The PuritanBoard - View Single Post

Bibin · #15 (**permalink**) 04-25-2004, 04:11 PM

Bob, I'll attempt to let you know what Camping teaches:

[quote:ac06d41898]
Does he encourage Christians to leave the church and try and find one that hasn't apostacized, or does he just tell them to leave?
[/quote:ac06d41898]

Camping just tells them to leave.

[quote:ac06d41898]
If they are to leave and seek out people of like faith to fellowship with, is there any organization to the meetings? Do they use the NT guidelines (elders, deacons, etc) or is there some other way he recommends them to organize themselves?
[/quote:ac06d41898]

He does not suggest rules on organisation to the meetings. He says that one feature of a church is spiritual oversight by the elders - and that cannot be present in any future organised fellowhip for the 'abomination of desolation' sits in the holy place.

[quote:ac06d41898]
Does the Holy Spirit work in the hearts of men through the word when the gospel is proclaimed in the churches now?
[/quote:ac06d41898]

He says no but the HS works outside the local congregations.

[quote:ac06d41898]
This forum has a good percentage of people who are either pastors, or church elders, or people attending seminary to become one of these or perhaps a missionary. According to Harold Camping, should the pastors and elders just up and leave their churches and should the seminary students stop attending seminary and choose another occupation?
[/quote:ac06d41898]

As far as I understand, Camping asks all people in positions of 'spiritual oversight' to step down and fellowship as one. As far as missionaries go, he encourages it as "God is saving outside of the local congregations".
--

Paul said:

[quote:ac06d41898]

Here is a major refutation :

Eph 4 says that when the church reaches unity and becomes one then we will "not be carried around by false doctrine."

So, the fact that people in the "spiritual church" disagree on doctrine proves that Eph4 has not yet been fulfilled. So, debating whether or not Camping is correct proves that Camping is not correct!

[/quote:ac06d41898]

Considering the present condition of the churches, do you believe that the corporate churches will ever reach unity in doctrine?

No matter who claims to be in the 'spiritual church', won't its members always be united in doctrine - Isn't it the church of those saved by God? Isn't its very definition that of perfection?

[quote:ac06d41898]
Here is another one: Read Revelation 21-22 and see if Camping's view leads to the doctrine that we are in the New heavens and earth and Jesus has returned, and satan is in the lake of fire, and the resurrection has happened, and the judgment......wow! that's alot of doctrines
[/quote:ac06d41898]

I'm no biblical scholar but aren't these things supposed to take place AFTER the tribulation? How does this contradict Camping's teachings?

---

2 Qs need to be asked -

1) Does Scripture clearly point to an end of the corporate external representation of God's kingdom? If not now, does it speak of an end to come? The passages of 'falling away' come to mind (e.g. 2 Thess 2:3)

2) When it comes to the crunch, if Scriptures point to something your church doesn't, who will be your authority?

Also tell me one more thing, isn't the 'fleeing to Judea' passage that Camping uses speaking of Jerusalem's destruction in 70 A.D.? Is it justifiable to use it again for our time? Can historical events in the Bible be used to explain events in our time? When is it wrong & when is it right to do so?

[Edited on 4-25-2004 by Bibin]