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09-16-2009, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Skyler Quick comment: Note that those who are disagreeing that a college education is necessary still, if I understand them correctly, feel that a pastor should be educated and have a thorough understanding of God's Word. They're not playing down that fact. | That's the position I take. I believe that discernment toward the will of God should trump any man made institutional requirements.
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David
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09-16-2009, 07:12 PM
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Reliable men will raise up reliable men in the local congregation or the formal educational institution. When you get talking heads that never experienced grace that proper training can be built upon, then all the problems start.
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Rich Koster
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09-16-2009, 07:59 PM
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What I am surprised about is that people don't bring up those that start theological schools in countries without any. I know the OPC works to have churches that are self-sustaining and growing in other countries ... churches that are capable of reaching out themselves to other areas. And part of that work is to help establish seminary training in those areas, and help with training for those that do not have seminaries.
While there is no explicit Biblical mandate for "seminary" the admonition Quote: |
Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, knowing that as such we will incur a stricter judgment.
| It would be negligent for a missionary work to not provide for the training of those whom God is calling to ministry, and not just a "bare minimum" considering all the error that abounds in the church even with learning.
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09-17-2009, 10:15 AM
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Ames says that, although the church chooses those men who sill be in authority, seminaries do not confer that authority upon a minister. That is the work of God. Quote:
But this is to be understood in the sense that the authority for administering divine things is directly communicated from God to all lawful ministers, though the appointing of persons upon whom the authority is to be bestowed is done by the church.
But the church cannot confer the necessary gifts for this ministry, and cannot prescribe for God those upon whom he should confer them. Therefore, the church can only chose those who appear to it in advance to be suitable. For ordinary ministers, unlike extraordinary ministers, are not made fit by their very calling when they were unfit before. Marrow of Theology, 35:6,7
| However, Ames also says a minister is unfit if he has not 'set his heart to study the law of the Lord and to do it'. Quote: |
Since first an earnest zeal for the church's edification is required, a man cannot be a fit preacher unless he has Set his heart to study the law of the Lord and to do it, and to teach his statutes and ordinances in Israel, Ezra 7:10. For one who teahes another ought before and while he teaches to teach himself, Rom 2:21. Otherwise he is not prepared to edify the church. Marrow, 35:15
| I would take this to mean that ministers desire education. Not just in their early twenties, but their entire life. And not simply as vocational training, but primarily out of a desire to live that theology.
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09-17-2009, 10:48 AM
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God does not call the qualified..... He qualifies the called
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09-17-2009, 11:24 AM
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If we look at Scripture's qualifications for elder at 1 Tim 3:1 "The saying is trustworthy: If anyone aspires to the office of overseer, he desires a noble task. 2 Therefore an overseer must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, sober-minded, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, 3 not a drunkard, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money. 4 He must manage his own household well, with all dignity keeping his children submissive, 5 for if someone does not know how to manage his own household, how will he care for God's church? 6 He must not be a recent convert, or he may become puffed up with conceit and fall into the condemnation of the devil. 7 Moreover, he must be well thought of by outsiders, so that he may not fall into disgrace, into a snare of the devil." and
Titus 1:9-11 "9 He must hold firm to the trustworthy word as taught, so that he may be able to give instruction in sound doctrine and also to rebuke those who contradict it.
10 For there are many who are insubordinate, empty talkers and deceivers, especially those of the circumcision party. 11 They must be silenced, since they are upsetting whole families by teaching for shameful gain what they ought not to teach."
These passages clearly don't mandate a requirement of seminary education, but as Tim noted above, these days too many men and women  enter the "teaching elder" role without the necessary wisdom or knowledge. A corollary to that is that the governance of many churches is radically unbiblical. I'm sure some here have been involved in thise types of churches in the past.
Granted, a proper seminary education won't guarantee that heresies will never occur, but it would seem to reduce the chance of them occurring.
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Michael Masztal
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09-17-2009, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by DD2009 Others didn't know who Christ was at the time, he appeared lowly. Christ chose men not formally educated in the theology of their day to be his apostles.
God doesn't need a man with a degree to speak his word.
It is nice if a man has a degree, I believe that it should by no means be required. God works things on his time, A man may want to go to seminary but God may have him serve instead, remember Paul wanted to go to Spain, we see how that turned out. | It matters not that they knew His training; He was God incarnate. Those men, though not formally educated, were still TRAINED; I assure you. They were trained by their time with Christ, Himself. What was the amount time they spent with Christ, and then Paul spent in the wilderness with Christ? 3 years. Now, I am not equating seminary education to education by Christ, Himself. What is the average seminary? 3 years...training in some form is what is called for. I didn't say a brick and mortar institution, but training. By his elders or by a seminary, but training, nonetheless.
Paul had been trained, and then his plans were thwarted. It wasn't that Paul hadn't been trained, in the wilderness, by Christ, and wanted to go without being trained. He was taught, and then where he wanted to go was thwarted and re-routed. Again, brick and mortar may not be necessary, but training is.
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Last edited by nicnap; 09-17-2009 at 12:19 PM.
Reason: spelling error
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09-17-2009, 12:11 PM
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You guys! Obviously the only way to fix this is to ordain Sarah to the ministry
__________________ ~ Charles Stephen Barribeau ~ Christ Presbyterian Church , OPC (They sing alot of Psalms!) Original Westminster Standards (I need to study more...) The Puritans were best! Also... I NEED TO READ MORE!!! Philipians1:29(KJV) For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake; Janesville, Wisconsin (In the fellowship of Bob Vigneault and Matt+Megan Meisberger) | 
09-17-2009, 12:32 PM
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Yes. They must have a college education and it must be from Westminster Seminary California with all its accreditation!
Just joshin'!
__________________ Josh Hicks, Chloë's Dad Christ Covenant Reformed Presbyterian Church, RPCGA Facebook - The Calvinist Vent Board Rules - Signature Rules - Suggestion Box It is God that multiplies our sorrows.... God, as a righteous Judge, does it, which ought to silence us under all our sorrows; as many as they are, we have deserved them all, and more: nay, God, as a tender Father, does it for our necessary correction, that we may be humbled for sin, and weaned from the world by all our sorrows; and the good we get by them, with the comfort we have under them, will abundantly balance our sorrows, how greatly soever they are multiplied. - Matthew Henry | | The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Joshua For This Useful Post: | |  | | | Thread Tools | | | | Display Modes | Linear Mode |
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