Here is something I have recently been thinking about. Not trying to step on anyone's toes here.

Shouldn't one be an elder if they are teaching in the church (Bible study, Sunday school, as well as preaching, of course)? If not, what is the importance of having the distinction that an elder "must be able to teach" (1 Timothy 3:2), if you don't actually need to be an elder in order to teach?

In my present Cape Town church, only one Bible study home group is led by an elder. The rest are taught by men who are not church officers.

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Tim Lindsay
member, Covenant Reformed Presbyterian Church, Halifax, NS, Canada
Living in Cape Town, South Africa
"under the Southern Cross, at the foot of Table Mountain, not far from the Cape of Good Hope"

The Bible states that elders must be able to teach because what good is an elder who can't teach? Not all who can teach, however, must become elders.

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Ben Castaneda
member of Faith Presbyterian Church (PCA)
San Antonio, TX
MDiv student at WSC
Escondido, CA

"Not all prison bars are made from metal, And not all prisoners walk about in chains." -Lysander from Weatherby, Earl of Gloucester

Just out of curiosity, how will one be determined to be "able to preach" in order to be qualified as an elder, if he does not demonstrate that ability before becoming an elder?

Further, although I think "rogue" Bible studies (that is, Bible Studies not under the oversight of the elders of a church) are a bad idea, I don't see any Scriptural warrant for only having elders lead Bible Studies.

Last point: you bring up that "elders are to be able to teach" to support the idea that only elders should be teaching Bible studies. But, describing the qualifications of an elder and prescribing who ought to be performing certain tasks within the church are two different things.

Just my

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Seth Stark
Member, Communion Presbyterian Church (ARP), Irvine, CA
Biola University, Graduate Student, M.A. - Science and Religion
Seth's Blog

How to test teachability: Prop your candidate up in front of your group, set him speaking, and see how long it takes for everyone to fall asleep.

HAHAHAHAHA! That's one way of doing it!

Thanks, guys, for your logical assessment of my question. I'm still not 100% convinced, but I understand that you are both saying:

An elder must be able to teach; a teacher must not necessarily be an elder.

Essentially, yes.

But how do we logically show this from scripture? Are there any examples that show a non-elder teaching? I am just trying to work from the principle that there are people who have the position of spiritual leadership (teaching) and those people are the elders. Help me out on this one.

Stephen comes to mind. He wasn't an elder.

Apollos is another example.

What about Titus 2? A woman cannot be an elder, but should teach younger women.
I believe this part:"Likewise, urge the younger men to be self-controlled. 7 Show yourself in all respects to be a model of good works, and in your teaching show integrity, dignity, 8 and sound speech that cannot be condemned, so that an opponent may be put to shame, having nothing evil to say about us." is speaking to men and women, since it follows "urge the younger men..."

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Shalom,
jessi
PCA
Steelers fan exiled to Virginia


“Whatever your heart clings to and confides in, that is really your God.”
Martin Luther

The OPC makes the distinction where preaching is concerned -- an elder may preach, someone else may exhort.

Older women are instructed to teach younger women to love their husbands -- there's teaching involved there. My husband, a deacon, regularly teaches adult Sunday school. I think it's important that any teaching function in the church be under the authority of the elders, though.

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JWithnell
Member Bethel OPC
Virginia
http://learningyesican.blogspot.com/

Perhaps the problem is you are presupposing that teaching is synonymous with leadership. As Jessi noted women are instructed to teach younger women that does not make them leaders of the church.

To answer your question, "no" one does not have to be an elder to teach a Bible study. I would say to encourage those who do teach however someone must know what they are teaching. It cannot be just any yahoo in the church. They must be a member and have met with the session. He would have to be a trusted man in the faith.

__________________
Frank
Under Care
P.C.A.
Maryland

I also personally think that a church's elders should be involved with teaching/preaching before other men are asked to teach, while, of course, setting aside Titus 2 women to teach as well.

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Anna
Wife of Tim/Marrow Man
Louisville, KY
Member of Midlane Park Presbyterian (Associate Reformed Presbyterian)

James 3:1 - "Not many of you should become teachers my brothers, for you know that we who teach will be judged with greater strictness" (Yes, I know, I used the ESV)

That is a passage that needs to be known about teaching. It is sooo true. There is no clear Bible passage about teachers. Just what was said above about Elders being able to teach, but teachers don't have to be elders. So many people want to be teachers for the publicity it brings them, but they don't heed that verse.

