Thread: Important Question

I want to ask advice.

I'm a deacon at my church and I'm getting married in December. We will be living in town, about 30-35 minutes away from the church we both currently attend.

There is a PCA church about 3 minutes from our townhouse and I have been considering going there for fuel reasons as well as others. However, I was just re-installed for a term on the diaconate until 2010. I filled in for the last year on an empty term, and now I am serving a full term of my own.

My question is, how is this to be handled?

I asked my brother in law who was in the same situation and he viewed it that he had made an oath to fulfill the office so he waited out his term and then moved to the same PCA church that I am considering.

This seems sound to me, however, it doesn't comport with reality to me. We're I to be moving to another city (and we pretty much are) or another state, would I drive 2 hours to come back and serve as a deacon? Would I forego moving until my term as a deacon had run out? I wouldn't, but is this right?

Thus I put it to all of you.

It would seem that if God in His Providence is leading you to another assembly, (or to relocate for whatever reason, ie- new wife, new job, new home, etc...) that your are not bound by your office in your current church, but are at liberty to resign.

This would be done by meeting with your Pastor and Session and resigning your office. Explain your reasons for leaving to them. As you are not just "church hopping" but have good and valid reasons for leaving your current church, and plan to join another local church closer to where you will be living, I see no reason that your pastor/session should object--or that you should bind your conscience by staying.

By the way, we just had a member of our diaconate leave our church for similar reasons. He was travelling about 45 minutes one way to come to church. A new church has been planted just around the corner from his house. He leaves our diaconate and church with the approval of our session.

Originally Posted by Presbyterian Deacon

It would seem that if God in His Providence is leading you to another assembly, (or to relocate for whatever reason, ie- new wife, new job, new home, etc...) that your are not bound by your office in your current church, but are at liberty to resign.

I totally disagree with this reasoning. People will drive all over town for restaurants, entertainment, work, grocers, Costco, etc. but they do not want to drive 30 minutes to worship?

If you have made vows as an office bearer, you made those vows UNTO THE LORD- he is not calling you elsewhere, he is calling you to fulfill your vows unto him. (The Scriptures say that we are to keep our vows EVEN to our own hurt!)

Besides vows as an office bearer, you have made vows to a congregation, a body of doctrine, and to the ARP. How does saving 20 minutes of drive time free you from those vows?

Brother, fulfill your vows unto the LORD- don't break them to save $3 a week.

I would also advise to fulfill your vows as Deacon in your current church. God's providence has lead you to make a promise to that church and that shouldn't be broken for the sake of money or convenience.
As Christians our word ought to be binding, even to our own hurt.

Let what you say be simply 'Yes' or 'No'; anything more than this comes from evil. (Mat 5:37)

It seems to me that before anyone can say that Andrew would be breaking an oath we would have to know in what forms of words he took the oath, and what the animus imponentis of the church body is.

Not that I would be qualified to advise you, but I have some questions for you to think about. For example, if you wanted to invite some of the couples you see socially or for Bible study in your apartment complex to church, is it more realistic that they would attend the one three miles away or the one in another town? In addition, are you really as active in your current church 35 minutes away as you would be to a church 5-10 minutes away? Would you be able to attend church on Sunday morning, Sunday evening, and perhaps during the week for a prayer meeting, Bible study, or meeting equally at both places, or would your attendance be reduced at the church further away? And last, are their other deacons in the current church who could cover the responsibilities until new deacons are elected?

I'm just trying to help you think about things beyond the gas, etc. If your participation and ministry would be more fruitful in your own community, then I, personally, think it would be reasonable to consider.

I not familiar with your oath or the exact policy of the ARP. My understanding (and that of the PCA) is that the office of Deacon is perpetual.

The easy answer is do what is most convenient and practical for you and that you are not sinning in any way or breaking trust in any way by simply informing the ARP church you are leaving due to marriage and convenience considerations.

However, I think the "high road" is to suffer a little here, an example you are challenged to model as an officer of Christ's Church. Complete your term where you are, honorably, trusting the Lord for provision for the inconvenience. Remember, there is great reward for those who handle the office of Deacon well (cf I Timothy 3:13).

This may be slightly off topic, but does the church have the ability to release someone from a vow?

Was the vow actually made to the church, or to God?

Originally Posted by Zenas

I want to ask advice.

I'm a deacon at my church and I'm getting married in December. We will be living in town, about 30-35 minutes away from the church we both currently attend.

There is a PCA church about 3 minutes from our townhouse and I have been considering going there for fuel reasons as well as others. However, I was just re-installed for a term on the diaconate until 2010. I filled in for the last year on an empty term, and now I am serving a full term of my own.

My question is, how is this to be handled?

I asked my brother in law who was in the same situation and he viewed it that he had made an oath to fulfill the office so he waited out his term and then moved to the same PCA church that I am considering.

This seems sound to me, however, it doesn't comport with reality to me. We're I to be moving to another city (and we pretty much are) or another state, would I drive 2 hours to come back and serve as a deacon? Would I forego moving until my term as a deacon had run out? I wouldn't, but is this right?

Thus I put it to all of you.

I noticed you said, "re-installed." I don't see where you took an oath. Does re-installing involve an oath? It seems to me that this should be taken to the leadership and let them tell you how they see it. I'm convinced that the elders of our church would allow me to bow out if it would benefit me and if it would not involve any hurt to the church. I'm all for keeping oaths. But if I were involved in your church I couldn't be legalistic and hold you to something that is going to be a hardship on your new marriage.

