The thief comes...

panta dokimazete · #1 (**permalink**) 02-26-2008, 10:10 PM

Quote:

John 10:10
"The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy; I came that they may have life, and have it abundantly.

Questions for consideration:

Who is "the thief"?

Who is "they"?

What can "the thief" steal, kill and destroy from among "them"?

What does this passage say about the purpose "the thief" has in God's plan?

ServantofGod · #2 (**permalink**) 02-26-2008, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Who is "the thief"?

False doctrine?

victorbravo · #3 (**permalink**) 02-26-2008, 10:55 PM

In the context of the chapter, I think the thief or thieves are false teachers: the Pharisees in particular (from Chapter 9), but false teachers in general. They are illegitimate usurpers:

Joh 10:1 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.

We also see the perserverance of the saints and effectual call:

Joh 10:4 And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
Joh 10:5 And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers.

And the famous shift in metaphor: Christ is the door. He is the one who keeps the theives out. He is the only one through which we can pass safely.

I don't see the passage as describing the purpose of the thief in God's plan so much as presenting a matter-of-fact truth: usurpers are destroyers; there is only one good shepherd.

Presbyterian Deacon · #4 (**permalink**) 02-26-2008, 11:00 PM

Yeah. What he said...

Presbyterian Deacon · #5 (**permalink**) 02-26-2008, 11:05 PM

Quote:

I don't see the passage as describing the purpose of the thief in God's plan so much as presenting a matter-of-fact truth: usurpers are destroyers; there is only one good shepherd.

Does John's reference to trying the spirits to see if they are of God in 1 John 4:1-4 have any bearing on this?

And is this what Peter has in mind when he writes about the false prophets and teachers in 2 Peter 2?

Some food for thought...maybe?

panta dokimazete · #6 (**permalink**) 02-26-2008, 11:11 PM

Any thoughts that "the thief" is "the Serpent"?

Any analogy possible to Job?

Presbyterian Deacon · #7 (**permalink**) 02-27-2008, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by panta dokimazete

Any thoughts that "the thief" is "the Serpent"?

Certainly the spirit behind these false teachers is the same as the spirit embodied in Genesis 3 as the Serpent, but I think the text is more generally refering to the human false teachers..."all that came before me..." (Jesus says) are theives and robbers. These are the the bad shepherds...the hirelings who flee when they see the wolf coming. (Jn 10:12)---By the Way, it is the wolf that I would identify as the devil.

Quote:

Any analogy possible to Job?

Now, that is interesting:

The wolf comes (John 10:12) to snatch and scatter the flock.
The roaring lion (I Peter 5:8) prowls around seeking someone to devour.
Satan (Job 1:7) goes to and fro upon the earth.

In each of these passages the Devil is seen as the predator of God's people.

panta dokimazete · #8 (**permalink**) 02-27-2008, 04:58 PM

Couple of thoughts - if one can buy that "the thief" (and those of his flock being thieves) is Satan, then it seems to me that his purpose in God's plan is to demonstrate the ultimate futility of trying to take glory from God by killing His children, stealing their joy or destroying their hope.

Just a thought I have been developing...

Presbyterian Deacon · #9 (**permalink**) 02-27-2008, 05:11 PM

I see what your saying. I can "buy" it to the extent I indicated earlier.

Satan is certainly the spirit behind the theif. But in the context the language with regard to "thieves and robbers" is plural.

Certainly, Satan's plans are frustrated by God.
Satan, through his minions is not able to ultimately steal, kill, or destroy--because "no one is able to snatch us from the Father's hand." (John 10:29)

VirginiaHuguenot · #10 (**permalink**) 02-27-2008, 09:17 PM

George Hutcheson on John 10.10:

Quote:

Christ proceeds to declare that as he is the door so he is the true shepherd; and that, first (in this verse), in opposition to those whom he called thieves and robbers -- that is, they who give out themselves to be the Messiah, or who run unsent and bring corrupt doctrine. These he declares to be enemies, and not shepherds, as coming only to do the flock prejudice; but his errand is to give them life, and that in great abundance. Whence learn --

1. False teachers and seducers will have so many fair pretences and plausible shows and appearances that the evil of their way will not be soon seen; therefore must it be so much inculcated what it is the thief comes about.

2. Let seducers pretend never so fair, and people be never so much taken with them, yet they do really come for the hurt of the flock, and it will prove so, and be seen in the end; for "the thief cometh not, but for to steal," &c. -- that is the whole scope of their work. And this meets with the blind charity of any in the flock, who fear not so much hurt by their errors as they expect good by their fair shows of piety and parts.

3. Seducers are but thieves, in regard they do but make a prey of men, taking them away from Christ, stealing away their food that they may give them poison, and bereaving Christ of his glory and them of their happiness; and in regard they do all this in a clandestine and indirect way, therefore it is said, "The thief cometh not, but for to steal."

