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Originally Posted by Tom Bombadil  Quote:
Originally Posted by Vytautas
By Clarkian, I think you mean the claim that knowledge is comprised of the propositions of Scripture and their deductions. So you mean how do they know that all knowledge is Scripture and their implications. I guess they would point to passages that support that view (Job 38-41, Eccl. 1:14-18, 3:10-11, 7:23-29, 8:16-17, 11:1-6, Isa. 8:19-20, Matt. 16:17, 1 Cor. 1:18-31, 2:1-16, 3:18-20, Col 2:8, 1 Tim. 6:20, 2 Tim: 3:7, Jam 1:5), and show how all other claims to knowledge are illogical or fail in some way.
| I mean how do they know that they are scripturalists.
So, let's just say, for arguments sake, that you are correct about what those verses mean, that still doesn't tell me how they know that they are Clarkians. Where are the deductions? Are their names in the Bible? |
Again, why is self-identity important? Why must I know who am I in order to have knowledge? Scripturalism or Clarkianism is an idea not an idenity. Let’s see if the idea is true.
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Originally Posted by Tom Bombadil As far as those verses, surely you jest. I never even saw the word "deduction" in any of them.
Furthermore, "Scripture" isn't in most of them. And when it is, "all knowledge," "deduction" etc., aren't there. |
You are right, the words are not there. I just copied down the verses that a Scripturalist gave in favor of his position. Perhaps we can look at some of the verses to see if the idea of Clarkianism is there.
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Originally Posted by Tom Bombadil I mean seriously, when you come with verses like this:
Ecc. 3:10 I have seen the burden God has laid on men. 11 He has made everything beautiful in its time. He has also set eternity in the hearts of men; yet they cannot fathom what God has done from beginning to end.
as exegetical support of this position: "knowledge is comprised of the propositions of Scripture and their deductions." I can only let out a hearty gufaw. |
Men cannot fathom or find out the work God has done from beginning to end. The verse shows that man cannot obtain knowledge of the works of God which are creation and providence. So man cannot know anything of God’s world that he made. This undercuts all claims to knowledge unless God reveals knowledge to us.
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Originally Posted by Tom Bombadil Or take this one:
Matthew 16:17Jesus replied, "Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father in heaven.
The word "all" isn't in there. You're fallaciously going beyond the conclusion. That God revealed *ONE THING* to *Peter* doesn't logically imply that ALL THINGS must be revealed to ALL MEN in order for them to have knowledge.
Seriosuly, when I see stuff like this I get worried for the state of Christian philosophy and theology.
The same aplies to the rest of your proof texting. |
You are right; from this single verse you cannot deduce the universal statement. But from the verse we can gather that the way in which Peter got his knowledge was by revelation from God. It would seem that for us to know that Jesus is the Christ, God must reveal this to us as well. Jesus did not say to Peter, you got to your conclusion by empirical observation or by deducing it from non-scriptural premises or by a wild guess. Now do you believe that this verse is for us as well so that there is an application?
Note that I believe we can obtain knowledge from experience and deducing things from non-scriptural premises. I am just arguing what I think a Scriptualist might say, since I think there is some truth to their position, just not in their traditional formulations that I have looked at.