stop me from becoming a basketcase.

Brother Brad, thanks also for the encouragement! I really needed those verses and to hear that. You are right, if my sorrow doesn't lead to repentance, it's probably just self-indulgence and pity. And I am comforted that my witness doesn't have to be perfect. Thanks for those verses.

And amen JBaldwin too!

Thanks for the great responses. My fear is that I take the doctrine of election and use it to stifle my desire to see the lost saved and my desire to pray for them + minister to them. This isn't normal, that's why I posted this. I mean, I normally don't consider the lost, but because of the example of my godly brother lately, I have been really thinking on them more. It's been bad since it makes me sad, but it's good because I know that God hears my prayers and will use them.

I also don't want to be exploitative in using the notion that my witness isn't what will bring people to Christ. It matters. Speaking truth in love, being characterized by warmth and humility, those things really do make a difference. People are drawn to that, and unbelievers respect that. It validates the Gospel, IMO. It was Pergy who posted one of those case studies, that stated that 2/3 of Muslims in SE Asia said that they came to Christ because they met loving Christians.

Brad, thanks for your prayers. Me and my mom have been praying for you ever since I read what you said about the medicail insurance. I enjoy reading your posts on here, and thanks for the great advice always brother.

...that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 1 Thess. 4.13

Have hope, brother. All of creation groans under the burden of sin, rivers of water flow from the eyes of the saints when they see how God's law is despised, and daily we must die unto ourselves knowing more and more how evil and corrupt we are, even seeing this more and more clearly the closer we draw near to our Holy God. But Psalms which express the grief of God's people over sin in themselves and others, and indeed the unfathomable anguish of soul of Christ Himself on the cross as he paid that ultimate penalty for said sins, also teach us to hope in God for the reality is that our God reigns, though we see his law despised or trampled upon, and though we war against our own flesh, yet we will praise Him for He is the light of our salvation and we will not be ashamed in the latter day. With man, in our own strength, this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.

Why art thou cast down, O my soul? and why art thou disquieted within me? hope in God: for I shall yet praise him, who is the health of my countenance, and my God. Ps. 43.5

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Andrew Myers
Husband of Jessica, Father of Jackson, Katie and Samuel
Member, Presbyterian Reformed Church of Northern Virginia
Warrenton, VA USA
Editor, The Matthew Poole Project

"Let your Morning Thoughts, and your last Evening Thoughts, be what shall become of you to all Eternity." -- Matthew Poole

Hello Andrew C.,

It seems to me the time and place for grieving is primarily in prayer, bringing the burden of care for the lost to our God, the Father whose eyes are upon the righteous, whose ears are open to and who delights in their prayer (Ps 34:15; Prov 15:8).

Having brought to Him the souls who are on your heart — even those in the unnamed multitude — and pleaded for them, it can be a joy to have the care of them in His hands. We may then ask Him for occasion to bear witness to them of His Son and the glorious gospel.

Those in the posts above said well to bring up the truth of election. We do what we can and will, but the decree of election is from Him. We do work (co-operate) with Him in His elective purposes (Col 1:29) when we pray and labor for the lost — and work thus we must, for love's sake — but the number of the elect is written in the Lamb's book of life from eternity (Eph 1:4). When we are burdened to pray for someone it is a sign that we may (no promises) be directly working according to God's purposes.

There is a joy that comes with fellowship with Jesus Christ, and with being secure in His keeping and love, and there is a vitality that comes with the perfect rest of this security: this joy and vitality translate into resurrection power, which need not be flamboyant, but is generally calm and kind, effective by His Spirit in the winning of souls to Him.

Yes, Jesus was a Man of sorrows; but He was also full of the Father's joy and love. These two go together in a man or woman of God. May the light of His Spirit in you touch many (Ps 119:130).

Steve

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Steve Rafalsky
Elder, International Evangelical Church (Reformed)
Limassol, Cyprus

"I am set for the defense of the gospel" (Philippians 1:17)

"Strengthened with all might, according to His glorious
power, unto all patience and longsuffering with joyfulness..." (Colossians 1:11)

Brother Andrew and brother Steve, you both made really great points! I appreciate the encouragement and reminders so much.

One additional thought concerning 'hope': 1 Thessalonians 5.8 calls us to put "on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation." The connection to Ephesians 6.17 is clear. Part of the armory of God is that helmet of hope that Christians are to wear. William Gouge's exposition of that passage in The Whole Armor of God contains a valuable chapter on the helmet of hope. With men, including ourselves, we will be disappointed. Therefore, we ought to avoid, as it were, sideways glances while we are praying, and keep our eyes fixed upon Jesus, who alone is the Author and Finisher of our faith, and who alone can, and indeed has, overcome this wretched world of sin and death. Therefore, put on that helmet of hope, the helmet of salvation, and be encouraged daily in that blessed hope.

Wow, amen Brother Andrew. I love the language of 'put on the helmet of hope'! It implies that it's a deliberate act. So I need to deliberately trust in Christ and remind myself of the promises.

Thanks!