4. How happy soever blinded souls may think themselves in being made a prey to seducers, and in being deluded with their indirect insinuations, yet all this tends but to their destruction, and to their eternal ruin, if mercy prevent it not; for as the thief cometh to steal, so also "to kill, and to destroy," and so they are robbers or murdering thieves, as ver. 8.

5. Christ is a shepherd who will be so far from destroying his flock that he will give life even to those of them who are dead; for "I am come that they might have life."

6. Christ's great scope in coming to the world is to purchase and confer life upon his own elect; and whatever his dealing towards them be, yet it all tends to this, and when they find it otherwise it is their own mistake; for saith he, "I am come that they might have life."

7. Christ by his coming not only intends life, but more abundant life to his flock -- that is, 1. Albeit he gave life to his people before his coming, yet he hath let it out more abundantly since, to shew the difference betwixt the Sun of Righteousness now arisen, and the light that his people had (though from him) before. 2. He will not only give that life that may simply supply the necessity of his people, but such a superabounding measure as may testify his fulness, and may completely refresh them. 3. Having conferred this abundant life in conversion, he will make it grow more and more while they are within time, 1 Thess. iv.1. 4. All this is but a drop in comparison of that abundance of life that is reserved for his people in glory. In these respects it is said, "I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly."

Matthew Henry on John 10.1:

Quote:

thieves and robbers (though they pretended to be shepherds); but the sheep did not hear them. This refers to all those that had the character of shepherds in Israel, whether magistrates or ministers, that exercised their office without any regard to the Messiah, or any other expectations of him than what were suggested by their own carnal interest. Observe, First, The character given of them: they are thieves and robbers (v. 8); all that went before him, not in time, many of them were faithful shepherds, but all that anticipated his commission, and went before he sent them (Jer. xxiii. 21), that assumed a precedency and superiority above him, as the antichrist is said to exalt himself, 2 Thess. ii. 4. "The scribes, and Pharisees, and chief priests, all, even as many as have come before me, that have endeavoured to forestal my interest, and to prevent my gaining any room in the minds of people, by prepossessing them with prejudices against me, they are thieves and robbers, and steal those hearts which they have no title to, defrauding the right owner of his property." They condemned our Saviour as a thief and a robber, because he did not come in by them as the door, nor take out a license from them; but he shows that they ought to have received their commission from him, to have been admitted by him, and to have come after him, and because they did not, but stepped before him, they were thieves and robbers. They would not come in as his disciples, and therefore were condemned as usurpers, and their pretended commissions vacated and superseded. Note, Rivals with Christ are robbers of his church, however they pretend to be shepherds, nay, shepherds of shepherds.

armourbearer · #11 (**permalink**) 02-27-2008, 09:47 PM

Lives of the Scottish Covenanters, pp. 173-174.

Lives of the Scottish Covenanters ... - Google Book Search

Quote:

Alexander Henderson was born about the year 1583. Of his parents and the circumstances of his early life, no authentic information has been transmitted. Being intended for the Church, he was sent to the university of St. Andrew's to complete his studies, and after having finished the usual course, and passed his degrees with applause, he was some time previous to the year 1611, elected a professor in that ancient seminary. Being a young man, ambitious of preferment, he seems to have adopted the principles, and advocated the measures of the then dominant party in the Church, and shortly after, through the patronage of Archbishop Gladstanes, he was presented to the parish of Leuchars, in the shire of Fife. This was his first ministerial appointment, and must have taken place sometime previous to the year 1615. His settlement in the charge, thus merited and obtained, was unpopular to such a degree, that on the day of ordination, the church doors were shut and secured by the people, so that the ministers who attended, together with the presentee, were obliged to go in by the window. It was little wonder that this was the case, considering the known and acknowledged character of the person thus obtruded upon them. With all his prejudices in favour of prelacy, he was the avowed defender of those corruptions to which the people of Scotland have ever been averse, and what was still worse, discovered but little regard for their spiritual and eternal interests.

It was not long, however, till his sentiments and character underwent a complete change.

Having heard of a communion in the neighbourhood, at which the excellent Mr. Bruce was to be an assistant, he went thither secretly; and fearful of attracting notice, placed himself in a dark corner of the church, where he might not be readily seen or known. Mr. Bruce having come into the pulpit, paused for a little, as was his usual manner, a circumstance which excited Mr. Henderson's surprise, but it astonished him much more when he heard him read as his text, these very striking words, He that entereth not in by the door, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a THIEF and a ROBBER; — which words, by the blessing of God, and the effectual working of the Holy Spirit, took such hold on him at that very instant, and left such an impression on his heart afterwards, that they proved the very first means of his conversion unto Christ. Ever after he retained a great affection for Mr. Bruce, and used to make mention of him with marks of the highest respect.

VirginiaHuguenot · #12 (**permalink**) 02-27-2008, 10:31 PM

Pastor -- Thanks for reminding me of that remarkable story, which made a deep impression on me years ago, when I first heard it.