Originally Posted by nleshelman

Originally Posted by Presbyterian Deacon

It would seem that if God in His Providence is leading you to another assembly, (or to relocate for whatever reason, ie- new wife, new job, new home, etc...) that your are not bound by your office in your current church, but are at liberty to resign.

I totally disagree with this reasoning. People will drive all over town for restaurants, entertainment, work, grocers, Costco, etc. but they do not want to drive 30 minutes to worship?

If you have made vows as an office bearer, you made those vows UNTO THE LORD- he is not calling you elsewhere, he is calling you to fulfill your vows unto him. (The Scriptures say that we are to keep our vows EVEN to our own hurt!)

Besides vows as an office bearer, you have made vows to a congregation, a body of doctrine, and to the ARP. How does saving 20 minutes of drive time free you from those vows?

Brother, fulfill your vows unto the LORD- don't break them to save $3 a week.

It's actually around $40-$50 a month we'll be spending in driving out there. It'll be about 35-40 miles to drive in order to get out to church. That's a ton of money for us.

I would seek the counsel of the Session and bow to their wisdom.

Originally Posted by Grace Alone

Not that I would be qualified to advise you, but I have some questions for you to think about. For example, if you wanted to invite some of the couples you see socially or for Bible study in your apartment complex to church, is it more realistic that they would attend the one three miles away or the one in another town? In addition, are you really as active in your current church 35 minutes away as you would be to a church 5-10 minutes away? Would you be able to attend church on Sunday morning, Sunday evening, and perhaps during the week for a prayer meeting, Bible study, or meeting equally at both places, or would your attendance be reduced at the church further away? And last, are their other deacons in the current church who could cover the responsibilities until new deacons are elected?

I'm just trying to help you think about things beyond the gas, etc. If your participation and ministry would be more fruitful in your own community, then I, personally, think it would be reasonable to consider.

We would be going on Sundays only, usually. To go on Wednesday nights, I think, would be too big of a burden on us. We would probably go to bible studies in town. The College RUF minister lives across from out backdoor, so I hope to do things to support the RUF ministry on campus.

Moreover, I will probably be active, particupating in some sort of sport in the church in town. My church doesn't have anything like that and I've been wanting to play something for some time now.

While me and my fiancee' are very involved with our church now, we won't be able to be so once we move into town. I don't see it being possible to drive out there 2-3 times a week. The Lord may provide the means though.

There are other deacons, but they are either busy, or fairly immature or complacent. Myself and another are the only deacons that seem to take the office seriously, which is one reason why I hesitate. However, Niether myself nor him have the rime to take over the office of chairman, which is regrettably needed.

Originally Posted by kalawine

Originally Posted by Zenas

I want to ask advice.

I'm a deacon at my church and I'm getting married in December. We will be living in town, about 30-35 minutes away from the church we both currently attend.

There is a PCA church about 3 minutes from our townhouse and I have been considering going there for fuel reasons as well as others. However, I was just re-installed for a term on the diaconate until 2010. I filled in for the last year on an empty term, and now I am serving a full term of my own.

My question is, how is this to be handled?

I asked my brother in law who was in the same situation and he viewed it that he had made an oath to fulfill the office so he waited out his term and then moved to the same PCA church that I am considering.

This seems sound to me, however, it doesn't comport with reality to me. We're I to be moving to another city (and we pretty much are) or another state, would I drive 2 hours to come back and serve as a deacon? Would I forego moving until my term as a deacon had run out? I wouldn't, but is this right?

Thus I put it to all of you.

I noticed you said, "re-installed." I don't see where you took an oath. Does re-installing involve an oath? It seems to me that this should be taken to the leadership and let them tell you how they see it. I'm convinced that the elders of our church would allow me to bow out if it would benefit me and if it would not involve any hurt to the church. I'm all for keeping oaths. But if I were involved in your church I couldn't be legalistic and hold you to something that is going to be a hardship on your new marriage.

Yes I was re-installed. I had already served a third of a 3 year term, and have served another year on this term.

Thanks for the good advice all.

Were you aware of the logistical issues before you agreed to be re-installed?

No actually, we were expecting to live out there oddly enough.

Originally Posted by Zenas

It's actually around $40-$50 a month we'll be spending in driving out there. It'll be about 35-40 miles to drive in order to get out to church. That's a ton of money for us


No actually, we were expecting to live out there oddly enough.

I would speak with the elders about your concerns and desires. I don't see that you would be bound to remain when it would be a financial hinderance.

Andrew,

I would generally agree that your Session would have to release you.

It is true that you have taken vows to the church (or so it would seem); however, you've also taken vows to your wife. Make sure you're nurturing your new family; for if you do not do that, it has happened in the past that Godly men become disqualified for church office because they neglect the duties of teaching and nurturing their family. I'm not saying that you'd do that; but I know I've been guilty of neglecting my family for diaconal duties. My thoughts are that your family comes before extra duties to the church, and marriage vows would come first to those of the church.

Are these vows open-ended or for a limited time (i.e. I vow or I vow for the coming term of 3 years...)

Brother, talk to your pastor, based on his guidance, perhaps take it to the elders.

Diaconal duties are stewardship - you have vowed to set aside your resources (time, energy, etc...) to serve that local body.

Ultimately, it comes down to the needs of the church, if they cannot release you, then you are bound to serve by oath. If they can, you may leave with good conscience.

I commend you on your willingness to share your struggle.

that you receive good counsel and make a wise decision.