03-15-2008, 11:59 AM
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| Puritanboard Doctor | | Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Saintfield, Co. Down, Northern Ireland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Contra_Mundum  Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Ritchie When Christ fed the 5000, the text only refers to the men (i.e. there were 5000 men, and the women and children); so it is conceivable that when Paul mentions a specific person being baptized, he means not only the individual, but also their family as well. | Why are you assuming there were many (any?) women and children in this passage? The translation "besides" women and children (Mt 14:21) is an gloss of "choris" (meaning separate, apart from), and is only telling us it was a crowd of about 5000 men, not that there was an accompanying crowd of the families. There is no reason whatever to assume that had there been significant numbers of women and children there, they would not have been included in the count. The fact that these were crowds (cf. Mt 15:38) of mainly (if not exclusively) grown males is the POINT of what is related.
So, DR, respectfully, I do not think this passage makes the point you wish it too. | "And those who ate were about five thousand men, besides women and children." Matthew 14:21. So there were women and children there but they were not included in the count of the 5000. Moreover, considering that the disciples got the food of a child - "There is a boy here who has five barley loaves and two fish, but what are they for so many?" (John 6:9) - would indicated that women and children were present.
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Daniel Ritchie
Saintfield, Northern Ireland - Queen's University, Belfast:History/Politics
Member of Dromara Reformed Presbyterian Church of Ireland (Covenanter)
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