Originally Posted by Davidius

But seriously, how much clearer could it be?? I don't see how the doctrine of election could possibly be more clearly spelled out. This is why I sometimes wonder whether "Arminians" who look this passage square in the face and deny God's sovereign power can actually be Christians, not because they deny Calvinism, but because they're basically rejecting the authority of scripture by denying the ridiculously clear and obvious meaning of the passage. They hate the reality of God's nature and refuse to acknowledge it. (I'm just throwing that out there as a thought I've had.)