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Old 03-24-2008, 10:16 PM
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Court Dismisses Claims Challenging All-Male Limits On Theology Faculty

ADF Alliance Alert » Court Dismisses Claims Challenging All-Male Limits On Theology Faculty
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Old 03-24-2008, 10:28 PM
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Nice!
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Old 03-24-2008, 10:32 PM
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Good. Glad to see Paige Paterson had the cajones to stand by his convictions.
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Old 03-24-2008, 10:32 PM
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Old 03-24-2008, 10:35 PM
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And furthermore, why is it the Court's/State's/Government's business to meddle with anyway? I'm glad for the ruling, I suppose, but I'm very disappointed that the courts, et al have any jurisdiction over at all.
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Old 03-24-2008, 10:39 PM
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And furthermore, why is it the Court's/State's/Government's business to meddle with anyway? I'm glad for the ruling, I suppose, but I'm very disappointed that the courts, et al have any jurisdiction over at all.
It revolved around an employment lawsuit. The court basically ruled that it did not have jurisdiction in a seminary/church employment matter.
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Old 03-24-2008, 10:47 PM
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I understand, but shouldn't seminaries, nay, all non-government entities have the right to fire and hire who they so desire? (nice rhyme, eh?)
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Old 03-24-2008, 10:52 PM
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Joshua,

Our law doesn't function that way. Fortunately, the law protects the Church, for now, from being forced to violate it's own religious views and adopt the secular, which is what would happen were this court to hold otherwise. They would force the Seminary to abandon religious conviction and adopt secular religious views regarding women in teaching positions.

It's comming folks. Most assuredly.
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Old 03-24-2008, 10:53 PM
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joshua View Post
And furthermore, why is it the Court's/State's/Government's business to meddle with anyway? I'm glad for the ruling, I suppose, but I'm very disappointed that the courts, et al have any jurisdiction over at all.
It revolved around an employment lawsuit. The court basically ruled that it did not have jurisdiction in a seminary/church employment matter.
Thanks. I actually have a similar case heading for summary judgment hearing in a couple of weeks. This decision applies the same argument I'm using. I'll bring it up in oral argument.
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Old 03-24-2008, 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Zenas View Post
Joshua,

Our law doesn't function that way. Fortunately, the law protects the Church, for now, from being forced to violate it's own religious views and adopt the secular, which is what would happen were this court to hold otherwise. They would force the Seminary to abandon religious conviction and adopt secular religious views regarding women in teaching positions.

It's comming folks. Most assuredly.
I think you may be missing my point. The Law should protect the Church, as it should also protect the citizen. What I'm saying is that a person who is fired by a non-government entity (i.e. sovereign), according to my naive opinion, should not have redress by taking it to the courts, since the courts ought not be bringing jurisdiction over a sovereign entity that has not broken any government laws. I dunno...I'm just an Arkansan.
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Old 03-24-2008, 11:01 PM
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No, I'm not missing the point. I know the law should protect the church, but the fact that it does now is only a fleeting remant of the true meaning behind the laws of our land. Just as every other piece of jurisprudence considered archaic by our liberalized judicial and legislative systems has been replaced with garbage that fits their agenda to enslave the public to governmental power, this too will be swept away to enslave the church to the will of the National government.
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Old 03-24-2008, 11:02 PM
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Umm...thanks, but I'm not sure where I implied otherwise.
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Old 03-24-2008, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
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Quote:
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And furthermore, why is it the Court's/State's/Government's business to meddle with anyway? I'm glad for the ruling, I suppose, but I'm very disappointed that the courts, et al have any jurisdiction over at all.
It revolved around an employment lawsuit. The court basically ruled that it did not have jurisdiction in a seminary/church employment matter.
Thanks. I actually have a similar case heading for summary judgment hearing in a couple of weeks. This decision applies the same argument I'm using. I'll bring it up in oral argument.
I wanna help.
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Old 03-24-2008, 11:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by victorbravo View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by fredtgreco View Post

It revolved around an employment lawsuit. The court basically ruled that it did not have jurisdiction in a seminary/church employment matter.
Thanks. I actually have a similar case heading for summary judgment hearing in a couple of weeks. This decision applies the same argument I'm using. I'll bring it up in oral argument.
I wanna help.
Yes, I hear you are a star at oral argument. It would be fun to have you. But it's already been briefed and I think it will be hard to get you admitted to the Washington bar by Friday after next, even pro hace vice.
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Old 03-24-2008, 11:53 PM
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Awwww shucks!
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Old 03-25-2008, 12:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenas View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by victorbravo View Post

Thanks. I actually have a similar case heading for summary judgment hearing in a couple of weeks. This decision applies the same argument I'm using. I'll bring it up in oral argument.
I wanna help.
Yes, I hear you are a star at oral argument. It would be fun to have you. But it's already been briefed and I think it will be hard to get you admitted to the Washington bar by Friday after next, even pro hace vice.
C'mon, Vic! Surely you have some photocopies that could be made, or memos to be proofread!

After all, what are young associates for?
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Old 03-25-2008, 01:18 AM
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Quote:
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Joshua,

Our law doesn't function that way. Fortunately, the law protects the Church, for now, from being forced to violate it's own religious views and adopt the secular, which is what would happen were this court to hold otherwise. They would force the Seminary to abandon religious conviction and adopt secular religious views regarding women in teaching positions.

It's comming folks. Most assuredly.
Zenas,

Would this apply even in a case where the seminary / church under question were not a creature of the state? For example, if the seminary weren't organized under state law, would they be under the jurisdiction which they often find themselves under?

Adam
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Old 03-25-2008, 01:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenas View Post
Joshua,

Our law doesn't function that way. Fortunately, the law protects the Church, for now, from being forced to violate it's own religious views and adopt the secular, which is what would happen were this court to hold otherwise. They would force the Seminary to abandon religious conviction and adopt secular religious views regarding women in teaching positions.

It's comming folks. Most assuredly.
Zenas,

Would this apply even in a case where the seminary / church under question were not a creature of the state? For example, if the seminary weren't organized under state law, would they be under the jurisdiction which they often find themselves under?

Adam
Incorporation has nothing to do with control. That is something espoused by "the church must never incorporate" types. Think about it. Can the courts rule on partnerships? Of course. How about a foreign entity? Of course.

Law are applied outside of direct jurisdiction. The protection of the Church is to be found in the 1st Amendment, not in incorporation or jurisdictional theory.
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Old 03-25-2008, 07:57 AM
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This brings up another question.
If accreditors can accept and decline who they wish based on criteria that would be acceptable to the government (like a quota for women), would the seminary have the same "cajones" when faced with losing accreditation?
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Old 03-25-2008, 08:03 AM