But, however, church's need to be careful of who teaches. I'm a Sunday School Teacher because a church took the time and trained me. Teaching classes, teaching seminars, and a very thorough examination. There were elders in my class, and what I taught was carefully gone over. I didn't put people to sleep, that's for sure!

People who teach need to be under the authority of a church. Alot of home Bible studies are worthless. Some of the people even in my church should not be teachers because of the theology they hold. And I don't care what 'lessons' they use, their theology comes through.

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Timothy Johnson
First United Presbyterian of Moline
PCUSA (Yea, I know)
Theology/Philosophy Sunday School Teacher
Davenport, IA

No. It is highly advisable that the elders KNOW who is teaching in the church and approve of all teachers.

__________________
Bill Brown
Elder
Reformed Baptist
Maryland

Click to get: Board Rules -- Signature Requirements -- Suggestions?
Visit my BLOG Theology for the Rest of Us

No.

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"A dog barks when his master is attacked. I would be a coward if I saw that God's truth is attacked and yet would remain silent." John Calvin

John from Scotland
Denomination: Attending Baptist church
Confessional Subscription:London Baptist Confession
Blog: [url]www.three-streams.co.uk[/url]

No Elders are posting in this thread....hmmm...

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Zack Flummerfelt
Evangel Presbyterian (PCA), layman
Wichita, KS


As of September 12, 2009 I am married to dear Jlynn!!

Women are commanded to teach (other women),

Women are not elders,

Ergo, not all teaching must be done by elders.

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Kevin Rogers
Sovereign Community Church, PCA
Moncton NB

I posted.

No "real" elders.

As these passages show, there are very specific qualifications for elders and deacons.

Elders need more qualification than being able to teach. (It's also clear here that elders and deacons are men, and are both part of the basic governance of Christ's church, but that is topic for another thread).

Elders and deacons need calling, gifting, and an exemplary life as qualification for these high church offices. Unordained men and women are called to assist them in corporate church life. Remember, "each man stands as his own priest before God," was one of the hallmark truths the Reformation restored so lots of spiritual activities will go on outside of church.

One may be gifted to teach, but not for hospitality for example. And one may be "apt to teach" without having the exemplary life testimony required (not a perfect life is required, but one substantially with the attributes listed).

I think Scripture is very specific about the ordinary means of grace in corporate worship, but much less so in other contexts. For example, men leading their families in family worship times do not administer the sacraments even though it is "worship." They are responsible to do so, whether or not they feel "gifted" to teach.

Similarly, a man discipling another man through Bible study does not need to be a church officer.

There all kinds of other authority structures based on "superiors" and "inferiors" as the Westminster Confession uses those terms which do not require church officers.

-----Added 3/18/2009 at 08:44:25 EST-----

One of many.

__________________
Scott
PCA
North Carolina


"Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised)"
Hebrews 10:23

I'm from the OPC and we don't require the teacher of Bible studies to be elders.

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sarah
WI
OPC
My Pastor's Sermons: Mark Jenkins...he's awesome!!!

Don't make me come and find you.

Not all elders are even qualified to be elders. I only say that because there is a real danger in assuming that an elder is qualified to teach merely because of his office - just as there is danger in assuming that one who is non-ordained isn't qualified.

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Rich Brown
Deacon/Webmaster
Aisquith PCA
Parkville, MD

Good point.

And in some denominations (like ours) ruling and teaching elders are differentiated. Though some public worship teaching aptitude is required, there is a recognized difference in gifting even among elders.

I'm gonna add my voice to the chorus of "no"s.

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Rae W. | Elder @ Grace Central Presbyterian Church | Columbus, OH
Online presence: blog | twitter | facebook

Tim, a slightly different question; would you feel better if the teachers were deacons?

I have often refered to myself as a "teaching deacon". Since I am a deacon who has served as a lay preacher, a youth pastor, a SS teacher, stated supply, a church planter, etc.

A man (or a woman) that has the gift of teaching, should teach. The role of elders is to "fence the podium" to ensure that those that do teach are able, gifted, qualified, and interesting.

Are you a tenor or bass?

I'm betting bass!