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Originally Posted by joshua  The reason I ask this question is because, it seems, that the Apostles didn't go through a painstakingly laborious process in order to ascertain if one's profession of faith was "real" or not. Instead, the folks confessed faith, proclaimed repentance, and folks were baptized ... all within a small time frame. Consider the 3,000 baptized in one day (besides the mode/water arguments), it seems it would be quite difficult to interview/question these 3,000 as to the legitimacy of their confession. Furthermore, it seems that the Apostles, upon finding out they had (past tense) baptized an unregenerate, didn't lose sleep over it. However, I know that with many to whom I am close, they're very meticulous and careful about examining someone who has professed faith, so as to not baptize an unregenerate person. I don't see that kind of doubt, reluctance, or whatever you want to call it, called for by the Scriptures.
This, of course, is why I'm asking. Don't get me wrong, -I didn't put in the non-Debate forums, because I welcome the Paedos to interact as well- I have my own thoughts on the matter, but I'm not claiming perfection in my thoughts. |
QUOTE=joshua;428865]The reason I ask this question is because, it seems, that the Apostles didn't go through a painstakingly laborious process in order to ascertain if one's profession of faith was "real" or not. Instead, the folks confessed faith, proclaimed repentance, and folks were baptized ... all within a small time frame. Consider the 3,000 baptized in one day (besides the mode/water arguments), it seems it would be quite difficult to interview/question these 3,000 as to the legitimacy of their confession. Furthermore, it seems that the Apostles, upon finding out they had (past tense) baptized an unregenerate, didn't lose sleep over it. However, I know that with many to whom I am close, they're very meticulous and careful about examining someone who has professed faith, so as to not baptize an unregenerate person. I don't see that kind of doubt, reluctance, or whatever you want to call it, called for by the Scriptures.
This, of course, is why I'm asking. Don't get me wrong, -I didn't put in the non-Debate forums, because I welcome the Paedos to interact as well- I have my own thoughts on the matter, but I'm not claiming perfection in my thoughts.[/quote]
Joshua,
At first this seems to be hard to understand to us today,but I think any reflection on this and it becomes clearer and easier to understand.
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it seems, that the Apostles didn't go through a painstakingly laborious process in order to ascertain if one's profession of faith was "real" or not. Instead, the folks confessed faith, proclaimed repentance, and folks were baptized ... all within a small time frame.
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1] There was no Nt. church existing before pentecost. Apostolic preaching was attested to by God with signs and wonders accompanying the word preached 2Cor.12:12 Hebrews 2;1-4 Those who believed many times exhibited these sign gifts, so there was a ready acceptance of the profession.
2] The natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God 1Cor2;14
So as people Identified with the Saviour with believers baptism they were accepted.
Ananias was questioning whether or not to believe Paul's testimony,and confession of faith, but he was given special revelation by the Lord himself- in Acts 9;
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12And hath seen in a vision a man named Ananias coming in, and putting his hand on him, that he might receive his sight.
13Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he hath done to thy saints at Jerusalem:
14And here he hath authority from the chief priests to bind all that call on thy name.
15But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:
16For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name's sake.
17And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost.
18And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized
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We do not have these direct revelations and signs as they did before the canon was closed. It would be easier if we did, but that is not what the Lord has ordained.
---- As a Reformed Baptist, I note that Saul had already received the Ot sign, of circumcision, and yet He had not yet been indwelt by the Spirit until this encounter. After being quickened by the Spirit He identifies publicly with those who were in the Nt. Church . That identification was by believer's baptism, believe and be baptized.
In Acts 18:8 This pattern is spoken of once again with those in Crispus household
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8And Crispus, the chief ruler of the synagogue, believed on the Lord with all his house; and many of the Corinthians hearing believed, and were baptized.
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hearing, believed, and were baptized.
Then you have the same pattern with Apollos 18:25, and those disciples in 19:3 They had previously Identified with John's message by baptism, but now -
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1And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples,
2He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.
3And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.
4Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
5When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus
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3] In our day there are so many churches and cults,false and watered down gospels that seems prudent to take some time to see if someone understands the issues of sin and death,the cross and new life.
In Acts many times they went to the Jew first,who had been instructed in the scriptures to some extent already. In our day many from the nations have not been instructed in the scripture which implies some time being taken to begin to instruct and disciple the nations
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18And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
19Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
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4] There were some [ the remnant of jews who did believe in the covenant promises] who were a little slow to understand the certainty and finality of the once for all work of Christ - The whole book of Hebrews-
5] As the apostolic sign gifts were coming to a close,Those who publicly identified with the gospel by believer's baptism were subject to persecution. It cost them something
1Thess2;
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14For ye, brethren, became followers of the churches of God which in Judaea are in Christ Jesus: for ye also have suffered like things of your own countrymen, even as they have of the Jews:
15Who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to all men:
16Forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.
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The second part of your question was this;
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Furthermore, it seems that the Apostles, upon finding out they had (past tense) baptized an unregenerate, didn't lose sleep over it. However, I know that with many to whom I am close, they're very meticulous and careful about examining someone who has professed faith, so as to not baptize an unregenerate person. I don't see that kind of doubt, reluctance, or whatever you want to call it, called for by the Scriptures.
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As a local church all believer's desire to be faithful in their proclamation of the gospel. There are several marks of a church given church discipline being one of them. We are told,and warned of wolves among the sheep,false brethren.We are instructed to remove divisive ,contentious people.
False professor's take the Lord's name in vain. The reason to examine anyone is an attempt to be faithful to the Lord,and the soul seeking membership. It is not an exact science as we have this treasure in earthen vessels. This does not diminish our responsibility to obey what we see in scripture. We as saved sinner's, but sinners nevertheless speak out against sin on one hand, and yet we must battle in prayer, form the grace to mortify sin each day.
You would follow this process in your local assembly in regards to who takes the Lord's table,yes?
In light of RC error, the reformer's sought to be confessional and seek to draw this teaching out for us. As a Reformed Baptist I am thankful that they took this wise course of action. We might not follow the exact footprints of the first reformer's exactly- but our footprints are going in the same direction over-all. As we examine their steps we seek to ;
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21Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.
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Is there some inconsistency, yes there is. I do not participate in baby dedications. I am nervous when I see baptist parents anxious to baptise their offspring as soon as they can say Jesus. Many padeos speak of being able to trust in the objective "promise" of God. Baptist parents who force baptism for wrong reasons it seems to me doubt that the promise can happen in God's time. In other words both of these parents want to help the promise along,so to speak as if the water will somehow help the Spirit find the elect seed.
I think the Spirit moves and quickens who he will, when he wants to. That person will know a distictive difference in their heart and soul a have a growing understanding of these things. We are called to do our part before God in faithful living and instructing of the word, sowing to the Spirit reaping life.